Is isolated straight-stroke practice really worth the time???

[Lanten77]

Sometimes I get obsessed with straight-stroke mechanics. And this is what happened: One day recently, I started practicing Mighty X straight-ins, pocketing the ball AND following the cue ball into the pocket (8-foot table with 5-inch pockets). I know you'll find this hard to believe, but I somehow managed to pocket the ball AND follow the cue ball into the pocket 40 (yes, that forty) times in a row! And it wasn't a total fluke, because the day before, I followed it in 31 out of 35 attempts. (I'm currently no better than an APA 6 -- no Fargo rating -- only playing/practicing seriously for the past 3 years). I happened to have it all on video.

When I looked at the video, many, if not most, of the follow-throughs were NOT straight. Maybe only 5-10 were straight.

It's important, I believe, to develop a straight stroke. (At least I think it's important.....). After seeing that steered stroke on video, in an attempt to correct the stroke "flaws," I did videos of myself every day for a week to try to straighten out my stroke, doing the same straight-in follows. But it NEVER got consistently straight in the videos.

After a full week of that, for a couple of hours each day, it burned me out. And frustrated me.

(Yes, I know, there are plenty of examples of pros, maybe more the old-timers, who don't have straight strokes. But I still want to develop one).

Anyway... After that week of straight-stroke / video practice, I then struggled to follow the object ball into the pocket with the cue ball even THREE times in a row! That week also took the fun out of practicing, which I normally love -- even if I'm only doing drills -- so much so that I had to take a week off in order to get the desire back to get on the table again.

WHAT TO MAKE OF ALL THAT?? I HONESTLY DON'T KNOW.......

This YouTube link is a very typical, steered follow-through example, if you want to see it.

(And yes, then you can say what I said when I saw it: How the hell did you make that many in a row with that stroke!

I should probably add that, since I'm semi-retired, I spend a good bit of time, almost every day, watching pro matches and watching quality instructors on YouTube. And I have had some lessons. Plus, I get some good advice from an experienced tournament player friend.

(PS My career for 45 years has been as a tennis instructor specializing in technique and player development, so I'm familiar with what it takes to develop skills for a precision game like pool -- or tennis).

Thanks for your time reading this. Your comments are welcome.
Bob

 

[Bob Jewett]

It's important to have a consistent stroke.

The problem with a stroke that is consistent but not straight is that it needs to be consistent across all spins and speeds. I think that is easier to do with a straight stroke than a crooked one. I'm not sure that's true, but it seems reasonable. To do a study of beginners to see if a truly straight stroke developed skills faster would be hard and expensive.

A lot of players like the Mighty X, but I think there are much better drills at which you learn more. Start from the shots you have problems with in games. Unless long straight-ins are your only weakness, of course.

And, if you are less than about 75% success at a shot you are working on, make it easier and work up to the more challenging distance or angle.

 

[Lanten77]

It's important to have a consistent stroke.

The problem with a stroke that is consistent but not straight is that it needs to be consistent across all spins and speeds. I think that is easier to do with a straight stroke than a crooked one. I'm not sure that's true, but it seems reasonable. To do a study of beginners to see if a truly straight stroke developed skills faster would be hard and expensive.

A lot of players like the Mighty X, but I think there are much better drills at which you learn more. Start from the shots you have problems with in games. Unless long straight-ins are your only weakness, of course.

And, if you are less than about 75% success at a shot you are working on, make it easier and work up to the more challenging distance or angle.

Thanks, Bob. Yes I agree that it definitely does seem likely to be true that a straight stroke is an important foundation. Long straight-ins are actually not a problem for me (at least as far as pocketing the object ball goes) since I have done many thousands of them over the past few years. And even my stop shots often have almost no drift and only a 1/4 turn or so of unintended spin at that distance. But up to 3 diamonds or so the stop shots are somewhat often no drift or spin. But having the cue ball follow in does seem to magnify any even a very small stroke error. Although I will say that I've heard from a few high level, very experienced players that even they are still working on their stroke. So I'm probably being somewhat unrealistic at this point to expect a consistently straight stroke. So, the journey goes on...

 

[dquarasr]

Disclaimer: not an instructor!!

Been there, done that (more times than I care to admit).

Were you missing on both sides, or just to one side? This could point to the root cause if it’s mostly to one side.

And yes, when trying to correct an issue, your game has every likelihood of degrading, even significantly. Sometimes ya just gotta power through it until you get it back.

Best of luck!!!

 

[BRKNRUN]

Here is your "key"....You can't force a straight stroke.....I mean you can try to force it straight a million times "practicing" a straight stroke. but under pressure a "forced" straight stroke will fail. A crooked stroke is magnified by pressure, amount of force applied, or using english.

In reality.....the stroke is actually just a "result" of 4 non moving pieces....which is all you really can control. Grip, Stance, Posture, Alignment. Change any or all of them and it changes your stroke.....Your "natural" stroke....which is the one you want under pressure...is just a result of those 4 pieces. It must must must be natural.....Now if it is not perfectly straight but pockets balls all day long....(some pros) no need to change something that "naturally" works.....as long as it is not forced.

I use a device I 3D printed from time to time that goes on my tip and tells me if my stroke is crooked and/or twisting. I just adjust my grip, stance, posture, alignment so that It stays straight. I can play full racks with it on, and I can also use it to dial in actual amounts of 1/2 tip and full tip english.

Top one has the wings and will let you know if you are twisting the cue during the stroke. (curling your wrist)
Second one does the same as above but you can use the pointers on top to dial in tips of english (or center CB)
Third one is the one I would use to play full racks....It will still let you know if you are twisting on certain shots.....and the tips will help dial in reference to actual tip amounts being applied.


Also......Akin to the scotch tape on the tip practice routine.........I made a center ball practice cap. Get off center ball at all and you will miscue.

 

[Lanten77]

Disclaimer: not an instructor!!

Been there, done that (more times than I care to admit).

Were you missing on both sides, or just to one side? This could point to the root cause if it’s mostly to one side.

And yes, when trying to correct an issue, your game has every likelihood of degrading, even significantly. Sometimes ya just gotta power through it until you get it back.

Best of luck!!!

Thanks dq... Yes, the cue ball would tend to miss (follow) to the left a little, up to half a diamond or so sometimes. I pretty much know what the options were for why the cue ball was going left, and I don't think there was spin on the cue ball. Diagnostically, since my back hand was going to the right and the tip going to the left, I'm assuming that the stroke was going a little left at contact rather than inadvertent spin on the cue ball. But I can't say that I'm sure about that.. I'm seeing a good instructor soon again so maybe they can decipher what's going on . Thanks again

 

[Lanten77]

Here is your "key"....You can't force a straight stroke.....I mean you can try to force it straight a million times "practicing" a straight stroke. but under pressure a "forced" straight stroke will fail. A crooked stroke is magnified by pressure, amount of force applied, or using english.

In reality.....the stroke is actually just a "result" of 4 non moving pieces....which is all you really can control. Grip, Stance, Posture, Alignment. Change any or all of them and it changes your stroke.....Your "natural" stroke....which is the one you want under pressure...is just a result of those 4 pieces. It must must must be natural.....Now if it is not perfectly straight but pockets balls all day long....(some pros) no need to change something that "naturally" works.....as long as it is not forced.

I use a device I 3D printed from time to time that goes on my tip and tells me if my stroke is crooked and/or twisting. I just adjust my grip, stance, posture, alignment so that It stays straight. I can play full racks with it on, and I can also use it to dial in actual amounts of 1/2 tip and full tip english.
View attachment 919889
Top one has the wings and will let you know if you are twisting the cue during the stroke. (curling your wrist)
Second one does the same as above but you can use the pointers on top to dial in tips of english (or center CB)
Third one is the one I would use to play full racks....It will still let you know if you are twisting on certain shots.....and the tips will help dial in reference to actual tip amounts being applied.


Also......Akin to the scotch tape on the tip practice routine.........I made a center ball practice cap. Get off center ball at all and you will miscue.
View attachment 919892

View attachment 919891

Thank you BRKNRUN... It's an appealing concept that it "must must must be natural." And also that the straightness of the stroke is a "result" of the other four setup elements.

It certainly feels better not to try to force the straightness of it. But I still have this nagging suspicion that if it's not more consistently straight in the follow through, then it may well often not be straight at contact either, even though obviously many times it is straight at that instant of contact.

But I love your assumption that if the four set up elements are correct it will lead toward a straight stroke, rather than forcing a straight stroke. I do pay a lot of attention to those four elements you mentioned, but certainly some modification to one or more of them could make the difference to end up with a more naturally straight stroke.

I'm going to see an experienced instructor next week , so maybe they will be able to pick up on what's currently making it UNnatural to be straight...

Got back on the table today after a couple of weeks and everything felt great, of course (and more natural). I didn't attempt to do the mighty X follow the cue ball in drill though, except for one time and the cue ball did follow in. So I smartly quit while I was ahead!!

PS. LOVE your 3D training aids. I have used crude versions of those for the same reasons. (And vision center gadgets also). Looks like you could market those?! Of course if they started to sell well, 100 other people would copy you

Thanks again!