Ivory Ban Action Needed!

Dave38 · Jul 15, 2014

classiccues said:
You're right...

I prefer liberal femur inlays.

JV

Yeah, but those cues tend to shoot 'crooked' with WAY too much deflection.....

classiccues · Jul 15, 2014

Liberal femur ferrules LOVE chalk.....

Why?

Because its FREE....

JV

cueman · Jul 15, 2014

Thomas Wayne said:
"Hoodwinked"? Well, we know from past experience that anyone who disagrees with you is just plain wrong, but the market items made of or containing ivory is pursued by a customer base well in excess of one BILLION people. That would be one hell of a lot of hoodwinking, wouldn't you agree?

You say you're "not bashing anyone", but you implicitly characterize a craftsman using ivory as not caring about the customer's wants, and just being interested in "lining [his] pockets". Sounds like bashing to me. The truth is, MY customer base wants ivory - plain and simple.

I would guess that you think zero ivory consumption is "best for the planet". Clearly you are ignorant regarding what's really going on with this attempt to ban all use of ivory. The NGO's who have brainwashed you into think as you do generate HUNDREDS of MILLIONS of dollars promoting their misguided philosophies - this is a business for them, and a very lucrative one at that. They don't give a rat's ass if elephants survive, they're in it for the money.

Don't believe me? Here's a few facts for you:

1) In 2008 106 tons of elephant ivory were sold in a one-time auction by CITES.

2) Asian countries bought virtually all of that ivory, with the bulk of it going to China

3) Detailed studies by independent researchers conclude that in 2014 - 6 years after that one-time auction - the LEGAL Chinese carving markets are still working from that carefully monitored stockpile out of the 2008 auction.

4) The average price per pound of ivory in that auction was less than $80 usd - the reported price for poached illegal ivory is supposedly $1,300 to $1,500 usd per pound.

5) Significantly more than 100 tons of ivory falls to the African floor EVERY YEAR attached to elephants who have died from natural causes - this has been documented by the leading researchers in Africa (Phd - level scientists)

6) Ivory does not rot and is not biodegradable - in that respect it's worse than plastic drinking water bottles because a worldwide ban on ivory trade means it cannot be recycled.

7) So in one room we have a worldwide market that consumes far less than 100 tons of ivory per year - and that market will NOT go away. In another room we have 100+ tons of non-biodegradable ivory polluting the planet each year - and something must be done with that ivory, since it's not going away either.

It seem pretty clear that if we take the two issues described in #7 and simply put them in the same room we solve both problems - with the additional bonus of destroying the poaching and black market [in ivory] virtually overnight simply by exponentially undercutting the market price for raw ivory. All without a single elephant being deliberately killed for its ivory.

If you're as smart as you obviously think you are you may want to ponder these facts a bit and then ask what is "best for the planet"...

TW

Thomas made an excellent point. I did not know there was that much Ivory from natural deaths of elephants every year. So that is another type of Ivory that should be allowed to go to open market. I like to use moose antlers that were sheds instead of the moose being hunted if given a choice. But I also understand the Moose also has few natural predators and must be hunted some also to keep a substainable healthy moose population.

Joe Barringer · Jul 16, 2014

cueman said:
Thomas made an excellent point. I did not know there was that much Ivory from natural deaths of elephants every year. So that is another type of Ivory that should be allowed to go to open market. I like to use moose antlers that were sheds instead of the moose being hunted if given a choice. But I also understand the Moose also has few natural predators and must be hunted some also to keep a substainable healthy moose population.

We could all talk till we're blue in the face regarding the logic, benefits of culling, natural deaths and the trampling of innocent villages in Africa but...

The anti ivory forces don't and won't buy into any of it it and you cannot convince them otherwise. They've been convinced that the ivory ferrule on your cue caused the death of an innocent elephant. We get hate email and phone calls about our ivory web site almost on a daily basis and for the most part we're dealing with low information people. It's unfortunate but the masses in many cases allow themselves to become brainwashed. Remember, the masses will believe a big lie more easily than a small lie. And the big lie is that the legal pre ban ivory trade is causing the deaths of current elephant populations.

As an aside, if you go to the Clinton Foundation, you'll notice that their number one function is donations. There is a 'Ways To Give' link which includes no less than 7 methods for you to part with your hard earned money. Additionally, there is one further link which you can 'View All Ways To Give' within the 'Ways To Give' link. Now, if you look further on their homepage, you'll then see a large blue 'DONATE' button for those who missed the 'Ways To Give' or the 'View All Ways To Give' links.

You can't make this stuff up but if you click on the 'Get Involved' Link, you'll notice that the very first link is, you guessed it, 'DONATE'!

I've never witnessed any charitable organization who was so blatant about donations. My whole point is that all the misinformation is driven by organizations who derive funding, salaries and benefits from this misinformation.

If you look at their Board of Directors and their Leadership Team, one no longer has to wonder after all these salaries (we realize some may be donating their time), why there are no fewer than 10 ways to donate.

In conclusion, what percentage of donations actually goes into the field? From what we understand it's around 88% or so they state but according to some and due to the Clinton Foundations fuzzy math, that percentage cannot be determined. Surprise!

Bottom-line - as long as people and organizations provide the misinformation there will be people who donate to these causes and unfortunately the lemmings who follow along.

Oh and I also want to add that we're sure the Clinton Foundation does provide some useful services.

Mr Nobody · Jul 19, 2014

Cueman wrote [/QUOTE] "I understand you care not for the inlay art value in cues. That is fine. But I also guess you have never used Ivory as a material to work with. It is different than any other material and nothing else works and looks exactly like it".

I guess Cueman has never worked with American Holly , It looks more like ivory than ivory , and has been used as a substitute inlay for many years . You should at least know the truth , somewhat , before you guess, because you guess wrong . Ivory will check , sooner or later , meaning it is not a stable material to use , especially at the joint , butt cap , or ferrule ... I guess you still use the excuse of your daughter made the selection for selling unsatisfactory wood . Excuses never get the job done !!! Not your enemy , not your friend ... Just my opinion ...

cueaddicts · Jul 19, 2014

Mr Nobody said:
Cueman wrote