Acs bca team events

tksix

tksix

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Recently the Illinois State ACS rankings came out for the state tourney and they have shuffled the "rankings deck" on the players. This led to probably hundreds of conversations I am sure.

Let me say that I AGREE with the various levels: standard, open, advanced, master. However, when it pertains to teams it still just creates a nightmare of a situation to put a team together at the state level. We need to be able to accommodate everyone here, and I have an idea and would like your comments.

First when it comes to "status" I believe once at a level you STAY at a level. No bidding to get dropped. This would eliminate a portion of the BS.

As for teams, make an open team an OPEN team!! Meaning ONLY open or lower level players allowed. NO advanced NO master. This will start the weeding out process of players hiding. Then create an advance team level allowing one master per team. Now you can stack as best you can. If there are enough masters create a masters team division.

I know at Nationals some of this already exists, and also at some state levels. Illinois has not gotten there yet, but they are trying.

I guess the overall point is don't allow anyone to be dropped, and don't allow anyone other that open players to play in the open team event. This would also push the better players up to there level increasing the prize funds up top.

Mike
 
Why shouldn't people be able to move back down? Last year at our BCA regional, our team was comprised of 2 master players that had been lowered to A after petitioning, myself(A), a player that got moved to A from league play and another A that finished high enough in the A singles to make it to master. We made it a couple spots into the money.

Iirc, in our 9b mixed event, the 3 person team can have 1 master on it. In 8b, no masters on the mixed teams. We also have a pretty big event, so there are a fair number of mixed(A and below), B-below and master teams. As long as the rules are known up front, it shouldn't been too big of a deal.

Not sure how you can weed people out who are trying to stay low, other than the usual methods. Just because you eliminate some people from the bracket doesn't mean that they're going to suddenly finish in the top on accident.

Here they've decided to, imho, mess with the ratings. The following is their "guidelines", which I've e-mailed them about to say that, again imho, they're seriously flawed..

League Operator ‘B’ Rating Guidelines

League Operators: This is just a reminder that all new WBCA players will start in Men'sA or Women' A at Regional's unless the League Operator and Player have filled out the New Player Rating Form and sent it and the Player's League Stats to the Competition Committee for review and approval prior to playing at Regionals .Here are some guidelines for placement of new players in a lower division if you don't feel they should be in the Men'sA or Women'sA division:
•Pool History: Never placed in a big tournament, may play in weekly tournaments, but seldom places or wins; winning against master level players is at most 10-15% but probably less; has little to no gambling experience.
•Knowledge: Has about 20% cue ball control, gets out 20-30% of easy outs and might never play safe, doesn’t know many shots or fundamentals.
•Focus: Plays/practices about 1-3 hours a week, plays for fun wins against same level players 40-50% of time, Desires to win most of the time, and has minimal playing stamina and makes 50% mistakes.
•League stats: Might break and run out an 8-ball rack 1 in 20 times, and 1 inning games (after opponents balls are gone) or with ball in hand 3 in 10 times, if played in APA league and has a ranking 5 or lower.
 
Can't drop rating?

tksix said:
Recently the Illinois State ACS rankings came out for the state tourney and they have shuffled the "rankings deck" on the players. This led to probably hundreds of conversations I am sure.

Let me say that I AGREE with the various levels: standard, open, advanced, master. However, when it pertains to teams it still just creates a nightmare of a situation to put a team together at the state level. We need to be able to accommodate everyone here, and I have an idea and would like your comments.

First when it comes to "status" I believe once at a level you STAY at a level. No bidding to get dropped. This would eliminate a portion of the BS.

As for teams, make an open team an OPEN team!! Meaning ONLY open or lower level players allowed. NO advanced NO master. This will start the weeding out process of players hiding. Then create an advance team level allowing one master per team. Now you can stack as best you can. If there are enough masters create a masters team division.

I know at Nationals some of this already exists, and also at some state levels. Illinois has not gotten there yet, but they are trying.

I guess the overall point is don't allow anyone to be dropped, and don't allow anyone other that open players to play in the open team event. This would also push the better players up to there level increasing the prize funds up top.

Mike
Click to expand...

I'm guessing you're a young fella.

Age, illness and injury are among things that can prevent someone from playing at the level they did when they were younger.
 
Maybe you can explain it to me if i'm wrong, but i don't see the difference when it comes to teams. If a player placed in the top 4% in the past, they were going to be a master. Now, there's an advanced division before masters, but you can still only play one player that is above an open level.
 
BANKS / DONNY: I am not that young, and yes I feel there should always be exceptions to the rule.

CHI JOE: The difference in the team event is that most everyone complains about stacked teams. So to eliminate that leave open teams OPEN players only. Also, with the new rules in Illinois and NO advanced team division they may have less teams than last year.................because many players got moved to the advanced level (which I am not complaining about and agree with).


By leaving higher level players the ability to play in the Open, you are always setting yourself up for hiding. And I know hiding will go on, but this could minimize it.
 
tksix said:
BANKS / DONNY: I am not that young, and yes I feel there should always be exceptions to the rule.

CHI JOE: The difference in the team event is that most everyone complains about stacked teams. So to eliminate that leave open teams OPEN players only. Also, with the new rules in Illinois and NO advanced team division they may have less teams than last year.................because many players got moved to the advanced level (which I am not complaining about and agree with).


By leaving higher level players the ability to play in the Open, you are always setting yourself up for hiding. And I know hiding will go on, but this could minimize it.
Click to expand...

Maybe I just haven't been awake long enough, but I'm still not following your logic. Why would people be hiding more if higher level players were allowed on Open teams? Wouldn't that mean they're still allowed to progress somewhat without severe repurcussions? If there were only Masters and B-below/Open, why would anyone even bother becoming an A? I think what you're suggesting would only encourage more bagging.

I think that it's a huge problem to just start moving large chunks of players to A. They started doing that here, as with that rating guideline stuff above. Now you've got APA 6's and weak 7's that will get absolutely destroyed in the A's for years unless they commit to some serious improvement. I was a 7/9 and had some rough matches in the B tournament. A few friends were already rated as A's, mostly from league play, but I had a winning record against them.. not sure how long it'll be before they're making their entry fees back in the A singles.

It would be like moving people up to an APA 7 because you don't have enough of them. It doesn't make them one and it only buggers the system and gives them a false sense of where they're at. Try taking one of those inflated A's to nationals.. they'd probably get slaughtered in the Open.
 
I am not suggesting to move players just to move them, but your quote " why would anyone bother becoming an A" is my point exactly! The lines have always been blurry in the rankings area, and I think they are trying to correct that. Which is good. But now it is harder to put a team together because they are STILL allowing the lines to be crossed.

My point is a higher level player can't play down in a singles event.................so do not let higher level players play down in the team event either. this will add more players to the higher levels as a matter of course because they are not allowed to play down, so there is no longer a reason to hide in the open.

The history of our leagues is that players hid so they can play on an open team, more teams, more money.

I hope that helps explain my thought................

Mike
 
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