14.1 Straight Pool Foul

[Double-Dave]

In an "un refereed' match, it is 'cue ball fouls only'

Since the incoming player only moved the object ball, play would stop and opponent would place the object ball back into the original position or leave it where it is.

If the incoming player 'B' moves the ball and doesn't stop play (takes it upon himself to replace the object ball) this could be considered a foul, and in some cases, 'unsportsman like conduct' with forfieture of match or at the minimum a 'warning'.

Player B's turn at the table (under normal circumstances) does not start until the cue ball passes the head string. If player B commits a foul (moving balls and not letting them be restored by his opponent) he could be given a foul (minus 15 points) for unsportsman like conduct or forfieture of match.

If the 'unsportsman like conduct' is enforced, Player A could get a 15 ball rack and have player B break under opening game conditions. Two Object balls to the rail plus the cue ball or it is considered a foul.

I thank you very much for the time and effort you obviously put into your answer, which seems to answer this question for pretty much the whole world. However, as I mentioned later in the topic, and I will edit the first post, in europe all games are all-ball foul, which is pretty much the only difference in the rules that I can think of, but in this case obviously it makes a big difference. So keeping that in mind, what would your answer be?

 

[macguy]

I thank you very much for the time and effort you obviously put into your answer, which seems to answer this question for pretty much the whole world. However, as I mentioned later in the topic, and I will edit the first post, in europe all games are all-ball foul, which is pretty much the only difference in the rules that I can think of, but in this case obviously it makes a big difference. So keeping that in mind, what would your answer be?

I think it would be the same answer. Play has not yet begun again since players A's scratch took place.

 

[Tom In Cincy]

I thank you very much for the time and effort you obviously put into your answer, which seems to answer this question for pretty much the whole world. However, as I mentioned later in the topic, and I will edit the first post, in europe all games are all-ball foul, which is pretty much the only difference in the rules that I can think of, but in this case obviously it makes a big difference. So keeping that in mind, what would your answer be?

Player B's turn (with ball in hand in the kitchen) does not start until the cue ball passes the head string. He can be given a foul for touching the object balls (they can still be replaced to their original position), but it is still his turn until the cue ball passes the headstring.

Both players are now on One Foul.

If Player B 'intentionally' moves the object ball, it can also be considered a 'deliberate' foul (minus 15 points, rerack and break under opening break conditions.) or, in the worst case, forfieture of game/match and Disqualification.

Hope this covers your situation.

 

[Double-Dave]

That does seem to be the answer. However there is as you probably know a general rule about fouls that states in it first point that your turn at the table is over. Does this not apply in this case, can you make a foul and still be the player at the table? Once again many thanks for your time and effort.

 

[Tom In Cincy]

That does seem to be the answer. However there is as you probably know a general rule about fouls that states in it first point that your turn at the table is over. Does this not apply in this case, can you make a foul and still be the player at the table? Once again many thanks for your time and effort.

In your example, and the 'all ball fouls' rule you play by, the player with cue ball in hand behind the line, is a perfect example of the incoming player being assess a foul and still being the 'shooter'.

One of the reasons the World Standard Rules are being re-written this year. There are situations that require re-wording of the rules for clarification. There was a 5 year moritorium on the rules when Pocket Billiards was being considered an olympic event. Now that the olympics is out of the picture, the rules can be updated.

Prior to the 'cue ball must pass the headstring' to start your turn, the rule left an option for the incoming player to freeze the cue ball onto the corner pocket facing (thus blocking a clear shot to the rack area), of course the shooter would be taking an intentional foul, but also tying up his opponent.

In your rules, with the 'all ball foul' there should be a stipulation that would prevent such unsportsmanlike manuvers. Intentionally touching a ball in a rack should be grounds for 'unsportsmanship', Disqualification.

But, if you were really smart about BIH. When the opponent took a foul and left the cue ball against the bottom rail, you could state that the 'cue ball in position' was "BIH behind the line" NOT where the player left it before the foul.

At least that is the way I would have to rule the situation