Removing GC2 Formica On Rails

sneaky_pete

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I'm trying to weigh my options on whether or not I want to try and tackle removing the old formica on the top of my rails to refresh my table. How crazy is the old school glue holding it on. Will a heat gun and some lacquer thinner get it off relatively easy? I work in a huge cabinet shop that specializes in HPL cabinetry so I've got plenty of skilled laminaters that can redo it once the old stuff is removed but just worried about getting into it and regretting my decision lol, once you start you gotta take it all the way.
 
I'm trying to weigh my options on whether or not I want to try and tackle removing the old formica on the top of my rails to refresh my table. How crazy is the old school glue holding it on. Will a heat gun and some lacquer thinner get it off relatively easy? I work in a huge cabinet shop that specializes in HPL cabinetry so I've got plenty of skilled laminaters that can redo it once the old stuff is removed but just worried about getting into it and regretting my decision lol, once you start you gotta take it all the way.

I prepped and painted my gci. I wasn't looking for the traditional look, so I used automotive metallic gray and burnt copper. I clear coated the rails and skirts. It's holding up very well.
IMG_0228 Copy.jpeg
 
I did think about painting as well. You just sand some then prime, paint and clear?

Basically, yes. Like everything, the devil is in the details.

Scuff the surface, fill any damage, prep for primer, spray primer. Prep primer for paint, spray paint and clear. Cut and buff clear, polish, wax.

It is the same as painting a car.
 
Im pretty familiar with cabinetry too but the thing with the GC rails. I believe they are made similar to a typical countertop with a curved backplash. I think they used a mold to hold the formica and then with heat and pressure formed the particleboard rail. the bonding of the rail, I imagine as part of that original molding process. its similar if a shop were to make a countertop with a particleboard backsplash wiht it's typical curvature. a cabinet shop wouldnt own that sort of specialied press so they may buy that sort of countertop.



the problem , as I see it is that it is curved and so you might use something like a hydraulic clamp to hold your Formica to the surface , but it will wan to spring towards being flat without heat being used to keep that curved form to the formica, otherwise you are basically expecting the glue to forever hold the pressure of the Formica wanting to return to its flattened position.

if you used a thick veneer and not formica that may work , If you were to make a formed curved mold and heat he formica up to try to make it permanently accept the bend , that may help. If it were wood it may be happy enough to be bending across its grain. you could remove the formica and replace it with a thick rosewood veneer? black walnut maybe?

if you were to use the wrong paint then it may not stick or it may wear though, I'd think about something like imron epoxy paint. and sand the formica to get enough hook that the paint sticks, after that maybe auto paint with a clearcoat. epoxy will not stick well to many plastics, especially if they are smooth, It might stick if you were to say roughly sand it with 120 or so.

I believe the sides are flatter and this would present less of a problem, I think I'd just save the old ones and maybe just try to recreate those using the OEM ones as a pattern. maybe use decent plywood and a nice veneer or similar.
I have a cheaper 1970 4x8 made by brunswick , I was thinking of doing similar. painting the rails re creating the side pieces..
Im not sure Illl use it, maybe donate it to some one.. or I had an idea ot use it's slate to trim out my fireplace ;-)

you can get thin plywood with all it's laminates running the same direction , Normal plywood has its plys in alternating directions. that stuff can be bent conical like a pipe to about a 6" diameter.. Its kind of interesting, I believe it's called "rubber"

if you wanted to put a bend in particleboard you might try a mold and experiment heating it, you may find you cna instill a permanent bend. I dont think I'd rely on glue to keep that sort of form permanently because although you may be able to form the curvature and use glue to hold it, the stress will always be there and I think it will win over the glue bond eventually. I think heat needs to be used to remove that stress and make the Formica "want" to lie with a curvature.

laquer is pretty good at sticking to anything, that might help, it has less cratch resistance than formica. I have a little brunswich with wood rails and I re laquered it, used a toner than clear lacquer.. the rest of it has OEM laquer , and it wasmade in about 1964, the laquer finsh is otherwise wearing very well. you can get laquer in any color, its easy to spray, smells a but that dissipates fast.
laquer is different from other coatings in that it melts into itself, becomes part of it's underlying layers. car paint or epoxy does not, that sticks by it's "hook" alcohol spills do wreck laquer jobs, same with shellac. epoxy is very tough.
 
We've done plenty of curved laminating at work, the top of the rails is a pretty gentle radius, sticking should not pose an issue. I would have figured that the rail core would be solid hardwood but I'm not sure, could be PB. I'm still not sure I want to tackle this but just trying to gain some first hand feedback of people that have attempted it.
 
Looks like mixed feedback in this thread. One successfully used a heat gun, one a belt sander and one a power planer. The rail core is wood, looks like maybe poplar.
 
With the GC2 Formica / Laminate.
You simply can't heat the Formica and peel it off unfortunately. With the GC3's yes you can.
With the GC1 and 2 they used some kind of really really strong glue so you have to sand it off.
There is a thread somewhere on here on how to get a machine to slowly sand down the Formica.
I simply used a belt sander to rip it off. It's the worst job you could wish for.
I've replaced the Formica on my GC'S every time I have a GC.
You set everything up then spray contact adhesive to both the rail and the Formica.
The 1st pic is the Formica sitting above the rail with dowel rods to stop it from touching the rail this is so you can line every thing up before you push the Formica down to the rail.
Simply remove the middle dowel and work the Formica to the rail then work your way to the ends.
It's pretty easy when you get used to it. The 2nd pic is rolling the Formica all over to get good adhesion. You can use a rag and your hands if you don't have a roller.
You then have to trim everything off at the edges to duplicate the original fitting of the Formica.
Hope it helps
 

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Im pretty familiar with cabinetry too but the thing with the GC rails. I believe they are made similar to a typical countertop with a curved backplash. I think they used a mold to hold the formica and then with heat and pressure formed the particleboard rail. the bonding of the rail, I imagine as part of that original molding process. its similar if a shop were to make a countertop with a particleboard backsplash wiht it's typical curvature. a cabinet shop wouldnt own that sort of specialied press so they may buy that sort of countertop.



the problem , as I see it is that it is curved and so you might use something like a hydraulic clamp to hold your Formica to the surface , but it will wan to spring towards being flat without heat being used to keep that curved form to the formica, otherwise you are basically expecting the glue to forever hold the pressure of the Formica wanting to return to its flattened position.

if you used a thick veneer and not formica that may work , If you were to make a formed curved mold and heat he formica up to try to make it permanently accept the bend , that may help. If it were wood it may be happy enough to be bending across its grain. you could remove the formica and replace it with a thick rosewood veneer? black walnut maybe?

if you were to use the wrong paint then it may not stick or it may wear though, I'd think about something like imron epoxy paint. and sand the formica to get enough hook that the paint sticks, after that maybe auto paint with a clearcoat. epoxy will not stick well to many plastics, especially if they are smooth, It might stick if you were to say roughly sand it with 120 or so.

I believe the sides are flatter and this would present less of a problem, I think I'd just save the old ones and maybe just try to recreate those using the OEM ones as a pattern. maybe use decent plywood and a nice veneer or similar.
I have a cheaper 1970 4x8 made by brunswick , I was thinking of doing similar. painting the rails re creating the side pieces..
Im not sure Illl use it, maybe donate it to some one.. or I had an idea ot use it's slate to trim out my fireplace ;-)

you can get thin plywood with all it's laminates running the same direction , Normal plywood has its plys in alternating directions. that stuff can be bent conical like a pipe to about a 6" diameter.. Its kind of interesting, I believe it's called "rubber"

if you wanted to put a bend in particleboard you might try a mold and experiment heating it, you may find you cna instill a permanent bend. I dont think I'd rely on glue to keep that sort of form permanently because although you may be able to form the curvature and use glue to hold it, the stress will always be there and I think it will win over the glue bond eventually. I think heat needs to be used to remove that stress and make the Formica "want" to lie with a curvature.

laquer is pretty good at sticking to anything, that might help, it has less cratch resistance than formica. I have a little brunswich with wood rails and I re laquered it, used a toner than clear lacquer.. the rest of it has OEM laquer , and it wasmade in about 1964, the laquer finsh is otherwise wearing very well. you can get laquer in any color, its easy to spray, smells a but that dissipates fast.
laquer is different from other coatings in that it melts into itself, becomes part of it's underlying layers. car paint or epoxy does not, that sticks by it's "hook" alcohol spills do wreck laquer jobs, same with shellac. epoxy is very tough.
Looks like mixed feedback in this thread. One successfully used a heat gun, one a belt sander and one a power planer. The rail core is wood, looks like maybe poplar.
Gold Crown rails are poplar, not particle board.
 
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With the GC2 Formica / Laminate.
You simply can't heat the Formica and peel it off unfortunately. With the GC3's yes you can.
With the GC1 and 2 they used some kind of really really strong glue so you have to sand it off.
There is a thread somewhere on here on how to get a machine to slowly sand down the Formica.
I simply used a belt sander to rip it off. It's the worst job you could wish for.
I've replaced the Formica on my GC'S every time I have a GC.
You set everything up then spray contact adhesive to both the rail and the Formica.
The 1st pic is the Formica sitting above the rail with dowel rods to stop it from touching the rail this is so you can line every thing up before you push the Formica down to the rail.
Simply remove the middle dowel and work the Formica to the rail then work your way to the ends.
It's pretty easy when you get used to it. The 2nd pic is rolling the Formica all over to get good adhesion. You can use a rag and your hands if you don't have a roller.
You then have to trim everything off at the edges to duplicate the original fitting of the Formica.
Hope it helps

Great write-up!

Have you ever tried slats from window blinds instead of dowels for holding the Formica up when gluing? It's what my old man uses, they're cheap, easy to cut to whatever length, reusable, and easy to stack and store.
 
I use strips of electrical wire, like house wiring, with the insulation on. same idea,
if the rail has too much curvature for the formica to want to bend and stay that way, maybe you can find thinner Formica than that normally used on countertops? maybe some slight relief cuts can be made into the backside.. I'm talking about a series of very light cuts cuts of about .020" or so into the backside.. that will weaken it a little and probably allow easier bending..
 
I use strips of electrical wire, like house wiring, with the insulation on. same idea,
if the rail has too much curvature for the formica to want to bend and stay that way, maybe you can find thinner Formica than that normally used on countertops? maybe some slight relief cuts can be made into the backside.. I'm talking about a series of very light cuts cuts of about .020" or so into the backside.. that will weaken it a little and probably allow easier bending..
Have you played on a Gold Crown? The curve is very slight. Laminate can most certainly adhere to the curvature so long as a quality adhesive is used.
 
I use strips of electrical wire, like house wiring, with the insulation on. same idea,
if the rail has too much curvature for the formica to want to bend and stay that way, maybe you can find thinner Formica than that normally used on countertops? maybe some slight relief cuts can be made into the backside.. I'm talking about a series of very light cuts cuts of about .020" or so into the backside.. that will weaken it a little and probably allow easier bending..

Vertical grade laminate is the same as the countertop laminate, but thinner.

That said, as @rexus31 noted, cold forming hpdl on gc rails shouldn't be a problem.

I would use the thickest I could. One of the NEMA ratings for laminate is a 'ball drop test'. Horizontal requirements are about twice what vertical requirements are.

Speaking of the ball impact, I am amazed that my paint has held up to the random cueball landing on the rail.
 
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