Segan Cues - Joint/Thread size?
- Thread starter Garo 7
- Start date
SSDiver2112
Escott Cues
The pin is discussed in the thread below. Do not know if a regular Radial joint protector would work.Segan cue arrived today. Absolutely beautiful. I'll know in a couple hours if it hits as good as it looks. But there was flaw in my plan: Anyone happen to know what the thread size is on an Evan Clark Segan cue? Looks like I could use a set of joint protectors.
Thread 'Evan Clarke with Segen Cues'
https://forums.azbilliards.com/threads/evan-clarke-with-segen-cues.401389/
SSDiver2112
Escott Cues
Didn’t say much so easy to miss.
“new piloted joint with a pin that is similar to the radial pin, made to Evan's specifications.”
“new piloted joint with a pin that is similar to the radial pin, made to Evan's specifications.”
Garo 7
Registered
Nice! Really appreciate the info!
Yes, I just wrote to Schon Cues to see what they might know as well. Yes, it is not a super tight thread like the Mezz United Joint. But it lines up very flush and straight. It does look like a much shallower thread than normal, and also as if a standard thread was somehow 'stretched' to be thinner and enlongated. I mean that is the appearance anyway, although I realize nobody actually 'stretches' threads.
On this other page here I found some info, but I do not think it is accurate: https://forums.azbilliards.com/threads/fs-segen-cues.441971/
This certainly does not seem to be like any 5/16-14 thread I have ever seen. My Mezz United joint is a 5/16-14 and the joint protector does not go on the butt of the Segan at all. But, 5/16 is .3125 inches, and this special thread you show here is a bit larger at .330 - this might track I guess.
Will be nice if Schon accommodates Segan owners for things like thread protector sets and/or custom shafts. I'll see what they say. Hopefully it won't be, "Sorry - buy a 'real' Schon."
Yes, I just wrote to Schon Cues to see what they might know as well. Yes, it is not a super tight thread like the Mezz United Joint. But it lines up very flush and straight. It does look like a much shallower thread than normal, and also as if a standard thread was somehow 'stretched' to be thinner and enlongated. I mean that is the appearance anyway, although I realize nobody actually 'stretches' threads.
On this other page here I found some info, but I do not think it is accurate: https://forums.azbilliards.com/threads/fs-segen-cues.441971/
This certainly does not seem to be like any 5/16-14 thread I have ever seen. My Mezz United joint is a 5/16-14 and the joint protector does not go on the butt of the Segan at all. But, 5/16 is .3125 inches, and this special thread you show here is a bit larger at .330 - this might track I guess.
Will be nice if Schon accommodates Segan owners for things like thread protector sets and/or custom shafts. I'll see what they say. Hopefully it won't be, "Sorry - buy a 'real' Schon."
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In the past, Schon has used 2 different size 5/16x14 joint screws. One of them being smaller than a full 5/16"Nice! Really appreciate the info!
Yes, I just wrote to Schon Cues to see what they might know as well. Yes, it is not a super tight thread like the Mezz United Joint. But it lines up very flush and straight. It does look like a much shallower thread than normal, and also as if a standard thread was somehow 'stretched' to be thinner and enlongated. I mean that is the appearance anyway, although I realize nobody actually 'stretches' threads.
On this other page here I found some info, but I do not think it is accurate: https://forums.azbilliards.com/threads/fs-segen-cues.441971/
This certainly does not seem to be like any 5/16-14 thread I have ever seen. My Mezz United joint is a 5/16-14 and the joint protector does not go on the butt of the Segan at all. But, 5/16 is .3125 inches, and this special thread you show here is a bit larger at .330 - this might track I guess.
Will be nice if Schon accommodates Segan owners for things like threat protector sets and/or custom shafts. I'll see what they say. Hopefully it won't be, "Sorry - buy a 'real' Schon."
Garo 7
Registered
Well, the reply from Schon was from the sales dept (which I find to be bullshit to begin with, for a technical spec question) and they basically said, "We have no idea how the cue was made, since Evan was not with Schon at the time." Which I doubt is true, there must makers there who everything about the Segan cue. However, they apparently have no phone number for talking to anyone knowledgeable about anything custom.
Guess I am on my own. Schon does seem to have any interest in helping anyone.
Guess I am on my own. Schon does seem to have any interest in helping anyone.
Garo 7
Registered
Actually, measuring by eye, roughly with a precise ruler (I was an A-Class machinist once upon a time) it appears to be the diameter of the image you sent, and very similar type and depth of thread. TPI (pitch seems to be exactly 8. The dimensions you give for this prototype pin are very close to 21/64th inch (.328 inch) so this is 2 thousandths of an inch smaller than 21/64ths which tracks for a thread tolerance.
Question: Oh, I see now the difference in Radial. I guess the Segan looks like 3/8-8 Radial. I thought it was a 3/8-10 but I forgot NOT to count the first thread. So, 4 complete threads per 1/2 inch = 8. Maybe Samsara will be willing to help me. At least they answer the phone.
Or, I can just order a set of protectors for 3/8-8 Radial and return them if they don't fit I guess.
I guess the bigger issue will be finding out what the bumper thread is... can't wait to see what Evan did with that LOL
Wow what he did was a plain, tight, hard rubber bumper, secured with a small set screw to the end of the weight bolt.
Well, no luck there. Guess I'll have to get a KO extension.
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x Wild Bill x
New member
I believe Mr. Webb is referencing a joint pin that is similar to the Uni-Loc Radial Joint https://uni-loc.com/joints/radial/ however, Schon changed the dimensions slightly on their pin so it will be a loose fit into a radial shaft. Looking at the picture you posted, the major diameter looks to be slightly less than a regular radial pin which would cause the "loose" fit Mr. Webb referenced. I'd try and find someone local with a radial cue and ask to try their shaft on your cue. I believe the Uni-Loc Radial is a 3/8" - 7.5 thread? Don't quote me, but it's close I believe.
T
No secret that a single shaft double tapped For both 3%8x10 and the 3/8x7.66 will fit both screws.
Illogical but true.
The one I showed a picture of threaded into a shaft with the Uni loc radial thread, approx. 3/8x7.66.
No secret that a single shaft double tapped For both 3%8x10 and the 3/8x7.66 will fit both screws.
Illogical but true.
I just tried the screw into my 3/8x10 mandrells. Both regular and flat bottom.
It does not fit.
It does not fit.
Garo 7
Registered
Ohhhh... ok, so not so simple maybe. I did do some research prior to your replies (which I really appreciate by the way!) Thread peak to peak, I do count exactly 8 complete threads per 1/2 inch, which may be hopeful. But, that's just eyeballing-it. Seems pretty exact though, 5 peaks exactly starting at 0.
Finding an extension will be a problem I guess. Evan just has a simple hard rubber bumper, that pushed into the opening in the butt, which is secured directly to the top of the weight bolt with a small, long set screw. I guess he planned to make one for this design, but never got the chance.
Guess I’ll be looking for a KO extension.
Finding an extension will be a problem I guess. Evan just has a simple hard rubber bumper, that pushed into the opening in the butt, which is secured directly to the top of the weight bolt with a small, long set screw. I guess he planned to make one for this design, but never got the chance.
Guess I’ll be looking for a KO extension.
Garo 7
Registered
Yeah, just got a reply from Brian at J&J Cues: It is a modified 3/8-8 Uni-Loc Radial. He says that is all he knows about it. Perhaps a 3/8-8 Uni-Loc radial? How it was modified, this is not widely known I guess. May never be known, exactly.
I had initially measured the TPI incorrectly at 10, because I included the 1st peak sitting at 0 as a thread. Five-peaks per 1/2 inch (including the fits tone at zero) = 8 complete threads per inch I think? So, it is 8 or very close to it.
Thanks to you and the other folks here I know a LOT more now that I did yesterday.
I am not even going to say why this info is important to me. But, you may be able to guess. Well, no biggie. But, I do very much appreciate your interest and efforts in replying and checking. Thank you so much!
The 3/8x8 ball screw does exist. Mostly in Cues from Overseas. The modified part in yours is, it's smaller in diameter than the standard 3/8x8 ball screw.Yeah, just got a reply from Brian at J&J Cues: It is a modified 3/8-8 Uni-Loc Radial. He says that is all he knows about it. Perhaps a 3/8-8 Uni-Loc radial? How it was modified, this is not widely known I guess. May never be known, exactly.
I had initially measured the TPI incorrectly at 10, because I included the 1st peak sitting at 0 as a thread. Five-peaks per 1/2 inch (including the fits tone at zero) = 8 complete threads per inch I think? So, it is 8 or very close to it.
Thanks to you and the other folks here I know a LOT more now that I did yesterday.
Well, no biggie. But, I do very much appreciate your interest and efforts in replying and checking. Thank you so much!
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Garo 7
Registered
Yeah, I noticed that too. But, for a joint protector it may not matter if it is a bit smaller, although that is quite a bit. Guess I'll find out.
Just spoke to Samsara Cues - they have a Radial and Uni-Loc quick release (looks like a QR Pin) - but, no joint protectors available in stock; and no idea when they might be available again.
Just spoke to Samsara Cues - they have a Radial and Uni-Loc quick release (looks like a QR Pin) - but, no joint protectors available in stock; and no idea when they might be available again.
Then yours is different than the one I have.
Mine will not screw into a 10 but screws into the 8 thread vee pitched mandrell and the radial..
Best of luck