Perfect aim - review
- Thread starter Patrick Johnson
- Start date
- Status
The dvd does not have closed captioning. I don't want to speak for Gene, but I would bet that if you had a hearing problem and bought the dvd he would work with you any way he could to help communicate the information to you.
I say that is a great review. If the DVD contains that information, it isn't new or his! We have hundreds of pages on lapping and edge aiming.
Glad to see someone type with their balls instead of trying to aim them for a change! I can't rep you yet, but I will.
Glad to see someone type with their balls instead of trying to aim them for a change! I can't rep you yet, but I will.
Who are you calling a nuthugger?!?
I purchased gene's dvd(did you?),watched,formed my own opinion & placed it with all the other items I have that I can't quite bring myself to throw out.
I didn't interject my opinion in any of the other threads where Gene peddles his video & where if anyone questions his vague answers as to the content, they are immediatly besiege by the geno army.
With that said the op posted an opinion I happen to agree 100% with & I stated that plainly.
I have never even posted in the same thread as jp,you may take the time to research this statment if you wish.
After reading this thread & the other one that was started in the main forum once the mods moved the original Perfect Aim thread
, it seems maybe you could be refered to as a "nuthugger.Jim
How can you think that's a great review--- and then continue to say "IF THE DVD CONTAINS THAT...."
??????
THAT'S what I'm talking about.
If I reviewed a night out with someone's mom and told the world she had the best tits in the world...when in fact she had a mastectomy, would my review still be great???
I feel like I'm on Candid Camera--- some of these posts are surreal.
Ok Ok Ok. Hold on just a sec.
First off, i like you. Always have actually.
BUT, weren't you the one who came on here and posted something about chucking your cue during a shot?
Yet in my ENTIRE pool career, i have never, as in, NEVER EVER Seen any professional pool player, Open player, shortstop, or tomato can/rail tester, chuck their cue intentionally during a shot..
Yet when i argued as others did, that it was completely ridiculous to propose this, you defended it.
AND, we agreed that you would post up a video of you doing a table length draw shot to better convince me that the technique was indeed valid and sound, and help me gauge the practical application of throwing a cue during a shot.
Considering that you still have yet to post a video of you chucking the cue and doing a table length draw shot, and the fact that i happen to think that the chucking of ones cue has NO application in the world of pool as we know it other then something you might see on Trick Shot Magic, why would anyone believe your opinion when it comes to systems or your criticism of anyone else who has systems or knocks systems?
Seriously. It's not like you've been a saint whenever there was a CTE aim thread.
As far as i'm concerned, you might know your systems, but the fact that you are the one who would advise people to chuck their cue during a shot, completely undermines any valid critique you might give on other systems.
Seriously, i had given thought to CTE, but when you clung to that chucking of the cue style, i completely bailed on it, and never thought of it as a valid option from that point on.
Bottom line is that if the DVD WEREN'T $80 bucks, and were something more reasonable like $29, Id be willing to bet that NO ONE would be complaining cause even if they didn't agree with it, they wouldn't feel as if they got bent over and totally violated.
When you put together the fact that it's an $80 DVD, and that Gene, nice guy or not, used EVER SINGLE OPPORTUNITY to come on this forum and pimp out his product ad nauseum and refused to give any direct answers regarding the content, it IS perfectly understandable why the review happened.
Seriously, for every single person who loves the ideas presented on the DVD, i can guarantee you that there are people who think the DVD constitutes FRAUD.
You might say that PJ had some preconceived ulterior motive, but based on your response, and the fact that you are also a system head who gets it on with other system heads, i would think that in regards to PJ, you ALSO had some preconceived retaliation should certain people get out of line with what you feel is right. As is clearly demonstrated in this thread.
If you are entitled to promote your chucking of the cue, then people are certainly entitled to not believe it, and if you stuck your chucking of the cue on DVD and charged a lung for it, i'm sure that people would be appreciative if someone came out and said that it was the most ridiculous thing they had ever seen.
For everyone that thinks Geno should sue PJ, i'm sure that there are people who feel like they got ripped off and want to sue Geno, and THAT's the truth of the matter.
Perfect Aim
Good point Mr. Stuckart! I would like to talk with Gene to better understand his aiming technique. I bought his DVD! This is only my opinion, but my first viewing left me dissapointed. I followed the threads on his "Perfect Aiming System". Almost all of what I read was pretty positive. Some said "it was eye opening". So, I veiwed it a few more times, and I'm not getting it yet. I would like to say this system was worth what I paid for it, so as a last effort, maybe Gene can talk me through my lack of understanding. Does anyone have a number for Gene handy?
I think this has been a good thread. I don't know if legal lines were crossed by the original review. I just know how I felt when I watched it. :smile:
Good point Mr. Stuckart! I would like to talk with Gene to better understand his aiming technique. I bought his DVD! This is only my opinion, but my first viewing left me dissapointed. I followed the threads on his "Perfect Aiming System". Almost all of what I read was pretty positive. Some said "it was eye opening". So, I veiwed it a few more times, and I'm not getting it yet. I would like to say this system was worth what I paid for it, so as a last effort, maybe Gene can talk me through my lack of understanding. Does anyone have a number for Gene handy?
I think this has been a good thread. I don't know if legal lines were crossed by the original review. I just know how I felt when I watched it. :smile:
I learned that technique from Nick Mannino who is more than a short stop. I think he was the guy Earl ran the 11 on to win the mil - so he was a tour player. He learned it from Gene Nagy who was a 400 ball runner. In that one video, I drew the ball straight back into the pocket I was standing at with conviction. If I stroked harder and setup the shot slightly crooked so I'd hit the rail, I could've sucked it back to the rail and it'd continue back up table. It IS unconventional and not widely known, but it's legit. Strange and alien-- but legit.
So, I'm not a system head. I do, however, believe in systems that work and are applicable to your game. When you kick, you likely use a system - so why not with aiming.
I actually never posted a video on drawing the cue while throwing it because on my 1st or 2nd attempt, my Moori tip blew up on me and I only had 1 shaft at the time. By the time I got it re-tipped, I lost interest. If I recall, you live on the east coast---- so I have no prob showing you in person at the Expo. I also have no prob showing you why you prob need to know CTE in person. The only prob I have is I attract a mob of 1000 people as soon as I start discussing my info in a public forum.... so we might have to stand on the table.
Last edited:
Gotta say this was one of the funniest things I've seen. Good job if you were involved in it! Check it out for a good laugh everyone reading this thread. (the large text piith is a link)
it's one thing to give a negative review about a product, but what PJ did was wrong on so many levels.
I want to point out something here, when I saw PJ was the one doing the review I KNEW it was going to be negative even before i read it. WHY, because PJ never has anything nice to say about anything. I mean really, he knocks any and everything no matter what it is. It's so old.
It also seems to me that most people are all bent over the price of the product. I to be honest i'm sick and tired of that. People all them time buy books, take lessons, buy DVD's and for some reason if they spend 25 on something and don't like it that say O'well, it was only 25. But if they spend 80 and don't like it they act like the fukn world is ending. Really? Please!
Now anything you buy to help you with playing pool all the way down to cooking may or may not be new information to you, but no matter how good of a cook or pool player can take something positive away from anything.
Now i watched Gene's DVD, and to be honest i found it very helpful to see certain shots. What Gene's DVD the end all of end alls for me, nope, but it defiantly another piece of the puzzle. I have take lessons from RandyG, Ron Vetello, Stan Shuffett, read many many books, watched plenty of DVD's and i've taken something from each. Not one of these are my end all, but together my game is has take off. In fact i've won three local tournys in a row for the first time ever.
Now Gene must have spoke with many great pool players and found that his approach is different and he must have been told to write it down or make a video. So he did, I applaud Gene for that.
I want to point out something here, when I saw PJ was the one doing the review I KNEW it was going to be negative even before i read it. WHY, because PJ never has anything nice to say about anything. I mean really, he knocks any and everything no matter what it is. It's so old.
It also seems to me that most people are all bent over the price of the product. I to be honest i'm sick and tired of that. People all them time buy books, take lessons, buy DVD's and for some reason if they spend 25 on something and don't like it that say O'well, it was only 25. But if they spend 80 and don't like it they act like the fukn world is ending. Really? Please!
Now anything you buy to help you with playing pool all the way down to cooking may or may not be new information to you, but no matter how good of a cook or pool player can take something positive away from anything.
Now i watched Gene's DVD, and to be honest i found it very helpful to see certain shots. What Gene's DVD the end all of end alls for me, nope, but it defiantly another piece of the puzzle. I have take lessons from RandyG, Ron Vetello, Stan Shuffett, read many many books, watched plenty of DVD's and i've taken something from each. Not one of these are my end all, but together my game is has take off. In fact i've won three local tournys in a row for the first time ever.
Now Gene must have spoke with many great pool players and found that his approach is different and he must have been told to write it down or make a video. So he did, I applaud Gene for that.
I agree. I got a pretty good laugh out of that video. They made is seem so easy, and they used the "kiss" mentality (keep is simple stupid):wink:
Get your drift, Did PJ try it at a table for a decent amount of time, did PJ call Gene to make sure he understood everything, getting my drift? Its good info!!!!
CB,
Why don't you give the man the benefit of the doubt. He did a fair review. Give PJ the intellectual integrity to possibly be right. Most of his critique was based on value and production qualities.
We all have members here we don't care for. Me and Spidey are on opposite spectrums of our believes. I don't care for his methods but enjoy his passion. Therefore when he starts to go off on CTH or throwing his cue it's all I can do not to tune out. Nevertheless I read and do my best to comprehend the data he is putting forward.
I almost never disagree with PJ. This is no different. I played the DVD twice and it's exactly as PJ described. I would go further but my copyright lawyer suggested I stop.
Why don't you give the man the benefit of the doubt. He did a fair review. Give PJ the intellectual integrity to possibly be right. Most of his critique was based on value and production qualities.
We all have members here we don't care for. Me and Spidey are on opposite spectrums of our believes. I don't care for his methods but enjoy his passion. Therefore when he starts to go off on CTH or throwing his cue it's all I can do not to tune out. Nevertheless I read and do my best to comprehend the data he is putting forward.
I almost never disagree with PJ. This is no different. I played the DVD twice and it's exactly as PJ described. I would go further but my copyright lawyer suggested I stop.
So 3 people in the pool playing world believe in it?
Everyone else doesn't.
Would you fault anyone who doesn't happen to believe in it?
A players talent has no bearing on poor decision making, and if they chucked a cue during their careers during competition with another player, that would be on par with losing ones mind at the table.
Now when i see every single solitary person on the planet who plays good pool, chucking their cue all the time on every shot, THEN, i would think that you were on to something, and would then be able to praise the cue chucking advocates as regular minded people.
With that, as i said before, if you charged a lot of money for the cue chucking knowledge, i'm sure you would have some detractors. Especially if it were overpriced knowledge.
As such, people are perfectly entitled to give opinions.
In regards to the DVD, you already have tons of people who are advocates for it. And I don't think PJ's post is entirely out of line as i know people who freely give this information out just like other pool knowledge, and i hardly think Geno was the first person to ever discover it, but he is the first person to stick it in a package and charge $80 bucks for it.
I'm sure a lot of people would feel violated if they spent money on the DVD, and could have received the same info from some local shortstop who happened to know it, for free.
Just cause Geno made a DVD about it, doesn't mean he is the first pool player to understand the concept he presents.
As such, i would think that with PJ, you are conditioned enough to be on autoflame mode, regardless of what he says.
Believe me, people aren't pissed about the info. They are pissed at the ridiculous price that the info costs.
As such, i remember when a buddy of mine called me up and was raving about how awesome the DVD was, and how it would revolutionize my game, and how they wanted to sell it to me for $60.
I INSTANTLY took this as the "they bought it, and wanted to try and recoup as much money off of it cause they feel as thought it was not worth it." sales pitch, and i laughed at them.
Finally, after they got the point that i wasn't going to buy it from them, we had a discussion about it, and i kind of already knew what they were talking about and how FOR ME, the theory behind it had some merit to it, and we discussed the reasons why, and it's application.
But had i been interested, and bought the DVD from Geno for $80 bucks, when it was something i already knew, but i didn't know that cause he would never give me a straight answer, i would be livid, and i would feel like i bought some snake oil.
Plus as far as i'm concerned, the way Geno approached his sales tactics, and how it was always one novel after another in his posts. It would be naive to think this thread wasn't bound to happen.
I can understand someone promoting something they are selling, but sometimes, it's just way over the top.
No one likes a pushy salesman.
price point
Listen, it is really easy. I don't want to spend 40K for a new car, so I am not going to go buy a Lexus. That is MY DECISION. In fact, I could even say that I think that 40K is too much for a car. That is my OPINION. But to act like Lexus is somehow a scam, and that others should be warned, and that they are outrageous for selling a car for 40K, and take personal offense, and campaign against them for that reason? That is just CRAZY! (By the way, even though I don't buy 40K cars, I understand that some people do, that is just a difference of values and finances.)
OK, now some people will say that Lexus delivers what they said they will- a finished product. This is the tricky part- some people (including me) felt that it was worth it to get this DVD. Others didn't, for whatever reasons.
So, to say that you regret spending $80 for the DVD, and that you feel it wasn't worth it, fine, no problem. To say that $80 is more than you would ever spend for a DVD, fine, no problem. But to say that it is a rip off and that there is no valuable information in the DVD, that is just not true. I paid the $80 and am satisfied with the trade off, and I am certainly not alone.
So please, if you don't want to spend $80 on your pool game or don't feel that you have anything to learn about sighting, FINE, but once and for all would you just move on then? Or do you picket Lexus's manufacturing plants because you don't like the way they price their cars?
Listen, it is really easy. I don't want to spend 40K for a new car, so I am not going to go buy a Lexus. That is MY DECISION. In fact, I could even say that I think that 40K is too much for a car. That is my OPINION. But to act like Lexus is somehow a scam, and that others should be warned, and that they are outrageous for selling a car for 40K, and take personal offense, and campaign against them for that reason? That is just CRAZY! (By the way, even though I don't buy 40K cars, I understand that some people do, that is just a difference of values and finances.)
OK, now some people will say that Lexus delivers what they said they will- a finished product. This is the tricky part- some people (including me) felt that it was worth it to get this DVD. Others didn't, for whatever reasons.
So, to say that you regret spending $80 for the DVD, and that you feel it wasn't worth it, fine, no problem. To say that $80 is more than you would ever spend for a DVD, fine, no problem. But to say that it is a rip off and that there is no valuable information in the DVD, that is just not true. I paid the $80 and am satisfied with the trade off, and I am certainly not alone.
So please, if you don't want to spend $80 on your pool game or don't feel that you have anything to learn about sighting, FINE, but once and for all would you just move on then? Or do you picket Lexus's manufacturing plants because you don't like the way they price their cars?
Wow. I was playing in a tournament today and look what I missed. I would like to make a couple points (just my opinion) and then I'm off on a business trip so I will not be able to respond, sorry.
I not only bought the dvd, but I had Gene over to the house for a home cooked meal while he was on the road and took a lesson from him. And personally I thought it was worth it, and I enjoyed Gene's company.
A little background: I am a pretty good player with a background in 3-cushion, where I learned many systems. When I was feeling good at the table and seeing the shots in 3-cushion, I used the systems only when necessary for specific shots. However, when I was not "feeling" it at the table and was unable to "see" shots clearly, it was great to have these systems in my tool kit so I can still know what I need to do even if it wasn't feeling naturally. I have been searching for something like my 3-cushion systems for pool playing.
Heck, when we are all seeing the balls and feeling good, systems are not even necessary for the most part for pocketing balls. But what about those times where your not feeling it like I described above? What if you're tied, out of stroke, under pressure or doing something wrong in your stroke and can't determine what it is? You might consciously keep your head still, follow through a little longer, stay down, whatever...Well, Gene gives you something else to double check, your head position for aiming correctly.
Even though I knew much of what Gene was teaching, I never knew, or even thought to think about, how to calibrate my head position for sighting before. Now I do (if I ever practice it enough). Wherever your eyes fall naturally, I can find that same point now if needed. For me, this is BIG and that little piece of information is worth the price of the lesson.
Patrick did make some interesting points in his review, but it seemed he got bogged down in the details and missed what's really important...the creation of a conscious index (ground zero if you will) for us to get feeling good again so we can concentrate on playing winning pool. The review was details without the meaning, in my opinion. I did think it odd that a review was written about a dvd he did not purchase or get a copy from the author.
I have no affiliation w/Gene or his product but details sometimes have a way of getting in the way of the true value of information. Spidey Dave has found other gems from the information that he has incorporated in his game and I believe many of you will find something, too, if you are open to learning. Learn what is offered to you in the dvd and Gene's personal calls and make it your own. We should all never stop trying to learn - just incorporate the new info into your game so it becomes natural to you. We are not robots, everyone will probably get somethign different out it. What Gene sell it for is his business, it's our choice whether or not you want to buy it.
I'm done now. I had no intetion of writing so much, sorry.
Dave
I not only bought the dvd, but I had Gene over to the house for a home cooked meal while he was on the road and took a lesson from him. And personally I thought it was worth it, and I enjoyed Gene's company.
A little background: I am a pretty good player with a background in 3-cushion, where I learned many systems. When I was feeling good at the table and seeing the shots in 3-cushion, I used the systems only when necessary for specific shots. However, when I was not "feeling" it at the table and was unable to "see" shots clearly, it was great to have these systems in my tool kit so I can still know what I need to do even if it wasn't feeling naturally. I have been searching for something like my 3-cushion systems for pool playing.
Heck, when we are all seeing the balls and feeling good, systems are not even necessary for the most part for pocketing balls. But what about those times where your not feeling it like I described above? What if you're tied, out of stroke, under pressure or doing something wrong in your stroke and can't determine what it is? You might consciously keep your head still, follow through a little longer, stay down, whatever...Well, Gene gives you something else to double check, your head position for aiming correctly.
Even though I knew much of what Gene was teaching, I never knew, or even thought to think about, how to calibrate my head position for sighting before. Now I do (if I ever practice it enough
). Wherever your eyes fall naturally, I can find that same point now if needed. For me, this is BIG and that little piece of information is worth the price of the lesson. Patrick did make some interesting points in his review, but it seemed he got bogged down in the details and missed what's really important...the creation of a conscious index (ground zero if you will) for us to get feeling good again so we can concentrate on playing winning pool. The review was details without the meaning, in my opinion. I did think it odd that a review was written about a dvd he did not purchase or get a copy from the author.
I have no affiliation w/Gene or his product but details sometimes have a way of getting in the way of the true value of information. Spidey Dave has found other gems from the information that he has incorporated in his game and I believe many of you will find something, too, if you are open to learning. Learn what is offered to you in the dvd and Gene's personal calls and make it your own. We should all never stop trying to learn - just incorporate the new info into your game so it becomes natural to you. We are not robots, everyone will probably get somethign different out it. What Gene sell it for is his business, it's our choice whether or not you want to buy it.
I'm done now
. I had no intetion of writing so much, sorry.Dave
Last edited:
Sorry, a bit long
I will say one thing.
It seems that there are enough people on both sides of the coin.
I do not think PJ was wrong. There have been a number of people who said that they bought the dvd and felt exactly the same way, so it is NOT an isolated opinion. I feel that there is merit to his opinion, and is based on something other than just his wanting to write a negative review as has been suggested.
I also believe that Gene prob did the best he could in making the dvd, and it is also obvious that many people DID get some valuable info from it. I have no doubt that gene is sincere in trying to help others improve their game, and that he has succeeded in many cases.
It appears to simply be that it works better for some than others. Everyone is different and learn in different ways.
As has already been said, there is much instructional info out there and most of it in dvd form is much less expensive. The price alone opens it up for harsher criticism. Gene had to know this before he set the price. He chose to put that value on it, and HAD to know that many people would not feel ANY dvd was worth that much ( right or wrong).
BUT--- I do want to make one observation. If you are going to make a dvd and tout it as much as he has, you had better deliver, or suffer the consequences. I mean, I don't feel that there is a good excuse for NOT making the production top notch, and make the progression of topics clear and easy to follow, etc. I feel that you do owe that much. I say this because I have heard this from people in BOTH camps. Even people who are saying it is legit have said the production was not top notch and had some confusion, etc.
I mean, if you are going to say that your dvd is MUCH better, AND price it that way,then you should take the extra time and effort to make it a better product! If I spend $80 on a dvd to learn ONE aspect of the game, and I sit and watch it, and after an hours time, it is still not clear- I do not feel that I should ALSO have to call and get a detailed explanation too! How can you possibly say that is acceptable?
If I say I am a cuemaker, and I make the best cues ever. You have the right to be skeptical. You have never heard of me or my cues. If I then price my cues at or above what the best cuemakers are selling their cues for, I have better deliver a fine product that leaves no doubt about me. If I show you one of my cues, and the inlays are sloppy and the wrap is not matched up right, my credibility is gone. I could then tell you that all of that doesn't matter anyway, my cues play better than all of the fancy cues. Even if my cues ARE the best playing cues out there, the fact that I can't match the rest of my peers in all the other areas will mean that I will not be able to charge in excess of what they are getting.
Even if the info is solid and legit, I think for that price it is not excusable to NOT put more time and effort into the production. Make it clearly presented, follow an outline. I don't think that is too much to ask for, given the cost.
Gene, please take this as constructive criticism, not bashing. Many of your customers have stated that it is an issue. The fact that it is very often necessary to have extended conversation about something after having an hour uninterupted to present it is a telling sign.
Jw
I will say one thing.
It seems that there are enough people on both sides of the coin.
I do not think PJ was wrong. There have been a number of people who said that they bought the dvd and felt exactly the same way, so it is NOT an isolated opinion. I feel that there is merit to his opinion, and is based on something other than just his wanting to write a negative review as has been suggested.
I also believe that Gene prob did the best he could in making the dvd, and it is also obvious that many people DID get some valuable info from it. I have no doubt that gene is sincere in trying to help others improve their game, and that he has succeeded in many cases.
It appears to simply be that it works better for some than others. Everyone is different and learn in different ways.
As has already been said, there is much instructional info out there and most of it in dvd form is much less expensive. The price alone opens it up for harsher criticism. Gene had to know this before he set the price. He chose to put that value on it, and HAD to know that many people would not feel ANY dvd was worth that much ( right or wrong).
BUT--- I do want to make one observation. If you are going to make a dvd and tout it as much as he has, you had better deliver, or suffer the consequences. I mean, I don't feel that there is a good excuse for NOT making the production top notch, and make the progression of topics clear and easy to follow, etc. I feel that you do owe that much. I say this because I have heard this from people in BOTH camps. Even people who are saying it is legit have said the production was not top notch and had some confusion, etc.
I mean, if you are going to say that your dvd is MUCH better, AND price it that way,then you should take the extra time and effort to make it a better product! If I spend $80 on a dvd to learn ONE aspect of the game, and I sit and watch it, and after an hours time, it is still not clear- I do not feel that I should ALSO have to call and get a detailed explanation too! How can you possibly say that is acceptable?
If I say I am a cuemaker, and I make the best cues ever. You have the right to be skeptical. You have never heard of me or my cues. If I then price my cues at or above what the best cuemakers are selling their cues for, I have better deliver a fine product that leaves no doubt about me. If I show you one of my cues, and the inlays are sloppy and the wrap is not matched up right, my credibility is gone. I could then tell you that all of that doesn't matter anyway, my cues play better than all of the fancy cues. Even if my cues ARE the best playing cues out there, the fact that I can't match the rest of my peers in all the other areas will mean that I will not be able to charge in excess of what they are getting.
Even if the info is solid and legit, I think for that price it is not excusable to NOT put more time and effort into the production. Make it clearly presented, follow an outline. I don't think that is too much to ask for, given the cost.
Gene, please take this as constructive criticism, not bashing. Many of your customers have stated that it is an issue. The fact that it is very often necessary to have extended conversation about something after having an hour uninterupted to present it is a telling sign.
Jw
- Status