OP here, I ran a 17 tonight.
Can anyone run 100 with enough practice?
- Thread starter skierlawyer
- Start date
regarding the original question, I'm not an expert, but my opinion is: "NO".
I think you need a high level of natural talent and mental concentration to run 100, and those people are in the minority, no matter how many lessons one takes.
Which is harder, bowling 300 or running 100? lets assume they are equally hard. I think most people could bowl a lifetime and never get 300.
I think you need a high level of natural talent and mental concentration to run 100, and those people are in the minority, no matter how many lessons one takes.
Which is harder, bowling 300 or running 100? lets assume they are equally hard. I think most people could bowl a lifetime and never get 300.
Practice vs table time
Hi everyone. This is my first post here. I've been lurking for a couple of weeks.
I consistently shoot 29 balls in a row. My highest number is 59. Reading the various comments has helped me to realize at a deeper level that I am really not practicing as much as I think I am, but only playing a lot.
When I missed an "easy" shot this morning, I tried to make it 10 times in a row and found I couldn't do it.....aha....very revealing. I need more structured practice, not just table time.
Anyway, I'm really enjoying the Forum.
Hi everyone. This is my first post here. I've been lurking for a couple of weeks.
I consistently shoot 29 balls in a row. My highest number is 59. Reading the various comments has helped me to realize at a deeper level that I am really not practicing as much as I think I am, but only playing a lot.
When I missed an "easy" shot this morning, I tried to make it 10 times in a row and found I couldn't do it.....aha....very revealing. I need more structured practice, not just table time.
Anyway, I'm really enjoying the Forum.
I feel like changing my answer..... 
When I say "no" I'm talking about the entire universe of people. My wife who is uncoordinated and noncompetitive has a lifetime high run of "2". If Mosconi was her teacher 24/7 she would still never get past 15.
However, for someone like the OP, or anyone who has already run in the 20's and has a desire to do better, then my answer is "Yes", with proper training they have enough natural ability to reach 100.
(disclaimer, this is just my humble opinion)
When I say "no" I'm talking about the entire universe of people. My wife who is uncoordinated and noncompetitive has a lifetime high run of "2". If Mosconi was her teacher 24/7 she would still never get past 15.
However, for someone like the OP, or anyone who has already run in the 20's and has a desire to do better, then my answer is "Yes", with proper training they have enough natural ability to reach 100.
(disclaimer, this is just my humble opinion)
I'm glad you changed your answer, I quit the game forever when you said, "no". I guess I'll start back up now. 
I feel like changing my answer.....
When I say "no" I'm talking about the entire universe of people. My wife who is uncoordinated and noncompetitive has a lifetime high run of "2". If Mosconi was her teacher 24/7 she would still never get past 15.
However, for someone like the OP, or anyone who has already run in the 20's and has a desire to do better, then my answer is "Yes", with proper training they have enough natural ability to reach 100.
(disclaimer, this is just my humble opinion)
Hi everyone. This is my first post here. I've been lurking for a couple of weeks.
I consistently shoot 29 balls in a row. My highest number is 59. Reading the various comments has helped me to realize at a deeper level that I am really not practicing as much as I think I am, but only playing a lot.
When I missed an "easy" shot this morning, I tried to make it 10 times in a row and found I couldn't do it.....aha....very revealing. I need more structured practice, not just table time.
Anyway, I'm really enjoying the Forum.
Welcome onboard-
keep shooting
lg
Ingo
I would have expected higher runs from the pros, but it goes to show how tough the equipment can be and how hard this game is!
Thanks for posting this! It makes me feel a tad better about my game!
It's not suprising at all. I wrote something about this several years back when I was still playing
See below.Something I commonly hear is :
"If you can run 50, then you can run 100"
In the real world, I've not heard anyone jumping this much in one go so I set about applying some Math to it. As you will see, this proves the above statement is completely false.
Starting at the basics, clearly if I have an X% percent chance of running 50, then my chance of running 100 is not X/2, but X%^2. If you quantify it per ball as 90% chance of making a ball, the chance of running 50 is 0.5% (1 run in 200). Therefore running 100 puts it up at 1 in 40,000. Since a player with a high in the 50s probably has about a 1 in 200 of making a 50 run, the chance of 100 is practically zero.
However, just a small improvement in your chance of making a ball dramatically increases your runs. If you increase your skill so making a ball goes from 90% to 95%, you suddenly have about a 7.5% of chance of running 50, and a 0.5% chance of running 100. That is just 15 times less likely to go from 50 to 100, rather than 200 times less likely as for the first example. You have 13 times more chance of running 50 with a 95% ball making success rate rather than 90%.
The chance of doubling your run from A to B with a chance of X of making a ball is 1 in [1/X^(B/2)]. So the better you get, the more your high runs will 'explode', but if you don't improve they will only creep up based on the number of attempts made.
So, if running 100 is your goal, and you are currently in the 50s, don't even think about it. As has been constantly stressed here, the key thing is learning the game to improve the chance of making a given ball be it through patterns, knowledge or an increase in shotmaking. Focusing on the high run number is just not the way forward.
Of course, this is pure offense. The wonderful part of this game is there is so much more richness to it. Improving runs doesn't necessarily improve your ability to win a match. That comes with knowledge of defense and safety play, an art form that seems to be neglected (at least in the League that I run).
exactly
uh poolmouse i concurr that there is alot more to life than pool, but lets not create an excuse to dog please. By the way the post above is right on and I think pool mouse's post is left off.
uh poolmouse i concurr that there is alot more to life than pool, but lets not create an excuse to dog please. By the way the post above is right on and I think pool mouse's post is left off.
your creating an excuse
:boring2:
I will agree that there is more to life than pocket billiards but creating an excuse as a means of dodging the pressure is never any good, but hey maybe when you retire the negative thoughts you will succeed and quit mousin' around.
:boring2:
I will agree that there is more to life than pocket billiards but creating an excuse as a means of dodging the pressure is never any good, but hey maybe when you retire the negative thoughts you will succeed and quit mousin' around.
No time for negatives- for many players it s just too hard, to enjoy the game and *just play it* and let the balls roll. Some really have to learn to jut enjoy it........
Thumbs Up
Ratta: your comment is right on, it is best to enjoy the Sport we all love.
As for running 100 balls without practice, No Way.
The above % list of the Pros. in my opinion is really good. What that list does not show are the good runs that are under 100 of each player. To be under all that pressure, with people sitting all around watching. A very hard thing to do. John S. % is out of this World. When I was a kid growing up in NY. I observed players get a round of aplase from spectators when they hit the 50 mark during a match. If a player ran 100 they would get a standing ovation. That is Respect. Well deserved. It just show how hard the tast of running 100 is.
The only way to do it, is to practice, practice, practice but one also has to achive a certain skill level also, which is not easy. I have seen many players in my league for 20 years and their game is the same as it was 20 years ago ( good but not great & without improvement ). Why is that? I can not answer that.
As for another question here on this Thread. Is running a 100 a big deal? I think it is. With out a doubt. What a honor and it is a dream come true for a young kid from NY to do it.
Ratta: your comment is right on, it is best to enjoy the Sport we all love.
As for running 100 balls without practice, No Way.
The above % list of the Pros. in my opinion is really good. What that list does not show are the good runs that are under 100 of each player. To be under all that pressure, with people sitting all around watching. A very hard thing to do. John S. % is out of this World. When I was a kid growing up in NY. I observed players get a round of aplase from spectators when they hit the 50 mark during a match. If a player ran 100 they would get a standing ovation. That is Respect. Well deserved. It just show how hard the tast of running 100 is.
The only way to do it, is to practice, practice, practice but one also has to achive a certain skill level also, which is not easy. I have seen many players in my league for 20 years and their game is the same as it was 20 years ago ( good but not great & without improvement ). Why is that? I can not answer that.
As for another question here on this Thread. Is running a 100 a big deal? I think it is. With out a doubt. What a honor and it is a dream come true for a young kid from NY to do it.
progress update
I haven't had too much time to play over the last week, but I played a little today and had a run of 24.
I haven't had too much time to play over the last week, but I played a little today and had a run of 24.
Skier, I thought we agreed you were going to quit the game?
seriously, well done, and I for one like to read about other people's progress toward their goals!
(by the way, I'm a skier and a lawyer too, but a better skier than lawyer)
Skier, I thought we agreed you were going to quit the game?
seriously, well done, and I for one like to read about other people's progress toward their goals!
(by the way, I'm a skier and a lawyer too, but a better skier than lawyer)
I tell my ski buddies, "you should see me play pool." I tell my pool friends, "you should see me ski."
Wow. First, I confess that I am a straight pool addict and idiot. It's a tough combination.
Anyway, I think this post really hit home for me. My progress in the game has been so slow and painstaking...but when I notice a slight increase in my long-run average, I experience big strides in my 9ball and one pocket abilities. But it takes like a month of very determined practice to make these types of improvements, and they are of the type alluded to in hoboken's post.
Current high run: 40 balls...i got nervous around 29 and then scared around 35ish...
Anyway, I think this post really hit home for me. My progress in the game has been so slow and painstaking...but when I notice a slight increase in my long-run average, I experience big strides in my 9ball and one pocket abilities. But it takes like a month of very determined practice to make these types of improvements, and they are of the type alluded to in hoboken's post.
Current high run: 40 balls...i got nervous around 29 and then scared around 35ish...
It's not suprising at all. I wrote something about this several years back when I was still playing
Something I commonly hear is :
"If you can run 50, then you can run 100"
In the real world, I've not heard anyone jumping this much in one go so I set about applying some Math to it. As you will see, this proves the above statement is completely false.
Starting at the basics, clearly if I have an X% percent chance of running 50, then my chance of running 100 is not X/2, but X%^2. If you quantify it per ball as 90% chance of making a ball, the chance of running 50 is 0.5% (1 run in 200). Therefore running 100 puts it up at 1 in 40,000. Since a player with a high in the 50s probably has about a 1 in 200 of making a 50 run, the chance of 100 is practically zero.
However, just a small improvement in your chance of making a ball dramatically increases your runs. If you increase your skill so making a ball goes from 90% to 95%, you suddenly have about a 7.5% of chance of running 50, and a 0.5% chance of running 100. That is just 15 times less likely to go from 50 to 100, rather than 200 times less likely as for the first example. You have 13 times more chance of running 50 with a 95% ball making success rate rather than 90%.
The chance of doubling your run from A to B with a chance of X of making a ball is 1 in [1/X^(B/2)]. So the better you get, the more your high runs will 'explode', but if you don't improve they will only creep up based on the number of attempts made.
So, if running 100 is your goal, and you are currently in the 50s, don't even think about it. As has been constantly stressed here, the key thing is learning the game to improve the chance of making a given ball be it through patterns, knowledge or an increase in shotmaking. Focusing on the high run number is just not the way forward.
Of course, this is pure offense. The wonderful part of this game is there is so much more richness to it. Improving runs doesn't necessarily improve your ability to win a match. That comes with knowledge of defense and safety play, an art form that seems to be neglected (at least in the League that I run).
A mental trick I tend to do, which doesn't always work, is to start over on every rack. In other words, approach the beginning of each rack as though you were starting from ball one. Forget about everything that came before and just try to run 14 more balls and fall on a break shot. To facilitate this, you have develop a routine to help you "start over". For myself, I'll walk away from the table take a sip of water and then focus on the shot at hand, make the break shot and then analyze the table. Similarily, if you get through a series of difficult shots and finally get back in line, it's another good moment to step away and start over.
We shark ourselves all the time by letting the numbers get into our heads. As a player to run three balls in straight pool they'll get through it almost every time. Put the same player on a run of 97 inching towards their first 100 and it changes everything. But it shouldn't.
In order for this to work however you can't be counting the balls. I'll just move a quarter around the table for each rack or if the table has a counter I'll keep track of the individual racks run.
Nevertheless, it's all easier said than done.
Second Cameron's advice: in addition to playing rack by rack, it may help to segment each rack (as e.g Oliver Ortmann recommends: instead of seeing 15 problems, segment the rack in e.g. three groups) into A) balls that block other balls from going in (= balls you need to get rid of before you run out of soldiers, i.e. balls that you can use to open up clusters etc.), B) the middle part of the rack (leaving and/or creating a break ball, a key ball, possibly a key-to-the-key for a stop shot triangle), and C) the end pattern leading to your break shot. Also, as Cameron points out, it may help to note the score using a coin or writing it down - unless you're like me, and like to remember how many balls you need to get out as a motivation to get out right away that inning (= depending on one's character, and the context, i.e. the objective/subjective importance of the moment, it may or may not be useful to have a goal in mind that's beyond solving the problem at hand – which is inevitably pocketing the next ball and position play), which admittedly is easier to do in competition than practicing (= because objectively speaking, one needs to motivate oneself behaving as if how many one runs is/were indeed important).
Greetings from Switzerland, David.
_________________
„J'ai gâché vingt ans de mes plus belles années au billard. Si c'était à refaire, je recommencerais.“ – Roger Conti
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