Added money and lack of participation

[kryptonite9]

I have often seen on this forum that pool hall owners should "step up" and add money to tournaments to spark participation. I have often agreed until an incident last night.

A local owner offered a $1000 gauranteed invitational tournament for a end of session reward to players who competed in his Wednesday handicap tournaments that session. The ideas was 32 players at $25 per person, NO TABLE TIME, and $200 ADDED!!! But regardless of the attendence he was going to honor the $1000 gaurantee. For the $25 entry you got to play all night (until the tournament was over), and a shot at $400 first place. It is also handicapped fairly, so everyone has a shot.

55 players were invited. 19 showed up. Players who continually complain about no money in local tournaments were not there. Players who don't play in open tournaments because they are too hard were not there. Players who complain about table time or greens fees were not there.

I was shocked. It does not look good for the future of the sport when an owner goes out of his way to promote the game and participation in tournaments and noone appreciates it.

Is this the status of pool in your area? Are local tournaments, open or handicapped, dead or really slow? What about in-house leagues?

 

[Jude Rosenstock]

I have often seen on this forum that pool hall owners should "step up" and add money to tournaments to spark participation. I have often agreed until an incident last night.

A local owner offered a $1000 gauranteed invitational tournament for a end of session reward to players who competed in his Wednesday handicap tournaments that session. The ideas was 32 players at $25 per person, NO TABLE TIME, and $200 ADDED!!! But regardless of the attendence he was going to honor the $1000 gaurantee. For the $25 entry you got to play all night (until the tournament was over), and a shot at $400 first place. It is also handicapped fairly, so everyone has a shot.

55 players were invited. 19 showed up. Players who continually complain about no money in local tournaments were not there. Players who don't play in open tournaments because they are too hard were not there. Players who complain about table time or greens fees were not there.

I was shocked. It does not look good for the future of the sport when an owner goes out of his way to promote the game and participation in tournaments and noone appreciates it.

Is this the status of pool in your area? Are local tournaments, open or handicapped, dead or really slow? What about in-house leagues?

You can't look at one tournament and immediately assume this is sufficient evidence on the state of pool - positive OR negative. There are so many other things to consider here. In New York City, equipment is important for a lot of players. Unless they're giving away the farm, players will not show up to play on subpar equipment. Handicaps are good but if the guy running the tournament is not respected, it could keep people away. Also, in New York, there are few places to play. Your area might have a strong competing room that also had an event that day.

 

[highrun55]

I have often seen on this forum that pool hall owners should "step up" and add money to tournaments to spark participation. I have often agreed until an incident last night.

A local owner offered a $1000 gauranteed invitational tournament for a end of session reward to players who competed in his Wednesday handicap tournaments that session. The ideas was 32 players at $25 per person, NO TABLE TIME, and $200 ADDED!!! But regardless of the attendence he was going to honor the $1000 gaurantee. For the $25 entry you got to play all night (until the tournament was over), and a shot at $400 first place. It is also handicapped fairly, so everyone has a shot.

55 players were invited. 19 showed up. Players who continually complain about no money in local tournaments were not there. Players who don't play in open tournaments because they are too hard were not there. Players who complain about table time or greens fees were not there.

I was shocked. It does not look good for the future of the sport when an owner goes out of his way to promote the game and participation in tournaments and noone appreciates it.

Is this the status of pool in your area? Are local tournaments, open or handicapped, dead or really slow? What about in-house leagues?

Tap Tap Tap,
Exactly

highrun55

 

[ScottW]

A local owner offered a $1000 gauranteed invitational tournament for a end of session reward to players who competed in his Wednesday handicap tournaments that session. The ideas was 32 players at $25 per person, NO TABLE TIME, and $200 ADDED!!! But regardless of the attendence he was going to honor the $1000 gaurantee. For the $25 entry you got to play all night (until the tournament was over), and a shot at $400 first place. It is also handicapped fairly, so everyone has a shot.

You don't really say flat out, but I'm assuming that the end-of-session tournament was the same night of the week as the regular league night. Am I wrong?

Assuming that's the case - leagues generally run two to four hours. Tournaments run far longer. It could well be a lot of the invited players passed on it, as they didn't want to be up all hours of the night on a weeknight (what with work/school/whatever the next day).

 

[ShootingArts]

with a few assumptions, it does seem ridiculous

Well first I have to make a few assumptions: Assuming that the event was held on Wednesday night, the same night they had been playing all season, and assuming the vast majority of these 55 invitees had played the last part of the league season, it does seem ridiculous that only 19 showed for what was basically a thank you party from the room owner.

At my local short track the first race of the new season was the points championship race for the previous season. It was an invitational, you had to have ran a certain number of races the previous season to be eligible. I had sold my car and the new one wasn't ready. A local owner came to me and offered his car, risking thousands of dollars, for me to have a car to run in the race. Few if any people who qualified didn't run the race each year.

Likewise, my local shooting range has an end of season invitational championship for the people that have competed in the weekly events, usually at least five if I remember correctly. The turnout is huge with pretty much everyone that is eligible turning out, rain or shine, hot or cold.

Maybe more to the story but on the face of things, it does appear ridiculous that only about a third of eligible players turned up.

Hu

I have often seen on this forum that pool hall owners should "step up" and add money to tournaments to spark participation. I have often agreed until an incident last night.

A local owner offered a $1000 gauranteed invitational tournament for a end of session reward to players who competed in his Wednesday handicap tournaments that session. The ideas was 32 players at $25 per person, NO TABLE TIME, and $200 ADDED!!! But regardless of the attendence he was going to honor the $1000 gaurantee. For the $25 entry you got to play all night (until the tournament was over), and a shot at $400 first place. It is also handicapped fairly, so everyone has a shot.

55 players were invited. 19 showed up. Players who continually complain about no money in local tournaments were not there. Players who don't play in open tournaments because they are too hard were not there. Players who complain about table time or greens fees were not there.

 

[Zims Rack]

What was the average attendance on a weekly basis? What is normally entry fee? If he normally got 20-25 players, I wouldn't expect much more for $1000 guaranteed. If 40 of the 55 players showed up, he's not out anything. I would suggest "adding" so much money for ever x number of players. $100 for every 12 players or something like that. Some players like to see the "Added" money in a tournament. Yes, it's the same thing basically, but not all players look at it the same, all in how you word it!

Zim

 

[grindz]

I have often seen on this forum that pool hall owners should "step up" and add money to tournaments to spark participation. I have often agreed until an incident last night.

A local owner offered a $1000 gauranteed invitational tournament for a end of session reward to players who competed in his Wednesday handicap tournaments that session. The ideas was 32 players at $25 per person, NO TABLE TIME, and $200 ADDED!!! But regardless of the attendence he was going to honor the $1000 gaurantee. For the $25 entry you got to play all night (until the tournament was over), and a shot at $400 first place. It is also handicapped fairly, so everyone has a shot.

55 players were invited. 19 showed up. Players who continually complain about no money in local tournaments were not there. Players who don't play in open tournaments because they are too hard were not there. Players who complain about table time or greens fees were not there.

I was shocked. It does not look good for the future of the sport when an owner goes out of his way to promote the game and participation in tournaments and noone appreciates it.

Is this the status of pool in your area? Are local tournaments, open or handicapped, dead or really slow? What about in-house leagues?

If the room owner shares your paradigm about players then he will have a difficult time in the future. Hopefully he/she doesn't see "complain", "complain" in all of the patrons faces. If they want to have a successful tourney then ask the target audience what they want before thinking up the event. Around here if there is a tourney and it has good prize $ with little response and the payouts are good wether or not the quantity of players show up, then the next one more people will show up, and the next more.....on and on. Consistency and hitting your target audiences wants/needs are crucial.

I've never heard of players not liking less players to get to the same prize..
less players/same payout = more $ per player (or at least a better shot at it, word gets around if this is the case and the next one more people will show up). Given this you seem to be connected to the room owner...as you seem unhappy with the result? If so don't blame the patrons, change your paradigm ...give them what they want...promote it...be consistent...know your target audience.

I'm spoiled here in Phoenix where we have lots of choices and a great tourney scene. Hope you and/or the room owner stick with it and have the next one be successful for all. Good luck.

td

 

[kryptonite9]

Thanks for the reponses.

The equipment there is fine. Most of the players are at a lower level anyway. They are not going to come because of the equipment.

The invitational was run on the same night as the weekly event, started on the same time. Becuase of the amount of tables the room has the tournament would not have taken much longer than a regular weekly event that may only pay $120. The handicaps were set and adjusted based on the player and the results. This is why we had a minimum required number of tournaments so I could accurately gauge the handicap, not just have someone come in and steal the money.

Every tournament I go to recently has 12-20 players, when I was 10 years ago I remember a handicap tournament locally that drew 32 plus consistently.

 

[ScottW]

Since it seems you're involved with that whole thing - I suggest you ASK these people who were invited but didn't show - why didn't they show? Get it right from the horses' mouths.

 

[hang-the-9]

I have often seen on this forum that pool hall owners should "step up" and add money to tournaments to spark participation. I have often agreed until an incident last night.

A local owner offered a $1000 gauranteed invitational tournament for a end of session reward to players who competed in his Wednesday handicap tournaments that session. The ideas was 32 players at $25 per person, NO TABLE TIME, and $200 ADDED!!! But regardless of the attendence he was going to honor the $1000 gaurantee. For the $25 entry you got to play all night (until the tournament was over), and a shot at $400 first place. It is also handicapped fairly, so everyone has a shot.

55 players were invited. 19 showed up. Players who continually complain about no money in local tournaments were not there. Players who don't play in open tournaments because they are too hard were not there. Players who complain about table time or greens fees were not there.

I was shocked. It does not look good for the future of the sport when an owner goes out of his way to promote the game and participation in tournaments and noone appreciates it.

Is this the status of pool in your area? Are local tournaments, open or handicapped, dead or really slow? What about in-house leagues?

What I find, is people who are afraid to be beaten in public, or are afraid to be run over by a better player, in an official venue (say a tournament or a money match) will talk but not play. Or in what I have seen, play but not in the tournament although it costs an extra $5 to enter and they are there anyway. I see plenty of D players who play several times a week, but never play with anyone better or different than the same 1 or 2 people they come in with. They ask about the tournament times, they ask about the rules, but don't show.

 

[M HOUSE]

I have often seen on this forum that pool hall owners should "step up" and add money to tournaments to spark participation. I have often agreed until an incident last night.

A local owner offered a $1000 gauranteed invitational tournament for a end of session reward to players who competed in his Wednesday handicap tournaments that session. The ideas was 32 players at $25 per person, NO TABLE TIME, and $200 ADDED!!! But regardless of the attendence he was going to honor the $1000 gaurantee. For the $25 entry you got to play all night (until the tournament was over), and a shot at $400 first place. It is also handicapped fairly, so everyone has a shot.

55 players were invited. 19 showed up. Players who continually complain about no money in local tournaments were not there. Players who don't play in open tournaments because they are too hard were not there. Players who complain about table time or greens fees were not there.

I was shocked. It does not look good for the future of the sport when an owner goes out of his way to promote the game and participation in tournaments and noone appreciates it.

Is this the status of pool in your area? Are local tournaments, open or handicapped, dead or really slow? What about in-house leagues?

I noticed that the entry fee for Invitational tournament was $25.00. I'm curious as to what the entry fee was for the regular weekly tournaments. I've run tournaments in my rooms and others for a long time and found that $10.00 seems to be the magic number. Any entry fee higher than $10.00 and you lose a large percentage of the higher handicapped (lower skill level) players, and it really doesn't matter how much money is added. They seem to be able to justify playing just for the sake of playing when the entry fee is aroud $10.00, but raise that to $20.00 or $25.00 and you get mostly just those who feel they have an excellant chance to get "in the money".