how would ya hit it?

justnum said:
There is competition shots and there are test shots.

DrDave threads are always about test shots.

Test the kickshot success rate vs the "straight-in".

Do three shots of each for calibration. Then try ten shots of each using an informed aiming line and see which shot has the higher success.

This education is sponsored by the Harriman Academy. Much of the advancements made are based on concepts similar to DrDave.
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Dunnn51 said:
Ok, so now you all should give the OP the knowledge that "point of aim", and "point of contact" are not one in the same when shooting cut shots.
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Sorry. I don't know what you're talking about. My post was about changing the cut angle with spin induce throw.

I personally find aiming cuts into small pockets easier by aiming to miss thick and then increasing the cut angle with throw.
 
evergruven said:
thank y'all for the responses
JV, are you in agreement with pat? I can't quite tell
to me, missing the long rail point means aiming towards the left side of the pocket..
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I believe Pat means that the pocket plays bigger if you err to the left side. If that's the case then yes I agree with him.

By "missing the long right point", I'm aiming to the center of the target zone, but not the center of the pocket opening. If I clip the long rail point or even put the OB into the long rail above the pocket, it's very likely to drop. I consider the long rail point the 'near center' of the target zone for this shot. I can miss the "center" equally in either direction and have it drop. I know where the point is, so it gives me a hard target to adjust my aim from.

If I was aiming toward the left side of the pocket. Then I wouldn't threaten to clip the long rail point at all.
 
Hungarian said:
T.O.I.
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Fatboy said:
That fix’s the skid
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To a degree.

Inside spin increases the rubbing speed, which reduces the chance of skids, but doesn't totally eliminate it like outside gearing spin does.

But even though side spin in either direction helps, I still prefer forward roll's lack of squerve/throw variables. Player's choice, of course.

pj
chgo
 
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I tend to inadvertently put a touch of outside on this shot when I try to hit center ball which results in over cutting. Depending on the conditions and speed it will usually go. But for some reason that I can't really explain, I feel most confident when I hit it firm (not warp speed) but firm with TOI.
 
Patrick Johnson said:
I suppose you mean vertical rubbing. "Gearing" is the absence of rubbing.

And vertical rubbing doesn't cause skid - if anything it just causes the CB to slide a little in the shot direction. Skid is caused by excess horizontal friction causing the CB to throw more than usual across the shot direction.

pj
chgo
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When the two balls lock in antigearing, the object ball gets dragged along. That's throw.
 
straightline said:
When the two balls lock in antigearing, the object ball gets dragged along. That's throw.
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Semantically speaking...

Throw happens when there's friction between the balls, but they're rubbing, not "locked".

Skid is when the balls lock (or throw excessively) - usually caused by chalk at the contact point.

Gearing english is just enough outside spin to "roll" the CB across the OB's surface with no rubbing friction.

pj
chgo
 
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Custom details aside and practically speaking, balls get sticky in use. The dynamics can get very different than pristine airconditioned results. I think throw is a generic term denoting the object ball path being influenced and altered by the impact direction of the cue ball.
 
straightline said:
Custom details aside and practically speaking, balls get sticky in use. The dynamics can get very different than pristine airconditioned results. I think throw is a generic term denoting the object ball path being influenced and altered by the impact direction of the cue ball.
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I think that's right, even though skid is qualitatively different from "regular" throw - both can be true.

pj
chgo
 
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Patrick Johnson said:
Semantically speaking...

Throw happens when there's friction between the balls, but they're rubbing, not "locked".

Skid is when the balls lock (or throw excessively) - usually caused by chalk at the contact point.

Gearing english is just enough outside spin to "roll" the CB across the OB's surface with no rubbing friction.

pj
chgo
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Patrick Johnson said:
But even though side spin in either direction helps, I still prefer forward roll's lack of squerve/throw variables. Player's choice, of course.
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100%... Adding complication out of fear of a skid/kick isn't the way I opt to play the game. The odds of the bad contact are slim. The odds of having to properly correct for the complications of the added variables is 100%.
 
The_JV said:
100%... Adding complication out of fear of a skid/kick isn't the way I opt to play the game. The odds of the bad contact are slim. The odds of having to properly correct for the complications of the added variables is 100%.
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not disagreeing..I'm not smart enough to😝 but am curious..bob j. said something in another thread about kicking
something like running english is what the cb wants to do anyway, so account for the spin and let it rock (and roll)
I'm not hip to all the physics effects, but in my mind there is a way(s) to hit a given shot that just looks/feels "right"
sure one must account for putting the ball in the hole, and cb position after- but that makes the shot easier in a way
cuts down on the number of ways the shot can reasonably/actually be hit, then the "right" way reveals itself, sort of
hitting the cb somehow that encourages the ob to move a certain way tests accuracy, but can help make the shot

and I wonder about "microskids/kicks"..what do the balls looks like when contacting each other in slow motion?
in a game of literal millimeters, hitting with "gearing" is instinctive to me, but no doubt there's got to be a tradeoff
and also ways to mitigate risk? in this case, only going as far outside on the cb as needed..which is maybe flat.
again what keeps me coming back to this mad game..finding the art in the science and the science in the art
"is it worth it?" is a fair question to ask, and of course everybody's different, got different skills and inclinations
there sure are many answers. appreciate the opportunity to game game with all you fine folks..cheers🍻
 
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