Adams/Helmsteder?

[JimBo]

Well I won't comment on taste or what someone will pay. I can tell you at the show in PA they never sell that high. In fact there was a Galaxie that was the nicest example I have seen and at 1300 didn't get a sniff. Now if a Ritz sold for 1200, God bless the seller. Well actually he already did. I do know the market and I know I can make the statement I made. Myself and other dealers won't touch Adam cues because there isn't a call for them and there certainly are not enough Adam collectors. So its not just me, its the market in general.



Joe

Joe is right, there is not much of a market for older Adams cues and the bluebook pricing has been flawed since day 1, unfortunatly I don't see that changing even with the new one.

Jim

 

[drivermaker]

You've always been a clown also.

Jim

Thanks buddy...lay some more out there so I can finally have some heat taken away from me.

 

[drivermaker]

Well I won't comment on taste or what someone will pay. I can tell you at the show in PA they never sell that high. In fact there was a Galaxie that was the nicest example I have seen and at 1300 didn't get a sniff. Now if a Ritz sold for 1200, God bless the seller. Well actually he already did. I do know the market and I know I can make the statement I made. Myself and other dealers won't touch Adam cues because there isn't a call for them and there certainly are not enough Adam collectors. So its not just me, its the market in general.

Case in point: Adam AH/12

Joe

I agree with you and Jimbo. If I was a dealer I probably would feel the same way. There certainly are not enough Adam collectors. However, the pool BUYING PUBLIC outnumbers dealers by the millions. And somewhere down the line, there are a few people out there that played with one or used to own one that would pay a premium just to have that cue back, even if it's for sentimental value and not to make money. We ALL can think back to something years back...whether it's an old funky Mali, McDermott, Meucci, or whatever. There's always a buyer for something to be sold. Otherwise, you wouldn't have yard sales, garage sales, or ebay.

 

[matthew staton]

I agree with you and Jimbo. If I was a dealer I probably would feel the same way. There certainly are not enough Adam collectors. However, the pool BUYING PUBLIC outnumbers dealers by the millions. And somewhere down the line, there are a few people out there that played with one or used to own one that would pay a premium just to have that cue back, even if it's for sentimental value and not to make money. We ALL can think back to something years back...whether it's an old funky Mali, McDermott, Meucci, or whatever. There's always a buyer for something to be sold. Otherwise, you wouldn't have yard sales, garage sales, or ebay.

LOL it's all fun I don't realy care I glad i could help ya drivermaker stuck in the house it's raining would rather go golfing...

 

[JimBo]

I agree with you and Jimbo. If I was a dealer I probably would feel the same way. There certainly are not enough Adam collectors. However, the pool BUYING PUBLIC outnumbers dealers by the millions. And somewhere down the line, there are a few people out there that played with one or used to own one that would pay a premium just to have that cue back, even if it's for sentimental value and not to make money. We ALL can think back to something years back...whether it's an old funky Mali, McDermott, Meucci, or whatever. There's always a buyer for something to be sold. Otherwise, you wouldn't have yard sales, garage sales, or ebay.

Selling the cue was never the problem, the price was the problem. You need a market. Think baseball cards, sure there was a kid who's favorite player was Joe Black but his card is worth $400 while the Mick's is $25,000, and finding the few kids who liked Joe and are willing to pay that isn't as easy. So yeah a few people prolly played with that cue and loved it, but they have to want it and want to spend the money and then you have to find them. So sure he can wish and dream and list it (for $1,000)on E-bay for years and years or he can sell it at what the market will give and that ain't close to $1,000. But there is an ass for every seat so I wish everyone luck.

Jim

 

[Matt_24]

All Adam cues from day one have been imports. Adam / Helmstetter are from the same factory. The buttcap you have is correct, but normally they would break. There was no bumper on your cue, and its as it should be. As far as value, the BB is no where near correct on the value of these cues. I have never seen one sell over 500 dollars. That doesn't mean yours won't, its just a flaw in the pricing.

Joe (---I have seen people ask 1200 for the Monte Carlo

Joe,

Didn't Richard Helmstetter START Helmstetter cues in Japan, made a fortune (and might still make a fortune off of them...I hear a lot of overseas players play with Helmstetters) and now I believe is the President of R&D for Callway Golf, developing little drivers we know as Big Bertha along with other products?

I wouldn't discount older Japanese cues. I'm honestly not that familiar with them, but I do know a *bit* about the electric guitar "collecting" market. At one point Japan-made Fenders (Fender Japan) and Gibsons (specifically Gibson Japan which was called Orville at that time) were considered cheap (just because they were imports), until people started realizing that the quality was equal or higher than the American made equivalents. Now, guitars that were sold in the states pretty cheap are going for 3 or 4 times their previous asking price.

Now, I've never examined an older Adam's cue, but can anyone tell me how their basic construction is quality wise, compared to an American cue made from the same time? It seems to me though I've heard very good things about the higher end Helmstetter cues.

 

[Matt_24]

Well Joe...that's not always the case and not true. I know for a fact that an AH-10 Ritz recently sold for $1,200 that was in dynamite shape. And that wasn't as expensive as a Monte Carlo when they were new.

I happen to own a Ritz that's pristine and I don't care whether it's an import or not, nor that it wasn't ranked up there among the elite cues or cuemakers when they were made back in the 70's and 80's...but that cue has to be one of the MOST SOLID and finest hitting cues that I've ever gotten my hands on and hit. It also has a classic Balabushka design that survives the test of time. Cues will sell for what the market will bear and whatever the buyer feels it is worth, and you know that.

Does the Blue Book of Cues explain more about the Adams/Helmstetter company? I'm in the process of bidding on one (and it's not cheap already) on ebay. Is there a website with more information/history on these cues?

Thanks,

 

[drivermaker]

Does the Blue Book of Cues explain more about the Adams/Helmstetter company? I'm in the process of bidding on one (and it's not cheap already) on ebay. Is there a website with more information/history on these cues?

Thanks,

Adam/Helmstetter is IN the Blue Book of Cues. The bio is primarily about Richard Helmstetter and how he started. They do devote a good number of pages to the different lines and models of cues over the years that date back from the 70's.

I haven't gone on the website, but Competition Sports is the distributor of the Adam/Helmstetter/Balabushka line. See what you can find there, or get their phone number and just call the company and ask to talk to someone. They're in New York.

 

[JPB]

"Didn't Richard Helmstetter START Helmstetter cues in Japan, made a fortune (and might still make a fortune off of them...I hear a lot of overseas players play with Helmstetters) and now I believe is the President of R&D for Callway Golf, developing little drivers we know as Big Bertha along with other products?"


I don't know exactly how Helmstetter started making cues, but he got his start in golf club making because of his cuemaking. You may recall Callaway started making some retro clubs in the '80's. They had a repro of Bobby Jones's Calamity Jane putter and some other clubs. My recollection is they wanted to make new hickory shafts and needed somebody with a background of engineering wood to hit things with. So he linked up with Ely Callaway and ended up making some pretty successful golf clubs out of materials other than wood, LOL.

 

[Matt_24]

I don't know exactly how Helmstetter started making cues, but he got his start in golf club making because of his cuemaking. You may recall Callaway started making some retro clubs in the '80's. They had a repro of Bobby Jones's Calamity Jane putter and some other clubs. My recollection is they wanted to make new hickory shafts and needed somebody with a background of engineering wood to hit things with. So he linked up with Ely Callaway and ended up making some pretty successful golf clubs out of materials other than wood, LOL.[/QUOTE]

Yeah, he's definitely THE most successful cuemaker ever. I didn't say best...just most successful. He's a millionaire one hundred times over. I really need to hurry up and buy the Blue Book so I can read up on some of these interesting cuemakers/companies.

 

[classiccues]

Joe,

Didn't Richard Helmstetter START Helmstetter cues in Japan, made a fortune (and might still make a fortune off of them...I hear a lot of overseas players play with Helmstetters) and now I believe is the President of R&D for Callway Golf, developing little drivers we know as Big Bertha along with other products?

I wouldn't discount older Japanese cues. I'm honestly not that familiar with them, but I do know a *bit* about the electric guitar "collecting" market. At one point Japan-made Fenders (Fender Japan) and Gibsons (specifically Gibson Japan which was called Orville at that time) were considered cheap (just because they were imports), until people started realizing that the quality was equal or higher than the American made equivalents. Now, guitars that were sold in the states pretty cheap are going for 3 or 4 times their previous asking price.

Now, I've never examined an older Adam's cue, but can anyone tell me how their basic construction is quality wise, compared to an American cue made from the same time? It seems to me though I've heard very good things about the higher end Helmstetter cues.

Matt,
Cues ain't guitars lol. But seriously, the Adam cues are very nice. That era the cues were almost as nice as Palmers, some might be nicer. I think they are under appreciated, but hey thats not my problem. I think that they are very good quality, especially those early cues. the points are usually very good, the inlays etc.. Its just not something that is collected here, PLUS since they did have a very good production line there maybe double as many as Palmers from the same era.

Joe (---had a 79 Dean XL, might get a Warlock cause I am a metal head and I always liked em' lol