Do you think that the US might play stronger if the MC were a winner take all event?

J

justinb386

Banned
Do you think that the US team might play stronger if the Mosconi Cup were a winner take all event?

This might not ever be the case (and I do not know if it was ever the case in the previous history of the Mosconi Cup), but imagine if the winner of the event received $30,000 for each player, and the losing team had to go home with not only $0 in prize money, but no trophy or medal of any kind.

I do not know, but I imagine that not only SVB would play much stronger, but the entire team would take the event and their game a lot more seriously.

I do not know, because this would add even more pressure to the event, and the US team might play even worse, and have even less of a chance of winning, but who knows.

I understand that this is a completely fictional scenario, and would probably never happen, but just curious to hear some thoughts about if you think anything would change if this type of scenario were to happen.

Would the US players play better, worse, or about the same (against team Europe), if they knew going into it that if they did not win, then they would receive no prize money, and have to go back home without anything (not even a Silver medal for 2nd place)?

I do not know, but I am thinking that at the very least, SVB would be playing much stronger, and taking the competition a lot more seriously.

Thanks for any thoughts about this.
 
justinb386 said:
Do you think that the US team might play stronger if the Mosconi Cup were a winner take all event?

This might not ever be the case (and I do not know if it was ever the case in the previous history of the Mosconi Cup), but imagine if the winner of the event received $30,000 for each player, and the losing team had to go home with not only $0 in prize money, but no trophy or medal of any kind.

I do not know, but I imagine that not only SVB would play much stronger, but the entire team would take the event and their game a lot more seriously.

I do not know, because this would add even more pressure to the event, and the US team might play even worse, and have even less of a chance of winning, but who knows.

I understand that this is a completely fictional scenario, and would probably never happen, but just curious to hear some thoughts about if you think anything would change if this type of scenario were to happen.

Would the US players play better, worse, or about the same (against team Europe), if they knew going into it that if they did not win, then they would receive no prize money, and have to go back home without anything (not even a Silver medal for 2nd place)?

I do not know, but I am thinking that at the very least, SVB would be playing much stronger, and taking the competition a lot more seriously.

Thanks for any thoughts about this.
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Have you ever played team sports? The simple fact they've been drilled 7 straight years is motivation enough to win. I don't think more money would motivate them. The Euros are riding a 7 year win streak. They want to bury the US. The US wants to end the streak. I think these teams would play, regardless of the payouts.
 
dkleather said:
If it were winner take all they would not cross the sea.
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Not even just for the free round trip tickets to London, and the experience alone (of getting to compete against some of the best players in the world)? I do not know about the other 4, but I would be willing to bet that Skyler would cross the sea for the experience. Maybe Bergman too.
 
Excellent thread. I think this is definitely the reason behind USA's defeat.:thumbup:
 
Shawn Armstrong said:
Have you ever played team sports? The simple fact they've been drilled 7 straight years is motivation enough to win. I don't think more money would motivate them. The Euros are riding a 7 year win streak. They want to bury the US. The US wants to end the streak. I think these teams would play, regardless of the payouts.
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I think maybe the Europe team might just be stronger under pressure, and I also think that the races to 5 are just too short. Make the races to at least 9, and maybe the US would have a chance? Maybe the longer races would ease off the pressure a little? I thought that maybe the US team was just not taking it seriously. I know these guys could play with any of these European players, in a long gambling session, or in a much longer race. The European players are not any better then these guys, so I do not get it. Why does the US lose so badly every year?
 
justinb386 said:
Not even just for the free round trip tickets to London, and the experience alone (of getting to compete against some of the best players in the world)? I do not know about the other 4, but I would be willing to bet that Skyler would cross the sea for the experience. Maybe Bergman too.
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You are correct. If there is still free stuff they would go. I should have typed "they would not cross the seat at their own expense".
 
justinb386 said:
I think maybe the Europe team might just be stronger under pressure, and I also think that the races to 5 are just too short. Make the races to at least 9, and maybe the US would have a chance? Maybe the longer races would ease off the pressure a little? I thought that maybe the US team was just not taking it seriously. I know these guys could play with any of these European players, in a long gambling session, or in a much longer race. The European players are not any better then these guys, so I do not get it. Why does the US lose so badly every year?
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Here's why the USA lost: their 5 players aren't as good as Europe's. If you want to see this for yourself, look at the WPA rankings. Count how many Euros are in the top 50. Then count the number of Americans. You could make the races to 1000. You can tighten the pockets. Loosen them. Change the size of the tables.

They treat it like it's their job. Only one of the Americans can match their work ethic and intensity. And he's the target of most of the derogatory posts on here. If you had 4 more guys like Shane, it would be a contest.
 
justinb386 said:
The European players are not any better then these guys, so I do not get it.
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They're not better indeed. Think about it. How many US BBox 9-ball C'ships that Austrian dude has, huh? How many Brickyard Classics have you won Mr. Terminator? Has Mark Gray any realistic chance to win the Chinook Winds Open? Yeah, I don't think so.
 
dkleather said:
You are correct. If there is still free stuff they would go. I should have typed "they would not cross the seat at their own expense".
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Yeah, the Mosconi Cup points (leaders) would win a free trip to the Mosconi Cup competition (against the top 5 European players), but other then the free round trip tickets (and maybe a certain amount of money per day for their expenses, like maybe $100 per player, per day), they would not be guaranteed any winnings for a 2nd place loss to the European team, or any type of medal or trophy (if they were to lose to the European team). In this type of scenario (winner take all), I think that the races should be extended to 9, or maybe even 11 (that would not be too bad, would it?). The pressure would be so much greater, but who knows, the US team might play much stronger.
 
justinb386 said:
Yeah, the Mosconi Cup points (leaders) would win a free trip to the Mosconi Cup competition (against the top 5 European players), but other then the free round trip tickets (and maybe a certain amount of money per day for their expenses, like maybe $100 per player, per day), they would not be guaranteed any winnings for a 2nd place loss to the European team, or any type of medal or trophy (if they were to lose to the European team). In this type of scenario (winner take all), I think that the races should be extended to 9, or maybe even 11 (that would not be too bad, would it?). The pressure would be so much greater, but who knows, the US team might play much stronger.
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Do you think they would travel if they were getting nothing at all unless they won and no expenses, air fares etc? I do not think they would. I think they are getting a free $10k and do not care.

I was at Blackpool two years ago and watched a closing ceremony where only the captain really looked upset by defeat. I saw it again on TV this year. USA are out their depth but what is worse they are not trying to reverse the trend.
 
justinb386 said:
Yeah, the Mosconi Cup points (leaders) would win a free trip to the Mosconi Cup competition (against the top 5 European players), but other then the free round trip tickets (and maybe a certain amount of money per day for their expenses, like maybe $100 per player, per day), they would not be guaranteed any winnings for a 2nd place loss to the European team, or any type of medal or trophy (if they were to lose to the European team). In this type of scenario (winner take all), I think that the races should be extended to 9, or maybe even 11 (that would not be too bad, would it?). The pressure would be so much greater, but who knows, the US team might play much stronger.
Click to expand...


Can't believe I'm saying this but this is the best thread / post I've seen from you to date. I agree with this. I think it would make a big difference and certainly couldn't hurt??? Ever seen the difference between a salaried salesman and a straight commission one?
 
BmoreMoney said:
Can't believe I'm saying this but this is the best thread / post I've seen from you to date. I agree with this. I think it would make a big difference and certainly couldn't hurt??? Ever seen the difference between a salaried salesman and a straight commission one?
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Yes, the commission ones who are not good enough don't eat.
 
Shawn Armstrong said:
Here's why the USA lost: their 5 players aren't as good as Europe's. If you want to see this for yourself, look at the WPA rankings. Count how many Euros are in the top 50. Then count the number of Americans. You could make the races to 1000. You can tighten the pockets. Loosen them. Change the size of the tables.

They treat it like it's their job. Only one of the Americans can match their work ethic and intensity. And he's the target of most of the derogatory posts on here. If you had 4 more guys like Shane, it would be a contest.
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Okay, so if we could include Canada, then we might have a chance? SVB, Alex Pagulayan, John Morra, Bergman, and Woodward? Do you like that teams chances, or what top 5 players from all of North America would you choose? I still think that going to 5 is still too short of a race, but this might actually help the chances of the weaker team, if they can handle the pressure. I think that the Europe teams just have such a strong mental game, and play so much stronger under pressure. It may also be that they are much better team players.
 
dkleather said:
Do you think they would travel if they were getting nothing at all unless they won and no expenses, air fares etc? I do not think they would. I think they are getting a free $10k and do not care.

I was at Blackpool two years ago and watched a closing ceremony where only the captain really looked upset by defeat. I saw it again on TV this year. USA are out their depth but what is worse they are not trying to reverse the trend.
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Yeah, I was thinking that maybe the US players were not taking their games as seriously as they normally would (in normal competition or gambling play). I was thinking that maybe (just maybe) they would bare down, concentrate more, and play so much stronger if it were a winner take all event. I am sure that Skyler and Bergman took it seriously, but I am not sure about the others.
 
BmoreMoney said:
Can't believe I'm saying this but this is the best thread / post I've seen from you to date. I agree with this. I think it would make a big difference and certainly couldn't hurt??? Ever seen the difference between a salaried salesman and a straight commission one?
Click to expand...

Lol, thanks. Yeah, the salesman that is on salary is not going to take his sales job as serious as the salesman who only gets paid by commission. That reminds me of the salesman that I pass in the middle of the mall hallways (that sell stuff like massage therapy products, and health and beauty products). They do not make any money if they do not get any sales, so they are constantly trying to hustle every person that walks by (instead of just sitting there, like they could care less if they ever make a sale). The same goes for some salesman in clothing shoppes, who get paid extra commission for their sales (at places like The Buckle).
 
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