i would agree but for the fact that 2's, 3's, and 4's are getting scarce in my area. they are all already on a team, and i have have ran out of new recruitee's....thats the reason i now have myself being a 7 and 3 6's. at the last week of being able to add, i filled the roster with what was available. in the past year in my division 90% all the 6's went to 7's and a large number of 5's went to 6's. in one year the division went from 9 teams to 14. and to top it off, i have to pull teeth to get the 3's and 4's to all show up. hypotheticly, if i were to move up to an 8, i would have to keep my co-capt which is a 6. thats 14 already. i would have to have 3 3's just to be able to make numbers. 2's dont stay 2's for long even if they only win once out of 4 matches, so i wouldnt even consider a 4, 3, 2 situation. and i have yet to meet a 1. either way...i dont see it as being a competitive team. my 3's dont win very often and they usually get smoked pretty good. im not complaining, im just stating reality, i do like the game, and i do have the option to quit. i just think they should raise it to at least 24 if not 25. i think they would still achieve their main goal but it would keep people happier. lets face it, chaging your team around every single session kind of takes the fun out it, especially when you cant find enough shooters to fill the roster correctly.frankncali said:
APA 9-ball: 7s, 8s and 9s
- Thread starter spoons
- Start date
frankncali
First off, love the avatar!! Eye candy is always appreciated.
As far as my skill improving...I believe it has. I guess I would put myself in the lower side of 7's, and the players from the areas I spoke of earlier, would be in the higher part. I believe every skill level can be separated into 3 different tiers, and I would be in the bottom tier.
To me it almost seems as if players in my area go up too quickly and too easily. Teams can't stay together because of the players going up and having to keep a team under the 23 rule gets tough. Each team becomes like one giant revolving door!! The turnover rate is crazy!! You have to shuffle players around from session to session or from team to team. I've had to create a whole different team to play on a different night, simply because we want to try and stay together. You know keep the main core of the group together. I know the LO's don't care, because that just means more teams in the league and more income for them. It has other benefits like maybe with more teams comes another Vegas slot.
Bottom line is that we have some players that are playing at their correct skill level, but for the most part everyone in our league is overrated by 1 handicap.
I would love to be able to go somewhere like Florida, or Baltimore and play in a league there, just to see where I fit in. My LO says that I will never be a 6 again because my innings are of a 7 average and my win percentage is over 90% in the two years that I have lived and played here. My lifetime win percentage is 72% but thats only with 300 matches played in 8-ball. We have other 7's in our league that have played in the 1000's.
I love playing against the best possible players. That's the only way that I feel I will improve, but most of the best players in town don't play league. When they do play they want to gamble for $1000 a set!! I just don't have that kind of money to throw around. I don't know something about my wife & kids needing food.
Oh well, I guess I'll just keep on keeping on!!
First off, love the avatar!! Eye candy is always appreciated.
As far as my skill improving...I believe it has. I guess I would put myself in the lower side of 7's, and the players from the areas I spoke of earlier, would be in the higher part. I believe every skill level can be separated into 3 different tiers, and I would be in the bottom tier.
To me it almost seems as if players in my area go up too quickly and too easily. Teams can't stay together because of the players going up and having to keep a team under the 23 rule gets tough. Each team becomes like one giant revolving door!! The turnover rate is crazy!! You have to shuffle players around from session to session or from team to team. I've had to create a whole different team to play on a different night, simply because we want to try and stay together. You know keep the main core of the group together. I know the LO's don't care, because that just means more teams in the league and more income for them. It has other benefits like maybe with more teams comes another Vegas slot.
Bottom line is that we have some players that are playing at their correct skill level, but for the most part everyone in our league is overrated by 1 handicap.
I would love to be able to go somewhere like Florida, or Baltimore and play in a league there, just to see where I fit in. My LO says that I will never be a 6 again because my innings are of a 7 average and my win percentage is over 90% in the two years that I have lived and played here. My lifetime win percentage is 72% but thats only with 300 matches played in 8-ball. We have other 7's in our league that have played in the 1000's.
I love playing against the best possible players. That's the only way that I feel I will improve, but most of the best players in town don't play league. When they do play they want to gamble for $1000 a set!! I just don't have that kind of money to throw around. I don't know something about my wife & kids needing food.
Oh well, I guess I'll just keep on keeping on!!
Banks
Banned
Whiners
Like Frank said, if you don't like it then don't play it. People know the rules when they join so I have no sympathy for people who are in the league and then whine about everything. You know that they have those little boxes you check off for 7', 8' or 9' tables right, and that those are calculated into skill levels? It amazes me how many "high level" players still come sounding like idiots. If you want to make money, then gamble or play a tournament (or get a job).
As people get up to the 8/9 level they probably start playing BCA/etc more since it is harder to get regular playing time on a team. After putting in so many years, how many people enjoy having one of their free nights taken up with sitting around for 3, 4 or 5 hours before finding out you won't be playing.
The larger pool-playing areas, such as FL, CA, etc, will also undoutbedly have better players in all skills ranges on average, just keep in mind that they will probably have just as many people at the bottom of those same skill levels.
Like Frank said, if you don't like it then don't play it. People know the rules when they join so I have no sympathy for people who are in the league and then whine about everything. You know that they have those little boxes you check off for 7', 8' or 9' tables right, and that those are calculated into skill levels? It amazes me how many "high level" players still come sounding like idiots. If you want to make money, then gamble or play a tournament (or get a job).
As people get up to the 8/9 level they probably start playing BCA/etc more since it is harder to get regular playing time on a team. After putting in so many years, how many people enjoy having one of their free nights taken up with sitting around for 3, 4 or 5 hours before finding out you won't be playing.
The larger pool-playing areas, such as FL, CA, etc, will also undoutbedly have better players in all skills ranges on average, just keep in mind that they will probably have just as many people at the bottom of those same skill levels.
mongoose-
Banned
Eieio59 said:First, you are only taxed on your winnings PER THE IRS. The League Operators are bound by law to tax you if you win over $600. Again... by law. If you don't want to be taxed, then don't win.
Usually teams are informed on what their room situation will be by the league operator prior to going to Vegas. Most put you in 2 or 3 rooms for the length of the stay. It is intended that the MEMBERS OF THE TEAM occupy those rooms.........you truly can't be insinuating that the league should pay the expenses to bring and room the spouses in Vegas, are you?
Again, you should know what you are playing for and if you don't like it, you should choose not to play.
I don't play the APA. Haven't for a long time. What I think is every single person on that winning team should receive a room. That room setup is only disclosed after a team wins. Or at least where I have seen it. So AGAIN save the sales pitch for those unsespecting newbies to the game. You won't find 1 LO in the APA willing to show their books and show one legit reason why every person shouldn't and the league couldn't afford to pay for individual rooms.
From your post I would say you either are an APA LO or one brainwashed APAer. Either way good luck with the APA. Glad it aint me.
1st- the number of 8's and 9's is going to depend on the # of players in your area, and the skill level in the area you play.spoons said:
2nd- these same 2 factors greatly effect the rating system. Like Ive said befor, if their system works so well, then why is the level of skill so all over the board in any given skill level. Because the system does not work, its not all because of sandbagging.
3rd- To the "if you dont like it dont play" people. alot of people that have complaints have paid hundreds (thousands) of dollars to the league and have every right to voice their complaints and continue to do so as long as the problem(s) continue. There is no reason, there isnt a board of players, to represent the players and their concerns its our league without us their in the soup line.
Ive been to Vegas 7 times in 5 years, theres no way I (or anyone) should have to go down there, and be subject to the B*tch fest that goes on. Let me guess all the people on here (ive never met) and all the people down there (ive never met, just heard) are all a conspiracy, and of course dead wrong, there are no problems (ie. sideways LO, sandbaggers, bad playing conditions, ect.). And if everybody would just not say anything the problems (that arnt really there) would just go away. Sure.
Just wondering outloud, what is the beloved league doing for its players with the 1.5 mill. they collected this year buy raising are dues. Let me guess that none of our concern, its their league (cash cow)
Mowem down said:
How so? If it's a points based system, and not something like a bell curve, what would the number of players have to do with handicaps? Is it just a law of large numbers kind of thing?
And, also, how does the skill level in the area you play affect the handicaps.
Not trying to be difficult, just trying to learn.
mongoose- said:
AGAIN...for those that don't quite grasp the concept...... the APA is a BUSINESS. Why do you believe that you have ANY right to view the books of a BUSINESS. Do you walk into the nearby WalMart and ask them to view their business? I doubt it - and would love to see the looks on their faces should you dare. What gives you the perception that a business like the APA is any different that any other business? As long as players are given notice as to what prizes and awards they should expect and then the players receive them, what right do you or anyone else have to complain about the way they run their business?
But let's look at this reasonably - in your first sentence you disclose that you don't play APA and haven't in a "long time". So, how do you know what the winners should expect? Did you receive the information with your weekly paperwork? No, because you don't play APA. You don't know what was offered. Players usually are given information about what the expections are should they qualify for Nationals and exactly what is offered. I have never seen a team that qualified for Vegas and not know what they are getting. Once they have been given notice of what they are playing for, if they don't accept that - they shouldn't play.
I would be willing to bet that you've probably been to Vegas with one of the other leagues at some point. If you have then you will be lonely if you say that every time you went you had your very own room - all to yourself. Players that go to tournaments room together - no matter what event they are going in. If they don't then they either have issues (health or otherwise) that keep them from rooming together or they are very wealthy. Pro players room together on tours. It would be irresponsible to believe that it is okay to room together in all other tournaments but that the APA should pay for every person to have their own room.
I, for one, don't understand your complaint. Why does this matter to you so much that you come on and trash APA when 1) you don't play APA and 2) it is obvious that you don't even try to research or understand what it is you are posting about.
Mowem down said:
Yes, I am one of those people who say, if you don't like it-don't play. I have said that many times. Most of the people that I say that too are 1) ones who have admitted that they don't play APA (and therefore, why should they be upset) or 2) those that play APA and after hitting the button and reading all of their posts - obviously do not enjoy it - don't like anything about it - constantly complain here and other places about it, etc.... you get the idea. I have not ever posted that to anyone just asking questions, having disagreements, etc.... only to those that have constantly complained, yet done nothing about it. If you really don't like it - don't play.
I am sure that most APA players on this forum have had at one time or another a disagreement with their league operators. I am also sure that most bring those disagreements to the league operators attention and have them taken care of. In some instances they are told why it can or can't be done a certain way. But most are taken care of.
Your sentence at the bottom of your post is typical of what is wrong. You post on here that you would like to know what is going on with the extra money raised by APA by increasing memberships. What gives you the impression that you deserve to know what a league operator does with their business? Do you ask WalMart what they are doing with the extra .25 cents they are charging for tomatoes? No. It is their business. You don't realize that by increasing their price of tomatoes by .25 cents they are making an extra - let's say - $50,000 A DAY over all of the WalMarts (that is an imaginary figure for example). Do you think they get to keep it all? They raise their prices because the price of EVERYTHING has gone up. It is my understanding that this is the first membership increase that APA has had in like 13 years. How much has the price of everything gone up in 13 years? Do you know what all expenses the APA has? Have you booked convention space for 14 or so days in Vegas, have you paid insurances for an organization this big? I'm just throwing out some questions - just think *big* when you think how much things have increased in the past 13 years.
Again, I just don't see what the issue is with knowing how a business spends its' money. This is a pool league that offers a whole lot of people an opportunity to play, have fun and yes, sometimes win. They pay for that opportunity, just like you pay to go to movies. If they don't like the movie producer, then they probably won't go see another one of his movies - and if they do pay to go see another one of his movies and then complain that they don't like it, they should be konked on the head.
That is why I have said - and continue to say - if the conditions in Vegas aren't up to your standards, if you feel as though they aren't fair to you, if you feel as though you have to listen to too much b****** in Vegas, then just exercize your right to choose and don't play. That way, you won't have to worry about any of that. It has been my humble experience that if things aren't enjoyable, then I just choose not to do them. If I really like what I'm doing and I have some issues with it - I ask about them to the appropriate people (LO's, APA, etc.) - I don't just come on here and complain and try to discourage other people. There are a lot of things I don't like, but I know that if I go to the person in charge and they don't tell me what I want to hear - I make a decision to either keep playing and accept it or quit playing with them. It really is that simple. It isn't my job to tell them how to run their business or to try to make them tell me where every dollar is going. Just as I don't expect them to ask me to account for every dollar I earn at my job.
dave sutton
Banned
im so sick of hearing sand bag this or sandbag that. sure it happens but not on a level talked about. if someone has a good match theyre a sandbagger. if you play bad hes still a sandbagger. hogwash. i am the highest rated player in every possible league. i have to give everyone weight. if i loose to a 5 i have to play better.
if they had bca here i would quit apa asap. not my fault u guys think it is ok to get to vegas and play on an unlevel table. bca has less money than apa and they treat their players better. all im tryin to say.
theres your answer to your quit playing advice..
theres your answer to your quit playing advice..