Little taste of Act 2....
- Thread starter classiccues
- Start date
Well, for example, I thought it was Spain who did the blank for Mosconi's cue, attached. If I measure on my screen without the ring section, the points are 4.5 inches, and the forearm is 5.75 inches. That would be 78%. If I include the ring section, the forearm is 6.25 inches. That would be 72%. I can't get anywhere near 60%, no matter how I measure it. Bear in mind, this is only on my computer screen, the proportions are the key, not the entire measurements. That's why I approximated 75%.
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Well, The blank WAS shortened towards the joint to allow for the rings below points....
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Sorry, but I have to disagree. Here's Spain's picture that he sent out to those who asked around 1978 or so. I measure all the points to be pretty much right on 75% of the forearm.
Attachments
You're wrong... All of the cues you posted from Burton are an inch+ below the forearm wood gap at the wrap... George cut the wrap gloves so there was a small amount of maple showing before the wrap or rings...
With respect to you, another member, You're thoughts are wrong period.. Listen and learn.. Spain blanks are full splice which, at that time, makes them shorter by design. More maple was left at the front. When George used them he wanted a maple gap at the base which meant he had to cut the full splice part off or cut the wrap groove in that area. Doing so brought the tops of the points closer to the wrap. Burton moved the blanks forward from the wrap to give the illusion the points were longer... Spain points on Bushka or in this case a Tascarella tribute are around 60% of the forearm. Gus's are closer to 75% because they are short spliced...
Don't mean to clutter this thread or make anyone angry. I understand what you mean about full splice. And it does depend on how the cue is ultimately finished. Just took a look at the Miz Dove cue for example, and the points appear around 70% or so, Spain blank, not pushed forward, still some space between points. Examples I've seen appear longer than 60%, but perhaps there are some other examples as well. This could be one where finished examples average inbetween.
They're not... Listen, Ive tried to help you where you obviously are not experienced and you won't listen. That's ok. Believe what you want. No hard feelings.. Let's just wait for more pics of this cue which is what Joe was teasing us about...
skins.....WildWing......I think I figured out what the problem is.
The two of you guys know way more than most mortals......maybe so much
that you both can be wrong and right at the same time depending upon which
side of the argument you had to debate.....I betcha you guys could switch sides
and convincing argue against what you are now asserting with one another.
You guys know too much information but you have been entertaining to read and
cudos for being civil with each other which is uncommon nowadays on the Forum.
Okay, round 3 or shall we call it a draw and admit that you guys will never agree?
Matt B.
The two of you guys know way more than most mortals......maybe so much
that you both can be wrong and right at the same time depending upon which
side of the argument you had to debate.....I betcha you guys could switch sides
and convincing argue against what you are now asserting with one another.
You guys know too much information but you have been entertaining to read and
cudos for being civil with each other which is uncommon nowadays on the Forum.
Okay, round 3 or shall we call it a draw and admit that you guys will never agree?
Matt B.
The Mosconi cue was a shorty splice not a full rosewood splice. Second its pictures, so it is tough to determine the actual point length. Take into account the 1 - 1 1/2" of rings over the wrap. But the Spain prongs had vastly different geometry than Gus prongs.
If you put the Spain prong next to another Spain prong of the same era, 1965 ish, they are exactly the same.
JV
If you put the Spain prong next to another Spain prong of the same era, 1965 ish, they are exactly the same.
JV
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There's no question, no draw, no debate... I know what I speak of and have tried to educate as such but maybe to no avail and that's perfectly fine with me. I have no dog in the "fight". I just wanted to point out an obvious misconception about how someone might recognize a certain makers work. I've had many a Spain, Bushka, and Szamboti pass through my hands and know their cues intimately....
So, no Matt, I couldn't switch side and argue his point because it comes from ignorance which is not a sling at degrading ones character but of their knowledge. I'm a teacher by trade and unlike some on this site like to share. If someone doesn't want to listen so be it. I'll save the info for those who are receptive. This is the last I will say on this matter....
dom_poppa
Banned
Well, we can all agree that you are an idiot because the premise of this thread isn't "What kind of cue do I have" -or- "ID my cue please"
The point of this thread is to showoff part 2 of this wonderful tribute, I am assuming, Pete is to build a collection of Bushka tributes.
Agree. I was only trying to measure from known Spain blanks, not only this example. I couldn't come with any with a 60% point to forearm ratio, but that doesn't mean there aren't some out there. Just trying for a little scientific method, not controversy.
Matt, I'll try to give you an honest answer, unlike the strident one you got. I already said there is variation, even with one blank maker, and I still think that. I've noticed plenty of variation in Spain blanks on cues, which I don't think is unusual. After all, these were humans building points, blanks, and cues with less that what we would call "state of the art" equipment that is available today. So there is bound to be some variation in finished products.
One of the benefits of having this hobby since 1973 was buying cues from Tim Scruggs beginning in the late 70s. He was one of the few that cue owners trusted to refinish their Balabushka, as George was gone. Tim showed me plenty of them, with noticeable variation in point proportion specs, regardless of whether it was a Spain or Szamboti blank. So basically I agree with you. Even the Mosconi Bushka and the new GBT cue that Joe is showing have comparable proportion looks, even though one is Spain, and the other is Szamboti. I wouldn't confuse one for another, but the proportions are somewhat similar.
One other benefit in this hobby was getting Jerry -R- to do my Mosconi tribute, which was the first one, I believe, and still the most accurate in proportions. The archives are available. Jerry relied on me to analyze the proportions based on images, which I did. Jerry also asked me several times later to help in this sort of analysis, design and proportions for cues he was making for others, and we've heard no complaints. So I think my skills in this area of cue analysis are not that bad, and I would not call anyone else "ignorant" due to discussion of differing viewpoints. Hope that helps.
