I don't need a handicap because I don't compete. I could compete, all I need is agreement from everyone in the competition on what rules apply for that competition. And I don't care about recognition from the USGA or the R&A for a hole-in-one. I know I did it and my playing partners know I did it and my wallet knows I did it - good enough for me and for everyone else who plays by rules that differ from USGA or R&A rules - who, by the way, far outnumber those who don't.
Why Pool Leagues Should Embrace “ALL BALL FOULS”
- Thread starter dr_dave
- Start date
spikey1006
New member
Utmost respect for your thoughtfulness and thoroughness, Dr. Dave! You have the greatest collection of great instructionals, for all levels of players. I have reviewed your reasoning on ALL BALL FOULS, and like all of it. However, us bar owners, who love our customers, and actually have to put up with a few of them, have had to make some compromises over the years. The BCA model, of cue ball fouls only, adopted many years ago, almost completely stopped the league foolishness, where a sore loser would claim an opponent’s hair or shirt touched a ball. The women’s leagues were particularly difficult, because many players were not used to “polite competition”. For bar owners and league operators that were getting phone calls at all hours, regarding the latest skirmish or hair pulling contest, this was a nightmare. Then we had a (very) few unscrupulous guys get into the act, when they thought they could get away with a cheap win. Those issues, almost entirely went away. We have used the exact methods that you described in the video. Being patient, always teaching, choosing another player to watch, and filming with cell phones, have lowered the intemperate people. Also, the golden rule that my parents laid down, for us, when we were managing teams, “Try not to argue, and be a good loser, as well as a good winner.” You don’t rub people’s nose in it, when you win, as tempting as it may be, at the time.
Thank you for your great work.
Mike Silber
Bastard!
I've played for over 55 years. To a lowest hcp index of 4.8, and I've never had one.
I hate you!
Neither have I, by some standards. I actually have two, and the first came when I was drunk (or hungover, not sure which).Bastard!
I've played for over 55 years. To a lowest hcp index of 4.8, and I've never had one.
I hate you!
Do the people that play in your league follow the rules set forth by the APA?
Or do you let them play by whatever rules everyone agrees upon?
I guess I don't understand the Fargo dig, I think Forgo works great, must be an APA thing.
I guess time will tell if all ball fouls will ever be accepted, right now one cant even say there is talk of eliminating cue ball only fouls, there is one new league right now that uses that format and it seems pretty popular right now. Where I play we tend not to have problems with people calling BS fouls on others or "bullying", if it was happening I like to think people would be on the look out for it and put an end to it pretty quick, I have had plenty of opponents call a foul on themselves without me even noticing.
James Briscoe
New member
I agree. Can you imagine the drama in APA alone?
If you know you know
Read my original reply in this thread and you'll have your answer.
Didn't you just say you can't compare your successes to others if you don't play by the same rule set? The rule sets behind the data going into FargoRate can vary wildly, so how can it work at all?
First, that wasn't my original reply. Second, it will suffice in this case anyway. Read the whole reply, not just the part you cherry-picked. Then apply it to APA competition. Beware though, you must be able to make the leap from "APA competition" to "APA rules" (does that really need to be explained?).You go ahead & cling real hard to this pov.
Remember what I earlier wrote……..for the integrity of the game………and that’s what rules are intended to do.
You are entitled to take your clubs, go to a golf course with friends & make up whatever game or rules you want.
As long as you do not negatively impact pace of play, no one really cares. You can call it golf even with mulligans,
10’ putt concessions, lift, clean & place, golf tees in fairway bunkers, whatever. As long as you have fun, that’s great.
Whatever floats your boat is a wonderful approach to enjoying your time spent doing anything is a wonderful approach.
The only distinction I’m making is it isn’t really poker if you declare deuces & one-eyed jacks and sevens as wild cards.
You are entitled to take your clubs, go to a golf course with friends & make up whatever game or rules you want.
As long as you do not negatively impact pace of play, no one really cares. You can call it golf even with mulligans,
10’ putt concessions, lift, clean & place, golf tees in fairway bunkers, whatever. As long as you have fun, that’s great.
Whatever floats your boat is a wonderful approach to enjoying your time spent doing anything is a wonderful approach.
The only distinction I’m making is it isn’t really poker if you declare deuces & one-eyed jacks and sevens as wild cards.
You don’t even know what the hell you write and when. Take a good look at when you entered this thread and what you wrote.
BTW your conclusion about a golf ball in the bush is completely wrong. That’s what you get when you don’t know and play by the rules set forth by the USGA.
I play by the same rules in practice, in league and in competition.
To me, the rules matter all of the time.
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I am sure it was a rhetorical question but Fargo only cares about wins. That’s the beauty, right? I know you are trying to reinforce your point.
I am in the camp of same table, same rules, no matter what the agreed upon rules are. I can tell you that, so far, I am the only one in my pool room to be broaching the topic. Honestly the new 1 hole DCC rules are causing the biggest hullabaloo. But even then, none seemed to know until I brought it up.
I am glad I play all my Fargo matches on Salotto, makes all of this moot…
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Great for you. You do you. Instead of bush, use the word hazard if you want, it's irrelevant to the point. The game is no fun for a beginner if they have to use the same rules as the pros.
I think we're in the same camp. The comment about Fargo was only intended for those who think you can't make a valid comparison between two players who have (1) never played each other, and (2) never played even one game, against anyone, under the same rule set. Either you can, or Fargo ratings are invalid. I don't care which is true, but you can't have it both ways.
How do you figure? Mike Page has proven time and time again that the table size is inconsequential, it doesn't matter what game the players are playing because it is a test of skill against each other at the time of competition, same goes for playing conditions, its not the player against the table like it is in golf.
How does this have anything to do with the conversation at hand??