whitch foam to fill carbon fiber shaft

[kling&allen]

But pour foams are pretty much the only theoretical way to get a shaft evenly filled isn't it? Spray foams might leave random air pockets even with a long nozzle.

Pardon my questions, I'm not a cue builder or woodworker by any means. Just interested in how things are built, and I've been intrigued how seemingly readily available carbon fiber shafts are now. I'm currently getting a blank finished in China, in the process of getting a Tomahawk ferrule down there to have it completed, just not sure how the playability will turn out. A month ago, I got a shaft from China too for about 70 shipped, weighed in at 4.2oz, 13mm conical taper with a phenolic plate and tip(separate), but the shaft was considerably hollow with a tink sound on impact(perhaps some fill foam might help?).

Back to the foam, is 4lb foam density considered low density?

It's another challenge(for me) to know how far up the shaft the foam will expand to. Needs lots of testing.

I don't consider this my area of expertise. But yes there is a lot trial and error involved (in all aspects of cue making for that matter). I think 4 to 8lb pour foams are the standard. Some builders and manufacturers use different densities along the length of the shaft to reduce endmass while also providing the desired weight. You can find images of cut apart revos for example. The length and type of the joint plug can also be varied to change the weight and balance.

 

[DJEnD]

I don't consider this my area of expertise. But yes there is a lot trial and error involved (in all aspects of cue making for that matter). I think 4 to 8lb pour foams are the standard. Some builders and manufacturers use different densities along the length of the shaft to reduce endmass while also providing the desired weight. You can find images of cut apart revos for example. The length and type of the joint plug can also be varied to change the weight and balance.

Thanks for your input.

Somehow, for the life of me, I can't seem to be able to locate any cut apart images of revos or other reputable shafts.

 

[Tom1234]

My Cynergy shaft made that tink sound; Dave38 informed us all on how to remove a ferrule from a CF shaft. Followed his instructions to remove the stock Cynergy ferrule and then installed a Tomahawk ferrule. Good bye tink. I did make the new ferrule longer than the stock ferrule. It could be that the extra material in the shaft made the difference.

 

[kling&allen]

Thanks for your input.

Somehow, for the life of me, I can't seem to be able to locate any cut apart images of revos or other reputable shafts.

Shaft Endmass and Stiffness Effects - Dr. Dave Pool Info

Answers to frequently-asked questions about the effects of shaft endmass and stiffness on squirt in pool and billiards.

billiards.colostate.edu

 

[PracticeChampion]

But pour foams are pretty much the only theoretical way to get a shaft evenly filled isn't it? Spray foams might leave random air pockets even with a long nozzle.

Pardon my questions, I'm not a cue builder or woodworker by any means. Just interested in how things are built, and I've been intrigued how seemingly readily available carbon fiber shafts are now. I'm currently getting a blank finished in China, in the process of getting a Tomahawk ferrule down there to have it completed, just not sure how the playability will turn out. A month ago, I got a shaft from China too for about 70 shipped, weighed in at 4.2oz, 13mm conical taper with a phenolic plate and tip(separate), but the shaft was considerably hollow with a tink sound on impact(perhaps some fill foam might help?).

Back to the foam, is 4lb foam density considered low density?

It's another challenge(for me) to know how far up the shaft the foam will expand to. Needs lots of testing.

Those cheap china shafts are fine but all the one's I've put tips on have large ridges running down them, can't really feel it though til it's spinning in a lathe.

There's all kinds of different weighted foams I've found. My shafts come out at 4.1oz + - a smidge.
I tape off the tip end and fill with a set amount, can't remember it's written down and it over flows just a bit, then I bore the foam out to the depth I want for the joint and vault plate

 

[kling&allen]

Those cheap china shafts are fine but all the one's I've put tips on have large ridges running down them, can't really feel it though til it's spinning in a lathe.

There's all kinds of different weighted foams I've found. My shafts come out at 4.1oz + - a smidge.
I tape off the tip end and fill with a set amount, can't remember it's written down and it over flows just a bit, then I bore the foam out to the depth I want for the joint and vault plate

Yes I think the cheap shafts are "flag wrapped" from CF sheets which produces a seam. The revo is "filament wound" I believe so it doesn't have the longitudinal seam.

 

[DJEnD]

Shaft Endmass and Stiffness Effects - Dr. Dave Pool Info

Answers to frequently-asked questions about the effects of shaft endmass and stiffness on squirt in pool and billiards.

billiards.colostate.edu

Wow that's one heck of a read. I thought I had read most of Dr Dave's articles but I guess I missed that one along with the photos. Thanks!

Yes I think the cheap shafts are "flag wrapped" from CF sheets which produces a seam. The revo is "filament wound" I believe so it doesn't have the longitudinal seam.

I can't tell if mine is filament wound or "flag wrapped", it looks graphite-colored compared to the revos/ignites/cynergy, but one thing is for sure, there's absolutely zero flexing. Can't locate the seam either.

I actually can't wait to take out the ferrule to see if it's indeed hollow, and also to measure the wall thickness. This shaft can't flex at all!

My Cynergy shaft made that tink sound; Dave38 informed us all on how to remove a ferrule from a CF shaft. Followed his instructions to remove the stock Cynergy ferrule and then installed a Tomahawk ferrule. Good bye tink. I did make the new ferrule longer than the stock ferrule. It could be that the extra material in the shaft made the difference.

Thanks to you, I managed to find the thread. Appreciate it!

Those cheap china shafts are fine but all the one's I've put tips on have large ridges running down them, can't really feel it though til it's spinning in a lathe.

There's all kinds of different weighted foams I've found. My shafts come out at 4.1oz + - a smidge.
I tape off the tip end and fill with a set amount, can't remember it's written down and it over flows just a bit, then I bore the foam out to the depth I want for the joint and vault plate

Thanks for sharing your process, good to know that you don't have to finish off one end first.

 

[Terry Aeschliman]

I'm with Mr Hightower! I use cotton balls loaded from joint end after ferrule is installed. 70-80 balls add less than one ounce of weight but quiet the tink sound. I fill to within 4 inches of ferrule and almost up to joint material.

 

[blackhawk357m]

I use a two part foam. It only takes about 1 oz of each hardener and resin. Mix together for about 20-30 seconds and pour into the hollow shaft. Of course, you have to have one end plugged in advance and ready. It's a quick operation, so be ready!!
Gary

I just tried this out. lol 1 oz of each resin and hardener, WHAT A MESS LMAO At least i was able to get the overpour off with acetone. I think I'm gonna try the cotton ball approach on my next shaft. yup

 

[Terry Aeschliman]

When I filled my first tube I had installed the ferrule and held the shaft upright with ferrule down. I used a spray foam from Menards. The foam literally "blew" out and hit the 8' ceiling in addition to walls and floor. Good thing my reflexes were good enough to move my head !!
I mentioned my experience to the guys at Jacoby later and they just laughed. They told me that they had done the same thing but they had been smart enough to try it in the parking lot.
I am sticking to the cotton balls !!!!!

 

[PracticeChampion]

When I filled my first tube I had installed the ferrule and held the shaft upright with ferrule down. I used a spray foam from Menards. The foam literally "blew" out and hit the 8' ceiling in addition to walls and floor. Good thing my reflexes were good enough to move my head !!
I mentioned my experience to the guys at Jacoby later and they just laughed. They told me that they had done the same thing but they had been smart enough to try it in the parking lot.
I am sticking to the cotton balls !!!!!

2 part mixing foam is alot easier, just pour it in

 

[thestickman]

I use acoustic foam. Cut it into small strips with scissors and use a long rod to pack it. Kind of like loading a musket. Way less messy than my experiments with spray foam.

Any acoustic foam? (the black stuff). Any idea what the final weight ends up at? I imagine you could pack super tight and not so tight and have different results. I like this idea.

 

[cueman]

Any acoustic foam? (the black stuff). Any idea what the final weight ends up at? I imagine you could pack super tight and not so tight and have different results. I like this idea.

The black or grey stuff. Pack it how ever you want. Most of the weight is decided by the plug you use.

 

[thestickman]

I wonder how Rockwool soundproofing insulation would work? Probably similar to the cotton balls or the shredded acoustic foam.

I wonder how the weight of the different fillers changes. I really like the idea of no mess avoiding the expanding foam, but getting to 4 ounces is important from what I keep reading on here.

 

[PracticeChampion]

I wonder how Rockwool soundproofing insulation would work? Probably similar to the cotton balls or the shredded acoustic foam.

I wonder how the weight of the different fillers changes. I really like the idea of no mess avoiding the expanding foam, but getting to 4 ounces is important from what I keep reading on here.

Short of filling with some solid based material the weight added from foam of any kind is very minimal