'"5 and under" tournament question.

9andout

9andout

Gunnin' for a 3 pack!!
Silver Member
I mostly play at home. With exception of my numerous NYE titles lol (see sig) I've only ever played in one tournament. Time to venture out again.
A tour near me, The DELMARVA BAR BOX, holds 5 and under tournaments a few times a year.

My question may be better answered by league players.
How does the typical "5" play in 9 ball? Typical amount of balls run etc.
I've watched some of their videos and I'm sure I will hold my own.
How would I spot a "sandbagger"?
I'm hoping to do well and wouldn't mind being told I have to play in the regular tour next time.
But I figured start with this. Also, the regular tour has a guy who beat a top pro before.

Btw I also entered an Open Amateur 10 ball in Feb just for a nice reality check.:D

Thanks for your thoughts.
 
Hard to say. What is "5 and under" based on: Fargo, APA, BCA? 5 would probably be an "average" player in any of those.

Spotting sandbaggers can always be a challenge. If a 5 is average then you have to consider what an average player does.
Average players don't bank well outside of a pretty straight on bank.
Average players won't kick well on balls far away from a rail or pocket.
Average players won't have much luck in 2 rail safety play.
Average players won't put the cue ball in the needed 4" box halfway down the table or more for a safe or position play.

Sure they can do those things on occasion, but they certainly will not do it consistently.
 
As a 5/6 myself, let me tell you honestly. We can make shots, cuts and banks. We can play defense, but sometimes not lockdown. We can think 3 balls ahead but occasionally get ahead of ourselves and get out of line or miss. We are unpredictable; some days run 6, others not. I think we are above average players ( I consider 4s average). Does that help?
 
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I go to these and they are a lot of fun. Their skill level refers to an APA 5 since that is what most of the people in that area are familiar with. If you're talking about the one in February it is 9ball in the winners bracket and 8ball in the losers. They are put on in an attempt to get more people into the pool scene and to show that there is more to pool than what the APA has to offer. They don't do points like APA it's the 9ball that counts. There are some people who could be rated above a 5 but break and runs are very very rare at the 5 and under and 9 ball on break can't be in the bottom 2 pockets. If you want some real fun go to the regular tournaments they have. They are cheap to get into and if you don't get far there are still good matches you can learn from watching. I will be at both the regular one this month and the 5 and under next month so if you have any questions about them just ask on here or there will be plenty of people to ask there. Hope to see you at one or the other.
 
Usually a player of that caliber ends a run because QB gets out of position and he can not get it back in line,not a simple missed cut shot.
 
9andout said:
I mostly play at home. With exception of my numerous NYE titles lol (see sig) I've only ever played in one tournament. Time to venture out again.
A tour near me, The DELMARVA BAR BOX, holds 5 and under tournaments a few times a year.

My question may be better answered by league players.
How does the typical "5" play in 9 ball? Typical amount of balls run etc.
I've watched some of their videos and I'm sure I will hold my own.
How would I spot a "sandbagger"?
I'm hoping to do well and wouldn't mind being told I have to play in the regular tour next time.
But I figured start with this. Also, the regular tour has a guy who beat a top pro before.

Btw I also entered an Open Amateur 10 ball in Feb just for a nice reality check.:D

Thanks for your thoughts.
Click to expand...

Dont take this the wrong way, but if you arent already established as a 5 or under then you shouldnt be allowed in the tournament.
 
A 5 often has 3-5 ball runs. They rarely break and run, but can do so every once in a while. I would equate them to a strong C to C+ player. Their safety play is inconsistent at best, and patterns are average. They are a favorite to get out with 3 ball left, but it wouldn't be a shock to seem them mess that up. That is my 2 cents. Good luck.
 
It takes tenacity

I played in one a while ago when I had just joined the APA and was ranked a 5. There were some players who could get out with 4-5 balls on the table but they were the exception. I found the hardest part wasn't beating the other players but staying focused on your game, especially after getting in the winners bracket and sitting there cooling off for hours and getting bored while the loser's bracket finished up. After that I was pretty much ready to go home and didn't feel bad about losing that game at all.
 
Nyeborn said:
I go to these and they are a lot of fun. Their skill level refers to an APA 5 since that is what most of the people in that area are familiar with. If you're talking about the one in February it is 9ball in the winners bracket and 8ball in the losers. They are put on in an attempt to get more people into the pool scene and to show that there is more to pool than what the APA has to offer. They don't do points like APA it's the 9ball that counts. There are some people who could be rated above a 5 but break and runs are very very rare at the 5 and under and 9 ball on break can't be in the bottom 2 pockets. If you want some real fun go to the regular tournaments they have. They are cheap to get into and if you don't get far there are still good matches you can learn from watching. I will be at both the regular one this month and the 5 and under next month so if you have any questions about them just ask on here or there will be plenty of people to ask there. Hope to see you at one or the other.
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Sounds great! I met and talked to Eric at the Expo this yr. Watched Kevin W. at The Open, and then when I saw Josh on the list I figured 5 and under was for me.:D
I watch a lot of the Tour's U tube stuff.
I'm playing in the DELCO Bar Box in Feb. too.
10 ball. You playing in that?
Btw I told Eric I thought I played close to T. Sample's speed. Saw he was in a 5 and under besides the regular tournament.
 
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Icon of Sin said:
Dont take this the wrong way, but if you arent already established as a 5 or under then you shouldnt be allowed in the tournament.
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No problem. I spoke to the TD and he is fine with it. My home table is a 9' Diamond. I think I play a little better on the BB.
I don't think I will get booted though. If so I'll take it as a compliment.
I could use that!:thumbup:
 
Mychoads said:
I played in one a while ago when I had just joined the APA and was ranked a 5. There were some players who could get out with 4-5 balls on the table but they were the exception. I found the hardest part wasn't beating the other players but staying focused on your game, especially after getting in the winners bracket and sitting there cooling off for hours and getting bored while the loser's bracket finished up. After that I was pretty much ready to go home and didn't feel bad about losing that game at all.
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Thanks for the review. A few of the U tube vids do get a little looong. Ha
I'll be at the Feb. one if it doesn't conflict with DELCO that I already paid for.
I sent Eric the DELCO dates.
 
It has been my experience that in a typical APA 9 ball match, a player completes his total points in 15 innings when playing well and 20 innings when not playing so well. For a skill level 5 (goes to 38 points), when playing well he/she would average 2.533 points per inning or 1.9 points per inning when not playing so well.

Any player averaging 6 points per inning would be skill level 9 (6 X 15= 90 points). A skill level 9 only needs 75 points to win the match.

Points are scored 1 point for each ball 1-8 and 2 points for the 9 ball.

Innings calculations in this post do not account for defensive shots.
 
9andout said:
No problem. I spoke to the TD and he is fine with it. My home table is a 9' Diamond. I think I play a little better on the BB.
I don't think I will get booted though. If so I'll take it as a compliment.
I could use that!:thumbup:
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Be prepared for a shit ton of whiners... You are not gonna hear the end of it. Ive been on that shit of the fence before and snapped off a tourney as an underrated player. I didnt get booted and was even allowed to come back the following week, but the experience really wasnt worth it.
 
Icon of Sin said:
Be prepared for a shit ton of whiners... You are not gonna hear the end of it. Ive been on that shit of the fence before and snapped off a tourney as an underrated player. I didnt get booted and was even allowed to come back the following week, but the experience really wasnt worth it.
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It may or may not happen, but don't discourage his participation just because you had a bad experience. If it was a handicapped limited tournament and they invited you back then they obviously watched you play and determined you were within their limits skill wise. If not, they would have advised you as such and maybe even of gave you your money back and asked you to leave.

OP, Just be honest with them and tell them what you think you should be rated and why. Chances are they will give you an opportunity to play because most people will overstate their abilities, not understate them. (egos and all) If they think you are too good they may make some adjustment or ask you not to play in the future. But at least you were honest and weren't trying to pull the wool over their eyes and get one over on everybody.
 
D WEATHERSBY II said:
It has been my experience that in a typical APA 9 ball match, a player completes his total points in 15 innings when playing well and 20 innings when not playing so well. For a skill level 5 (goes to 38 points), when playing well he/she would average 2.533 points per inning or 1.9 points per inning when not playing so well.

Any player averaging 6 points per inning would be skill level 9 (6 X 15= 90 points). A skill level 9 only needs 75 points to win the match.

Points are scored 1 point for each ball 1-8 and 2 points for the 9 ball.

Innings calculations in this post do not account for defensive shots.
Click to expand...

what do you think of a 5 that has had the following matches recently?

won 38-4 vs a 3 in 7 innings

lost 31-32 vs a 4 in 22 innings

lost 25-28 vs a 3 in 21 innings

won 38-60 vs a 9 in 12 innings while playing 3 safes and the 9 played 2 safes.
 
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