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Krupa asked of Chris: "That we're 30 pages into a thread you started and you still haven't released your opinion, but you're willing to periodically pipe up to stir the pot, leads me to believe that you're a very subtle troll." It could be that Chris is leaning toward the "dark" side. Darth...

Tank69 stated "I think the important thing here is if you foul and nobody saw it but you, is it still a foul? I've fouled before, nobody saw it, but I called it. Not that I was looking to see if someone saw it, I go by the reaction of my opponent when I tell him I fouled. Just because he...

Krupa stated: "Can you show me the rule that says that in the absence of a referee, the only person who can call a foul is the non-shooter? I will concede that there is no rule explicitly stating that a shooter must self-call. But where is the rule that explicitly prohibits a player from...

Funny thing..... If I follow the rules and self call the foul...I'm labeled a saint. If I follow the rules and continue shooting....I'm labeled a cheating scumbag. My position is that as long as you follow the rules, you're OK with me. I won't judge you either way.

Justadub stated: "All this just sounds like coming up with reasons to justify breaking the rules. "They didn't catch me (call it) so it really isn't a foul." I think you missed the point. THIS IS THE RULE!!!! I'm not making this up to prove a point. If the foul is not called, then it...

Krupa stated: "Your logic says that the other team should have jumped up screaming "FOUL" and since they didn't, it's not only their fault that we kept shooting but we were wrong for not continuing our inning." You're half right. Depending on which rules you follow, only the player or team...

Miniac stated: "The word "considered" in the wording of the rule does not mean that a foul steadfastly did NOT happen, just that for the sake of continuing play it was "swept under the rug" so to speak, as no one at that point had called it." I get the general sense of your statement and I...

JB Case stated: "That's right a foul that no one sees but the shooter is UP TO THE SHOOTER to decide if they want to honor the rule governing the foul or to ignore and move on to the next shot or simply and silently deny the opponent the ball in hand that they are entitled to. If something...

JB cases stated: "I already won the debate such as it is because a foul is a foul whether it's called or not. " "The penalty for a committing fouls are clearly stated in the rules" You've won no debate that I can see. Why? Because the penalty for committing a foul, that is not called, is...

The BCA rule states: Any foul not called before the next stroke is taken is considered to have not occurred. This rule, in and of itself stipulates indirectly that a foul is not the end of the shooters inning....which so many here, have used as a foundation to support their position in favor...

Eagleman.....there may still be some ambiguity regarding the APA rule. The actual language is: ONLY THE PLAYER OR THE TEAM CAPTAIN MAY OFFICIALLY CALL A FOUL although anyone may suggest to the player or the team captain that a foul should be called. While it may seem apparent that the team...

Here's the ruling from the BCA rule book. Any foul not called before the next stroke is taken is considered to have not occurred. That's pretty powerful!!! Why should anyone be accountable to self call a foul since the moment my opponent shoots....it never happened! I can sit down and he...

Chris asked: Is there not a higher law than a "rulebook?" Good question. If there is it would have to be a "Universal law" that all players were opperating under. Otherwise, we are back to infusing personal interpretations that simply cloud the issue.

Since we have now determied that according to the APA, it is against the rules to call a foul on yourself, we also open the door to the fact that your opponent can refuse to call the foul if it works to their advantage despite the fact that you have attempted to circumvent the rules by calling...

Absolutely....YES!

Here's an interesting "Rule" from the APA rule book ONLY THE PLAYER OR THE TEAM CAPTAIN MAY OFFICIALLY CALL A FOUL although anyone may suggest to the player or the team captain that a foul should be called. It seems to me that they are referring to the person or team captain who is not...

I'm curious...is there a distinction between breaking a rule and commiting a foul. It's easy to clump them together but there may be distinctions. Does there have to be intent for a rule to be broken? With a lack of intent is it then nothing more than a foul? Obviuosly, the rule book states...

Eagleman, you and I have tried to put this issue in perspective for more than 10 pages. Let me assure you, there is no amount of logic that will make sense to those who refuse to open their mind. There is no level of reason for those who are committed to their mindset. Despite the fact that...

Chris, you're right, this thread has followed many tracks but in truth there was never one track to follow. As long as there is diversity in value systems and people choose to interject their own moral code into the rules there will be varying opinions. It's odd that, as a nation, we pride...

JBCase stated: "This is like if you owe someone $50 and you pay him $40 but he thinks you paid the whole $50 do you tell him and pay the rest? Or do you charge him $10 for his mistake?" Since when is a loan a competitive event? If the lender was a bank and it was a bank error....how many now...