Is this a legal shot in the video?

Is this legal?

  • Yes, it's legal

    Votes: 62 72.1%

  • No, it's a foul

    Votes: 14 16.3%

  • I am not sure

    Votes: 10 11.6%
  • Total voters
    86
  • This poll will close: .
Not 100% sure if it's legal or not from this angle. I know you can shoot that high and have the tip glance off the ball thus missing the foul.
MULLY
I like how he missed the shot but they edited it going straight in the pocket. He was off about a diamond before they changed camera angles. hehe!!
 
It looks like it'd be a double hit to me. If shooting through a frozen OB is a double hit, wouldn't it stand that shooting through a rail while the CB is frozen is also a double hit? He scratched anyways. :thumbup:
 
mullyman said:
Not 100% sure if it's legal or not from this angle. I know you can shoot that high and have the tip glance off the ball thus missing the foul.
MULLY
I like how he missed the shot but they edited it going straight in the pocket. He was off about a diamond before they changed camera angles. hehe!!
Click to expand...

i think that's how he double hit it. ;)

M.C.
 
Legal shot in Video

First of all if you are frozen to an object ball you can't double hit the cue ball.

This shot looks legal to me since he didn't double hit the cue ball. He cut the cue ball off the rail so it came off the rail at an angle away from the object ball. The angle made it hit the object ball at angle therebye cutting the ball in the pocket.

Mullyman is right though he did miss the shot but they put in another shot to see it go in.
 
exactly. a frozen ball can not be a double hit. also to avoid the push you have to shoot away which he did. the only way the shot was a foull is bc he scratched
 
TWOFORPOOL said:
First of all if you are frozen to an object ball you can't double hit the cue ball.

This shot looks legal to me since he didn't double hit the cue ball. He cut the cue ball off the rail so it came off the rail at an angle away from the object ball. The angle made it hit the object ball at angle therebye cutting the ball in the pocket.

Mullyman is right though he did miss the shot but they put in another shot to see it go in.
Click to expand...

I agree as long as the cue ball is frozen to the rail its a clean hit imo, take it for what its worth
 
dave sutton said:
...a frozen ball can not be a double hit.
Click to expand...

That's true when you stroke toward the object ball and there are no nearby obstacles to prevent the OB from moving freely away. In this case you're stroking away from the OB so that principle doesn't apply.

also to avoid the push you have to shoot away
Click to expand...

There's no push when you stroke toward the object ball, the same as there's no double hit. It's an entirely legal hit. But in this case it's the rail, not the OB, that might cause the foul.

the only way the shot was a foull is bc he scratched
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He didn't scratch, but the shot could have been a double hit or a push if the rail prevented the OB from getting out of the way of the follow through. I don't think this happened because of the wide angle the OB was hit into the rail, allowing it to rebound freely away without being "trapped" by the tip.

It's an interesting shot - actually a kick shot.

pj
chgo
 
TWOFORPOOL said:
First of all if you are frozen to an object ball you can't double hit the cue ball.
Click to expand...

Since he hit away from the frozen ball, I don't think that rule is in effect for this shot. That rule is to take a normal stroke into the frozen ball. He did not double hit the cue ball, he hit the CB into the rail at such an angle that it compressed into the rail and rebounded out cutting the 9-ball. There have been many variations of this shot in both pool and 3-cushion. If you aim the cue ball flatter to the rail (with a little mor speed), you can miss the 9 all together and do some other stuff with the cue including draw the CB to make a ball in the opposite corner around what appears to be blocking balls. It's the same shot.

Dave
 
Patrick Johnson said:
That's true when you stroke toward the object ball and there are no nearby obstacles to prevent the OB from moving freely away. In this case you're stroking away from the OB so that principle doesn't apply.



There's no push when you stroke toward the object ball, the same as there's no double hit. It's an entirely legal hit. But in this case it's the rail, not the OB, that might cause the foul.



He didn't scratch, but the shot could have been a double hit or a push if the rail prevented the OB from getting out of the way of the follow through. I don't think this happened because of the wide angle the OB was hit into the rail, allowing it to rebound freely away without being "trapped" by the tip.

It's an interesting shot - actually a kick shot.

pj
chgo
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thank you i guess for quoting everything i said then saying the exact same thing.

also if you watch the last few seconds of the video he did scratch... obv it was a joke...:thumbup:

as far as shooting away if a ball is not about a chalks length apart you have to jack up or shoot away. you can not shoot straight thru the ball. push everytime with any forward movement of the cueball. basically impossible to not push or double hitm it applies to this shot but maybe better to some others that can come up in a game
 
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thank you i guess for quoting everything i said then saying the exact same thing.
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LOL. If I said the same thing, why are you disagreeing with me?

dave sutton said:
...as far as shooting away if a ball is not about a chalks length apart you have to jack up or shoot away. you can not shoot straight thru the ball. push everytime with any forward movement of the cueball. basically impossible to not push or double hit
Click to expand...

The rules say otherwise:

WPA World Standardized Rules

http://www.wpa-pool.com/index.asp?content=rules_fouls#6.7

6.7 Double Hit / Frozen Balls
...if the cue ball is touching an object ball at the start of the shot, it is legal to shoot towards or partly into that ball
Click to expand...

it applies to this shot
Click to expand...

How can it apply to this shot if he's shooting away from the OB?

pj
chgo
 
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Didn't you guys see this shot in the movie "The Hustler"? This was the shot they beat the bartender with at the start of the movie.
 
ok.. lets do it your way

Patrick Johnson said:
LOL. If I said the same thing, why are you disagreeing with me?
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i wasnt disagreeing with you. i thanked you for repeating me
Patrick Johnson said:
The rules say otherwise:
Click to expand...

again thank you for repeating exactly what i said. you can not push if the balls are TOUCHING. key word is TOUCHING. i also gave the rule for a push if the balls are NOT TOUCHING. you must jack up or shoot away. any FORWARD movement is considered a foul

Patrick Johnson said:
How can it apply to this shot if he's shooting away from the OB?
Click to expand...

i thought i stated in the very first sentence of my post that it is NOT a foul

hope this helps
 
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dave sutton said:
I wasnt disagreeing with you.
Click to expand...

OK. Sorry if I misread you. It was a little difficult to understand what you were saying.

To be clear, my point was that it's not a double hit or a push to stroke normally toward the OB when the CB and OB are frozen together. But none of that applies here because the CB is being hit away from the OB.

pj
chgo
 
By the way, why is this a poll? The written explanations should be valuable, but rules aren't popularity contests.

pj
chgo
 
page 1 is a diagram for the shot in the video

page 2 is a diagram for the shot in the Hustler.

I kept thinking the tip would hit the cue ball twice in both layouts.

CueTable Help

 
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