SUBJECT: BILLIARDS/POOL Channels on YouTube Unite!

POVPOOL

POVPOOL

POV Pool
Silver Member
Hello Comrades! - I am very excited!

Please pass this on if you know anyone in the community that has their own BILLIARDS/POOL YouTube channel, or whom you think might benefit from this information.

The official press release on this partnership will go out in the next couple of weeks, but until then, if you own a YouTube channel which is billiards or pool-related, you may already have received my invitation via Youtube to join this community. For those who do not know me, I am Daniel Busch and I urge all AZ'ers to review the following:

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Point Of View Pool Media (POV Pool & www.povpool.com) has partnered with ScaleLab Network (www.scalelab.com), a YouTube multi-channel network based in Beverly Hills, CA.

Together we are creating the only YouTube network/community dedicated solely to BILLIARDS/POOL. This community will result in greater visibility for everyone, as well as make it easy and fun to communicate and collaborate with each other online. Also, perhaps most importantly, ScaleLab and POV Pool will work on behalf of the entire community to line up big marketing campaigns and other sponsorship deals for everyone involved. Together we'll all increase our video views, get a higher level of visibility on the internet, and set a new standard for excellence in billiard media.

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Over the past few weeks, I have personally sent out over 200 invitations to YouTuber's, and will continue to do so, until the foundation of our YouTube Community is formed.

If you'd like to join, simply go to the ScaleLab website (www.scalelab.com) and apply. It takes all of 30 seconds to put your info in – then someone from POV & ScaleLab will follow up with you.

If we all band together, we can make a truly wonderful community and maybe even change the online face of billiards & pool forever!
 

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Are you talking live streaming as well as videos or just video recordings?
 
This doesn't solve the problem to generate revenue for our industry from unsolicited advertisements and bigger corporate sponsors.

You do know by promoting YouTube, that you're putting more money in YouTube's pocket rather than yourself, the players, and our industry right? You're also drowning out your own sponsors as you cannot monetize them exclusively and properly.

Are you paying the players when you upload their talents to YouTube with the minuscule amount of income YouTube pays?

I know you're a Good Samaritan for billiards, as myself, but technically the short term goal of what you are promoting damages future revenue potential.

What you should be promoting is a network in which is exclusive with the billiard industry, instead of trading value the content holds of the players to promote your agenda. The players are left holding the bag when there is no recoverable value in the video as it is exhausted by you, ustream, and youtube. Do you see the logic in how many hands the videos pass and the end result is $0 for the players?

My intention is not to be derogatory to your efforts, Daniel. I'm just stating my opinion. The billiard industry needs a better solution to generate outside surplus. Billiard sponsors and the players have been beaten to death receiving peanuts in return for their investments.

Zach.

POVPOOL said:
Hello Comrades! - I am very excited!

Please pass this on if you know anyone in the community that has their own BILLIARDS/POOL YouTube channel, or whom you think might benefit from this information.

The official press release on this partnership will go out in the next couple of weeks, but until then, if you own a YouTube channel which is billiards or pool-related, you may already have received my invitation via Youtube to join this community. For those who do not know me, I am Daniel Busch and I urge all AZ'ers to review the following:

------------------------------------

Point Of View Pool Media (POV Pool & www.povpool.com) has partnered with ScaleLab Network (www.scalelab.com), a YouTube multi-channel network based in Beverly Hills, CA.

Together we are creating the only YouTube network/community dedicated solely to BILLIARDS/POOL. This community will result in greater visibility for everyone, as well as make it easy and fun to communicate and collaborate with each other online. Also, perhaps most importantly, ScaleLab and POV Pool will work on behalf of the entire community to line up big marketing campaigns and other sponsorship deals for everyone involved. Together we'll all increase our video views, get a higher level of visibility on the internet, and set a new standard for excellence in billiard media.

-------------------------------------

Over the past few weeks, I have personally sent out over 200 invitations to YouTuber's, and will continue to do so, until the foundation of our YouTube Community is formed.

If you'd like to join, simply go to the ScaleLab website (www.scalelab.com) and apply. It takes all of 30 seconds to put your info in – then someone from POV & ScaleLab will follow up with you.

If we all band together, we can make a truly wonderful community and maybe even change the online face of billiards & pool forever!
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Zach, I'm sorry to say that, once again you think you know everything and you're taking this opportunity to shoot down any idea that is not yours.

I for one, have spent the last 2 years embracing everything and everyone who has something positive to say about pool and I have surveyed many people who agree that the paid subscription model is not going to work in a world which is so spread out internationally that YOU couldn't even begin to take on the task of promoting it properly.

YOU are trying to drive monthly subscriptions to a limited audience who is willing to pay. That's all fine and well, but if you think you can come in here and insist that the rest of the world should not create their own channels and exercise their freedom of expression, then you are missing the boat and I wish you luck. You are also forgetting the possibly hundreds of YouTube channels started by creative people who don't STREAM pool media, they RECORD pool media

Joining forces with ScaleLab is just one small part of a bigger picture that is being utilized as a foundation for greater things to come. I've done my research. The pay per view and subscription model only works to a certain extent. It's pathetic to discourage a genuine opportunity for media providers all over the world who wish to join forces on a mass scale.

Pool needs more viewers not more dictators!

http://www.scalelab.com
 

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Great idea Daniel thumbs up to you!

I'm sure you've already added SloMoHolic
 
POVPOOL said:
Zach, I'm sorry to say that, once again you think you know everything and you're taking this opportunity to shoot down any idea that is not yours.

I for one, have spent the last 2 years embracing everything and everyone who has something positive to say about pool and I have surveyed many people who agree that the paid subscription model is not going to work in a world which is so spread out internationally that YOU couldn't even begin to take on the task of promoting it properly.

YOU are trying to drive monthly subscriptions to a limited audience who is willing to pay. That's all fine and well, but if you think you can come in here and insist that the rest of the world should not create their own channels and exercise their freedom of expression, then you are missing the boat and I wish you luck. You are also forgetting the possibly hundreds of YouTube channels started by creative people who don't STREAM pool media, they RECORD pool media
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I did not claim to know everything. Did I? Did I not say your idea is great for a short term solution?

So you spent 2 years to figure out that building is business is tough? And now since you've agreed with others opinion how Paid Subscriptions doesn't work? How's that? There hasn't been one that had ever existed before OSPN. A business on this scale does not happen overnight, Daniel.

Oh I forgot, that you're the instant gratification type and side step real opportunity that makes a lasting impact. Exactly my point in my original response. Let me elaborate a bit more, shall I?

So you've got it all figured out that YouTube and Ustream provide a larger audience for billiards? You're wrong. An audience is free to roam to whichever site on the the internet. 80% of the online billiard audience is referred from Facebook, AZBilliards, and Email alerts. But you don't have this analytic data to make these educated decisions on what works and what doesn't when it comes to other peoples hard earned cash. You just simply want to rely on middlemen to take care things.

OSPN will be offering independent channels January 1st just like Ustream. And I can assure you that we'll have more billiard channels than ustream, livestream, and justin.tv combined.

Keep washing your hands of the real responsibility Daniel. When the players start demanding to be paid to be live streamed OR VIDEO RECORDED in the future, because they are sick of NOT BEING PAID, let me know how well this huge YouTube Billiard Network works out for the players benefit. Because the players are the last ones with their hands out these days. OSPN has changed that and continues to build a stronger relationship with all players.

Good luck with your project.

CIAO!
 
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Daniel, I think this is a great idea. I see this as "promoting pool and billiards" via YouTube -- the largest, most known, most used internet video site in the world. I have surveyed for many years myself and completely agree that in order to grow an audience and increase the interest in all disciplines your model is the way to go. I also agree that, if the main mission is to promote the sport as widely as possible the "paid subscription model is not going to work in a world which is so spread out internationally".

With that being said, the build up done by the FREE will help the PAID as more and more people are brought into the fold and become aware of major PAID events or challenges put forth from outstanding folks like Accu-Stats, TAR, Kozoom, etc. In fact, in order to boost an interest in a particular event, these very entities do offer something free first to build participation! Just makes good business since.

Another aspect I've been working on for years is the sponsors. I have worked with several large proposed sponsors outside of the pool industry and everyone has said the same thing: "Increase the audience base and we'll take a look". Once the audience base becomes more worldwide and large sponsors come on board there will be monies available for the players, broadcasters, commentators, promoters, and the like.
 
cmbwsu said:
Daniel, I think this is a great idea. I see this as "promoting pool and billiards" via YouTube -- the largest, most known, most used internet video site in the world. I have surveyed for many years myself and completely agree that in order to grow an audience and increase the interest in all disciplines your model is the way to go. I also agree that, if the main mission is to promote the sport as widely as possible the "paid subscription model is not going to work in a world which is so spread out internationally".
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Bob, you're exactly right about using YouTube to promote pool and billiards. YouTube has plenty of videos as a matter of fact. Do they need more? Also, if I may add, YouTube does not need full length matches to promote the art and sport of billiards either. And this international point you bring up. The Internet doesn't stop at the United States Border, the last time I checked.

cmbwsu said:
With that being said, the build up done by the FREE will help the PAID as more and more people are brought into the fold and become aware of major PAID events or challenges put forth from outstanding folks like Accu-Stats, TAR, Kozoom, etc. In fact, in order to boost an interest in a particular event, these very entities do offer something free first to build participation! Just makes good business since.
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Pay who? I didn't see you mention anything about the players being compensated directly from videos who which are featured?

cmbwsu said:
Another aspect I've been working on for years is the sponsors. I have worked with several large proposed sponsors outside of the pool industry and everyone has said the same thing: "Increase the audience base and we'll take a look". Once the audience base becomes more worldwide and large sponsors come on board there will be monies available for the players, broadcasters, commentators, promoters, and the like.
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So we need an audience in the millions to satisfy the goal of and outside sponsor, correct? We'll I can assure you that our industry will not land that audience through YouTube or Ustream, even Internationally, combined.

However, OSPN will reach an audience in the millions through its network channels combined, and it's sister streaming networks "billiards on demand", and live on demand. At that time will be able to secure a large corporate sponsor as the 'COMBINED' audiences throughout all channels through exclusive monetization will sell much much easier.

And if I may ask? If per say, you achieve the level of audience by some miracle, which network are you going to use? Yeah I thought so. I'm going to tell you right now, that it won't fly, because it will be in direct violation with Ustream's terms of service. :grin:

You see it's a conflict of interest, because why would a larger sponsor settle for 1 million viewers on 4,000 channels, when the network has 40,000 channels, and 25 million viewers. Who won't get 100% of the sale.

You guys need to do some more adequate research and get caught up with ways of eCommerce. The internet isn't Television or ESPN.

Have a good one.
 
I don't understand the point of the POV partnership? If I want billiard related videos on youtube, I just type in what I'm after in the search bar. Whether its straight pool, or a specific player, or a specific tournament, etc. Even though the matches are all over the place, the search brings them together for me. What does uniting the separate billiard channels under some sort of umbrella offer further?

Regarding n0risc's posts, I've been reading some of his stuff for a year or more now. I know he has not been well received by the other members of the streaming community, but I think he makes some valid points. I believe the crux of his argument is that the vast majority of the monetary gains from sponsors of popular videos on Youtube go TO youtube, not to the content creator, or content actors (pool players in our case).

Removing our pool videos from Youtube and keeping them on a network dedicated to billiards, would keep get rid of the huge middlemen (youtube, ustream, etc) and return that money to the pool community. The pool community can then split it up however they see fit. But the point is, the pool community would be splitting up the whole pie of advertising money, not a tiny slice of the pie.

I don't know if n0risc's technical solution to this idea is feasible or not. I have been to his website, and frankly don't understand it. But I think I understand his philosophy on keeping the money from advertisers amongst ourselves.
 
n0risc said:
This doesn't solve the problem to generate revenue for our industry from unsolicited advertisements and bigger corporate sponsors.

You do know by promoting YouTube, that you're putting more money in YouTube's pocket rather than yourself, the players, and our industry right? You're also drowning out your own sponsors as you cannot monetize them exclusively and properly.

Are you paying the players when you upload their talents to YouTube with the minuscule amount of income YouTube pays?

I know you're a Good Samaritan for billiards, as myself, but technically the short term goal of what you are promoting damages future revenue potential.

What you should be promoting is a network in which is exclusive with the billiard industry, instead of trading value the content holds of the players to promote your agenda. The players are left holding the bag when there is no recoverable value in the video as it is exhausted by you, ustream, and youtube. Do you see the logic in how many hands the videos pass and the end result is $0 for the players?

My intention is not to be derogatory to your efforts, Daniel. I'm just stating my opinion. The billiard industry needs a better solution to generate outside surplus. Billiard sponsors and the players have been beaten to death receiving peanuts in return for their investments.

Zach.
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I find it sad that you speak about everyone getting paid. The OP is offering a service to the fans of pool.

You are charging on your site and you promote your "for profit" site on AZB and you are a SILVER member.

I think it's time you donate proceeds from your stream site to AZB, the very same place you are promoting your site.

Very hypocritical.
 
iusedtoberich said:
I don't understand the point of the POV partnership? If I want billiard related videos on youtube, I just type in what I'm after in the search bar. Whether its straight pool, or a specific player, or a specific tournament, etc. Even though the matches are all over the place, the search brings them together for me. What does uniting the separate billiard channels under some sort of umbrella offer further?

Regarding n0risc's posts, I've been reading some of his stuff for a year or more now. I know he has not been well received by the other members of the streaming community, but I think he makes some valid points. I believe the crux of his argument is that the vast majority of the monetary gains from sponsors of popular videos on Youtube go TO youtube, not to the content creator, or content actors (pool players in our case).

Removing our pool videos from Youtube and keeping them on a network dedicated to billiards, would keep get rid of the huge middlemen (youtube, ustream, etc) and return that money to the pool community. The pool community can then split it up however they see fit. But the point is, the pool community would be splitting up the whole pie of advertising money, not a tiny slice of the pie.

I don't know if n0risc's technical solution to this idea is feasible or not. I have been to his website, and frankly don't understand it. But I think I understand his philosophy on keeping the money from advertisers amongst ourselves.
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n0rsic is doing the same thing he preaches against.

Promoting his stream site on here for free.
 
dom_poppa said:
n0rsic is doing the same thing he preaches against.

Promoting his stream site on here for free.
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You're exactly correct dom_poppa! BUT.............

Since OSPN was built by the billiard industry for the billiard industry, we can offer all streams for free LIVE. However, if you miss the live stream, you will then require a very affordable subscription of $7.99 per 30 days to review the latest broadcast, and ALL broadcasts previously aired over the network. There is also bonus recorded footage that was not aired live, which is also available to be watched with the subscription.
 
dom_poppa said:
I find it sad that you speak about everyone getting paid. The OP is offering a service to the fans of pool.

You are charging on your site and you promote your "for profit" site on AZB and you are a SILVER member.

I think it's time you donate proceeds from your stream site to AZB, the very same place you are promoting your site.

Very hypocritical.
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Mr. dom_poppa: I am currently a silver member. My Gold Membership actually just expired last month. I do regularly support AZBilliards and purchase yearly a membership for the forum.
 
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