i've made a similar thread like this before but i'm still wondering,what's the most important fundamental for being able to get the cue bang on the line of aim more consistently?consistent back foot placement?correct vision centre alignment?looking at the OB as you're getting down on the shot?overcoming optical illusions like where center CB actually is or seeing the cue angled in your vision?what do you guys think?
Getting the cue on the line of aim
- Thread starter z0nt0n3r
- Start date
Gravey39
Active member
For the most part when I’m not shooting over a ball. I stand back from the table and line my cue up behind the cue ball looking down the cb to my aim point. Then I’ll put the cue into my bridge hand and place my feet as I get down onto the shot to the point I just spotted out.
Have you tried "reverse engineering" your stance? Get into the stance you like (vision center over line of aim, stroke naturally straight along line of aim), then back out of it one body part at a time, noting exactly where each body part was in relation to the line of aim and the other body parts. Might take a bunch of tries to get it right...
pj
chgo
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if it's really hard to see if the cue is bang on the line when you're down,then logically it's way harder to see it when you're in the standing position.this is the reason why most pro's have their heads very low on the shot instead of being more upright imo.
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i have done something similar like noting exactly where each of my body parts are when i'm standing and after i get down on the shot,and one thing i notice is my vision center moves offline as i'm getting down (by a few mm's,not by much),so the cue ends up often very slightly more to the right of my chin instead of the correct place and it's enough to cause a miss.so now i always check if it's in the correct place when i'm down and my potting has improved but i still struggle sometimes to get the cue on the line consistently although it has improved.probably the solution is loads of practice on setting up with the exact same alignment over and over,no real shortcut.
Yup. But being thoughtful and methodical about your approach (as you seem to be doing) can make the practice more effective.
pj
chgo
dquarasr
Registered
(Not an instructor)
Here's what I have found useful.
Put one of those loose leaf reinforcing circles on the head spot. (If you are at a pool hall and can't use one of those dots, put a piece of chalk on the head short rail.) Get down on an imaginary shot from foot spot to head spot.
Look down. If your cue is aligned exactly on the shot line, the cue should be directly over the center diamond on the short rail where you are standing. You don't even need a cue ball, although it may help to have one so you can see if your cue tip is EXACTLY center ball.
Do this for 15 minutes a few times a day. Eventually, you'll understand how your standing view of the shot, your foot placement and your routine to step into and get down on the shot is working, and you can then naturally take this to any other shot on the table, assuming you can visualize the shot line on any other shot. At that point, with no other reference points, you'll have to trust that your process to get into your stance is sound.
Oh, another thing you can do is to set up the MOAD (Mother of All Drills), the diagonal 2:1 to 2:1 shot, straight in corner-to-corner shot across the table, both left and right. Some people (including myself) get lined up better in one direction than in the other. These two diagonal shots can help you identify if you have this perception problem.
Are you having problems setting your cue down on the line of aim? How do you know when your cue isn't on the line of aim?
That question is the elephant in the room. Dr. Dave's Vision Center Resource Page suggests some ways to answer it.
Vision Center - Dr. Dave Pool Info
Answers to frequently-asked questions about how to find your personal 'vision center' in pool.
billiards.colostate.edu
pj
chgo
That question is the elephant in the room. Dr. Dave's Vision Center Resource Page suggests some ways to answer it.
Vision Center - Dr. Dave Pool Info
Answers to frequently-asked questions about how to find your personal 'vision center' in pool.
pj
chgo
Dr. Dave’s info rocks
I wasn't asking in general. I was asking the op how he (or she) determines whether his cue is off line. I always try to understand where the person who is asking the question is coming from.That question is the elephant in the room. Dr. Dave's Vision Center Resource Page suggests some ways to answer it.
Vision Center - Dr. Dave Pool Info
Answers to frequently-asked questions about how to find your personal 'vision center' in pool.
pj
chgo
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WobblyStroke
Well-known member
Sounds like you are having some inconsistency in your setup with the cue relative to your body position rather than line of aim per se. What I mean is, the cue could be dead on the line of aim but since you have your head and eyes in a different spot than where you are used to sighting (when cue is directly under your chin), the skewed perspective makes it appear off.
While there is no 'shortcut' for setting up the same way over and over there are definitely techniques you could try to make that more likely and therefore minimize the amount of practice required to get it down. Kinda like Mullins said about shooting a basketball...If you have great technique you can get away with 200 shots a day, but with poor technique, you may need to shoot 1000. Same goes for getting into your setup.
Technique 1: Set up around the cue. This one has been mentioned above but I will add a few points. Once the cue is aligned on the line of the shot you take your stance around it by setting your feet, then coming straight down over the cue. The feeling should be of lowering straight down with no forward or twisting movements...you have preset those with your foot position. If you are tall enough for a dead hang of your arm to your cue, even your elbow should not move and feel only as if it is being drawn straight upwards (as a result of your body lowering into position)...assuming you are a hanging forearm stroke guy.
Technique 2: Preset your finish in your preshot routine and form a stance around that. This one is much less commonly used and mostly by those players who have their forearm forward of 90* to the floor at address and those who drop their elbows. The idea here is to complete a stroke in your preshot routine which will help you preset your finish position allowing you to get into your stance in a way that ensures you take out any twisting or slipping around of your grip between your address and finish positions (you will often see a slight bowed wrist in these players since that is where their shot wants to finish). This technique CAN WORK for other types of strokes as well and I would recommend you try it out no matter how you stroke the cue...
For your purpose, finishing a stroke while upright and seeing the alignment that your particular stroke wants to be in allows you to form your stance around this preset relationship of your body/arm angle.
So both techniques accomplish a high level of consistency; one by getting into position around a set cue which has been aligned to the shot and the other by getting your particular body-cue relationship preset before getting down on the shot line.
Hope one of these clicks for you.
To be honest,i can't prove whether the cue is on the line or not,i would have to go to a pool table and set up a laser on the aim line,get down with the cue over the laser line and video tape it with an overhead camera to prove it.what i do now is go by feel.if i feel that i need to steer the cue to pocket the ball and also see that i steer on the delivery,then that to me is a sign that the cue is not on the line of aim.but i understand that i could be wrong because this isn't clear evidence that the cue isn't on the line,it could be that i feel the need to steer the cue because of optical illusion problems like seeing the aim picture wrong when it in fact isn't and subconsciously trying to correct it on practice strokes and the delivery.and btw optical illusion problems aren't usually dominant eye/vision centre problems,you can have the cue in the correct place under your chin but you can still see the cue angled in your vision or still have problems perceiving center ball.only if you put a laser or a piece of string on the aim line and get down with cue on them,the optical illusion tends to disappear.
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one thing that i notice sometimes as i'm getting down on the shot is that the vision centre can move offline not only by getting down with your head more to the right or left of the correct spot under your chin but it can also move offline if you rotate your head more to the right or left than the ideal amount as you're getting down,so the cue can be on the correct spot under your chin but your head can be more or less rotated which will move the vision centre offline once again.
Correct head alignment is crucial for aiming but it is hard to repeat consistently in your set up because of what i have stated above.
Or you could put your cue on the aim line by getting low and sighting along it like aiming a rifle (to be sure it's on the line), then, without moving the stick, try to arrange your stance so that looks right with your eyes above the cue.
pj
chgo
Well, you can make it complicated or you can make it simple. Let's keep it simple the way top players do. High level players are tuned into 'feel.' They know what it feels like to have their cue in line and they also know when something doesn't feel right. They don't keep checking themselves or perform calculations when they're down on the shot. It's all a matter of zeroing in on the correct feel.
Have either a high level player or an instructor stand behind you and watch you shoot for awhile. Not just one shot over and over --- You will have to move around the table. Let them get an idea of your cue placement and how successful it is on various shots and angles. Once they've observed you for awhile, then they can start to physically move your cue for you when it's off line. You may have to slightly adjust your stance to accommodate that. But once it's in line, teach yourself how it feels. That's the feel you'll need to capture when you're out playing a match.
If you don't know how it feels when it's right, you'll keep making mistakes.
Also: Keep in mind that when it comes to zeroing in on a feel, you need an anchor/reference point. A good anchor is a particular portion of your back foot on the line of the shot. Pick a part of your foot --- heel, instep, etc. and start there. Get really specific about the placement of your foot. Then you can rely on feel once you've placed your foot.
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no matter how low you get,when we are talking about very small fractions,i don't think you can be sure that the cue is online imo.
i think you need some equipment (laser,string etc) and an instructor watching you like you said to be certain that the cue is online and to be sure that you don't keep making the same mistakes.
as far as body alignment goes,i think i have done everything i can to make sure that it's correct.the part of the back foot i have chosen is my heel because it feels the most comfortable when i'm getting down on the shot.