Choosing Pocket Dimensions for New Table

[pw98]

BACKGROUND:

I currently have a 8.5 foot Gandy that is shimmed down from 5.0" corner pockets to 4.25" corner pockets using hard rubber shims, not rail extentions. It has a 0.5" difference between the front and the back of the pockets and a 0.75" shelf.. The side pockets are shimmed from like 5.75" to 4.75" with rubber shims as well.

This gandy is wayyyy too easy. Almost everything falls that hits the rail on the way in. Also balls that shot at the side pocket points at slower speeds tend to always fall and are NEVER ejected from the pocket regardless of speed (once they enter the pocket).

So I am having a new 8.5" table built because they will build the pockets to the dimensions besides the shelf depth which will be about 1.75" and comes cut from the slate factory so it can't be changed. I would get a used 8.5' table and have it modifed but its not easy to find a used 8.5" table around here (especally with a good shelf depth) Olhausen is the only company I've found which makes a true 8,5" table which is sold around here (Diamond and Rasson are both 90" not 92") plus these brands all cost thousands more. I think compared to what I have now (0.75") this (1.75" or greater) is an acceptable shelf depth.

I know I want 4.25" pockets because 4.5" pockets are just going to be too easy on an 8.5' table.

At one pool hall I play at there is a 9' red label Diamond with 4.5" pockets and 0.5" difference between front and back of pocket and it rejects a lot of garbage, shots down the rail, but not all. I assume if this 9' Diamond had 4.25" pockets instead it would reject a much greater percentage of shots down the rail that are not clean due to the deep shelf?

THE QUESTION:

Basically at this point I'm considering 4.25" corner pockets with 0.75" difference between front and back as well as 4.85" (4 7/8) side pockets. As already stated the shelf would be around 1.75" or greater.

What I'm worried about is once the cloth wears in that balls fired in at speed will be ejected even if they are hit cleanly. I want pockets that accept balls at speed but reject balls that hit the rail first (In most cases at least). So will the 0.75" difference be too much in this regard considering the pocket opening is so small? Should I go between the sizes at 0.625 (5/8ths). Or should I go with 0.5" because a shelf more than twice as deep as well as correctly extended rails makes that much of a difference in difficulty?.

At this point I'm very worried if I get 0.5" difference the table will basically be a tiny bit harder than the current table, which would really suck because a ton of money would be wasted for nothing. But at the same time I don't want a table that is so hard it rejects common position shots (that are hit cleanly) that you can make on a pool hall table (hit cleanly or not).

Also should I go with 5.0" side pockets because anything smaller is going to reject (most) shots at speed? For the side pockets I would get the WPA standard angles at this point.

As for down angles I'm considering 14.0 degrees because they are what Diamond supposedly uses and are supposedly part of the reason Diamond pockets play fair when hit in at speed.

 

[Lawnboy77]

I would post this question in the “Ask a Mechanic” sub forum. Those are the guys that know the facing angles for a given pocket size. When I’ve had rails done by these guys I just tell them what size corners I want. Everything else will be based on that dimension. It has worked well for me on two different rail sets.

 

[rexus31]

Corner pocket angle should be 141-142 degrees. Side pocket angle should be 102 degrees. Pocket down angle should be 13-15 degrees. You are most likely experiencing "easy" ball pocketing due to a shallow shelf. Also, your rubber may not be as lively as it should so the pocket may be playing a little dead which make the pockets more forgiving with balls that brush the rail. I'd think twice about a 1.75" shelf. Anything that brushes the rails before the corner pockets most likely will not fall unless hit very slow. Even then, they may not drop. A ball hit at pocket speed that brushes the rail should drop; hard hit balls that brush the rail should not. Why don't you get a 9' table?

I went with 4.125" corner pockets (141 degrees, 15 degree down angle) and 4.875" side pockets (102 degrees, 15 degree down angle) on my Gold Crown I. The corner pocket shelf depth is 1". Anything hit harder than pocket speed that brushes the rail before the pocket will not drop. The table plays tough but fair.

 

[td873]

If you play any straight pool, get 4.5". If you just play rotation and one pocket, 4.25 is fine. At 4.25, Diamonds play hard but do play fair. At 4.5" it'll still be challenging.

Also, what durometer rating do your shims have? Are they stapled in making them too solid? It sounds like they may the reason your table plays too easy. Properly shimmed 4.25 shouldn't be easy. You want the facings to be a little harder than the rails, but not solid.

-td

 

[bignick31985]

Had my GC 4 cut the same as rexus31 but went 4.5 (tight side of 4.5") and it plays plenty tough for me. Fair as said but still gotta hit them good.

Some days I go out there and think, "Man I'm slaying these racks, should've gone 4.25!"

Other days I think I should have put basketball goals in for pockets lol.