Do the top one pocket players almost never shoot that spin transfer shot when there are two balls frozen on the spot?

[jtompilot]

The shot I’m referring to is usually after someone scratches and two balls get frozen to the spot. You hit the top ball with a lot of draw at an angle to transfer follow to that ball and it goes towards their pocket, and IIRC the second ball goes a few rails towards their pocket as well. I don’t think I’ve seen anyone shoot this shot in recent memory. I think the last time I saw someone shoot it was Efren some years ago. Is the shot considered not reliable and has a potential to sell out?

I shoot this shot often, yes I’ve sold out but I also make or hang one also. I was better at it years ago when I had a more reliable stroke.

 

[Mensabum]

The back ball two rail bank is a lot easier to make. I used to bet I could make it given two tries. Looking back, I think I'm about even on that bet. Three tries would be in your favor to make it.

Back ball one rail.

 

[Mensabum]

I think variations in equipment -- cloth and condition of the balls -- make reliable outcomes on this shot, well, unreliable.

I can only think of one guy that would always shoot it and he was pretty good at it. Everyone else is going to play the safe. If I'm feeling jiggy with it I'll occasionally shoot the back ball two rail bank with the CB going three rails... but I have to be in pretty good mood and already torturing the other guy.

Lou Figueroa

Why not one rail??

 

[lfigueroa]

Why not one rail??

er, because it would drop in a neutral up table pocket?

Lou Figueroa
I hate trick questions

 

[bbb]

Why not one rail??

if you mean the back ball coming off the side rail
for me its harder to hit and often you leave a cross bank if you miss

 

[bbb]

conventional wisdom is if you need 2 you shoot it
if you need 1 you play the safe
billy incardona has said he shoots it needing 1 or 2 since he likes the shot and is good at it
if you want to grind you play safe regardless of how many you need
or if you are not comfortable with the shot
jmho

 

[straightline]

er, because it would drop in a neutral up table pocket?

Lou Figueroa
I hate trick questions

Not if you shot it from underneath. Could also cross it from either side.

 

[Mensabum]

if you mean the back ball coming off the side rail
for me its harder to hit and often you leave a cross bank if you miss

An experienced one pocket player would know this, yes??

 

[Mensabum]

conventional wisdom is if you need 2 you shoot it
if you need 1 you play the safe
billy incardona has said he shoots it needing 1 or 2 since he likes the shot and is good at it
if you want to grind you play safe regardless of how many you need
or if you are not comfortable with the shot
jmho

Makes sense.

 

[Mensabum]

er, because it would drop in a neutral up table pocket?

Lou Figueroa
I hate trick questions

No trick, just ignorance.

 

[bbb]

An experienced one pocket player would know this, yes??

yes
but some players practice it and like it

 

[Mensabum]

yes
but some players practice it and like it

Good to know.

 

[Frosty]

The spot of the balls has to be right, I almost always shoot it because I spent a lot of time on it.

 

[lfigueroa]

No trick, just ignorance.

So look, that's a tough shot.

The CB is going to go two rails and if you don't make you're selling something out. This is a shot that is especially sensitive to how fast the table is playing.

Generally speaking, though I've made it, I'm not even thinking about it.

Lou Figueroa

 

[maha]

shooting the head ball to make it. with just 2 on the table and needing just one now. playing safe has him at a 3 to 1 dog max. or less dog if you are doing that. with him shooting next.

shooting it correctly and well, most times will put you under or around the 3 to 1 average chance favorite. as the times you make it or hang it increase your winning chances.

 

[straightline]

with just 2 on the table playing safe bumps you over the 3 to 1 dog if you are doing that. with him shooting next.

shooting it correctly most times will put you under or around the 2 to 1 average chance.

This is regardless of the actual layout?

 

[maha]

fixed my badly written post #35 which was not easy to understand.

 

[bbb]

fixed my badly written post #35 which was not easy to understand.

thanks @maha
i deleted my post

 

[cuetechasaurus]

I shoot this shot often, yes I’ve sold out but I also make or hang one also. I was better at it years ago when I had a more reliable stroke.

I enjoy seeing it executed perfectly. I remember you were quite good at it Tom! I think I first saw the shot at Plush Pocket now that I think of it. I wish that I had developed the passion for one pocket back then that I have now.

 

[iusedtoberich]

Wait a minute, isn't that head ball force through actually used MORE times than not, by the top pros? (depending on the score and other ball positions of course)