Aramith Ball Weights

mdc

mdc

Member
A few days ago, I sold a set of Aramith Premium Balls (my set pictured below). I'm certain I bought them from Seyberts sometime between 2017 and 2020, I'm not sure, but I know it's when I last had access to a home table. I paid $205, asked for $150, the buyer and I settled on $120. He paid me in cash. All is well, except, just today he messages me asking if I have a receipt for these balls. I checked my email, thoroughly, and I do not. My guess is I either used guest checkout or I long ago deleted the email. It may be worth noting that I also did not have the original Aramith box. He's concerned the balls are fake because he says he weighed them and they're between 161g and 165g, sent me a photo of a ball on a scale at 162.5 g. He called this a "Huge deviation in weight." I did the math, that's a 4.41 percent error. I looked it up, 161 to 165g is still well within WPA specifications, which state, "All balls must be composed of cast phenolic resin plastic and measure 2¼ (+.005) inches [5.715 cm (+.127 mm)] in diameter and weigh 5½ to 6 oz [156 to 170 gms]." I sent this guy the link and explained that his measurement was still well within the official specs. He says he called Aramith and was told the balls should only weigh 169 or 170 g exactly [eye roll], so he's convinced they're fake and wants to return them. Any thoughts? Does anyone happen to know the weight of their Aramith balls or anything about the typical weights of Aramith balls?
aramith-premium-ball-set.jpeg
 
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Terry Aeschliman said:
weights will change with use.
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Yeah, I've heard that, but these are lightly used, so I'm not sure how much that could be a factor. Bought them several years ago, but they haven't been used at all in at least the last 5 years because that's when I lost access to a home table and never carried them out anywhere.
 
That range seems really light. Shouldn't all of them be at 6oz / 170g?

My Dynaspheres Bronze / Vanadium are:

Weight: 169 grams +/- 1,0g (5.96 oz +/- .035 oz)
Size: 57,2 mm (2.25") diameter

From AI:

Aramith Premium pool balls are regulation-size (2-1/4" / 57.2 mm) phenolic resin balls designed for high durability, lasting up to 5 times longer than polyester alternatives. Featuring Vitrotech technology for a hardened, scratch-resistant surface, they provide consistent, high-performance play with a 6 oz weight per ball.

Key Technical Specifications:

Material: High-density, impact-resistant phenolic resin.
Size: 2 1/4" (57.2 mm) diameter.
Weight: Approximately 6 oz (170 gr).
 
For whatever it's worth, right or wrong $120 isn't enough for me to piss someone off and maybe even affect my reputation.

I cheerfully offer to refund his money and move on...
 
sbrownn said:
That range seems really light. Shouldn't all of them be at 6oz / 170g?

My Dynaspheres Bronze / Vanadium are:

Weight: 169 grams +/- 1,0g (5.96 oz +/- .035 oz)
Size: 57,2 mm (2.25") diameter
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Idk what Aramith balls are supposed to weigh, and it never occurred to me this set wasn't genuine. As I said, I bought them from Seybert's. If they're selling face Aramith balls I'd be shocked. Also, we're talking about the weight of 2 nickels [shrug]. As long as the balls all weigh close to the same with the set, how would that even affect the game?
 
sbrownn said:
That range seems really light. Shouldn't all of them be at 6oz / 170g?

My Dynaspheres Bronze / Vanadium are:

Weight: 169 grams +/- 1,0g (5.96 oz +/- .035 oz)
Size: 57,2 mm (2.25") diameter

From AI:

Aramith Premium pool balls are regulation-size (2-1/4" / 57.2 mm) phenolic resin balls designed for high durability, lasting up to 5 times longer than polyester alternatives. Featuring Vitrotech technology for a hardened, scratch-resistant surface, they provide consistent, high-performance play with a 6 oz weight per ball.

Key Technical Specifications:

Material: High-density, impact-resistant phenolic resin.
Size: 2 1/4" (57.2 mm) diameter.
Weight: Approximately 6 oz (170 gr).
Click to expand...
Another interesting question is, given Dynaspheres Vanadium are ~$180 and the Aramath Premiums are $205, which one would players prefer playing with?
 
mdc said:
Idk what Aramith balls are supposed to weigh, and it never occurred to me this set wasn't genuine. As I said, I bought them from Seybert's. If they're selling face Aramith balls I'd be shocked. Also, we're talking about the weight of 2 nickels [shrug]. As long as the balls all weigh close to the same with the set, how would that even affect the game?
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Maybe the buyer should double check his scale with 1, 3 and 5 nickels which should be 5, 15 and 25 grams?
 
sbrownn said:
Maybe the buyer should double check his scale with 1, 3 and 5 nickels which should be 5, 15 and 25 grams?
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Oh, I forgot to mention, yeah, I suggested his scale could be off. He assures me it isn't and that he checked with 2 different scales, shrug. I took a package to the post office today that I weighed at exactly 4 lbs. Postal scale read 3 lbs 14 oz, almost 57 grams difference. This guy is giving me grief over a difference in weight of about 7 grams, the 170 g he says Aramith balls are supposed to weigh and the 162.5 g he says he measured.
 
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His scale may have a 1% error, but that's not random on each reading. Comparing weights near each other is going to be far more precise than the overall error. He seems to have a scale that reads to 0.5 gram. That should be fine for showing 4 gram differences.

Balls are known to get lighter over time. Some of that is due to wear, but I have a report from a reliable technical guy that he has an unused set that has gotten lighter over time. Some kind of outgassing/evaporation? Maybe he stored them next to his heater.

I wonder if the buyer can actually notice the difference in play. You mention 7 grams, but the important thing is the range of ball weights. If they are all 162 grams, he is unlikely to notice any problem. However, on a few shots, if the player is very skilled, it is possible that 4 grams difference -- the actual spread of ball weights you mentioned -- will be noticeable. I doubt he plays that well, or he would not be buying used balls.

There is a problem he might run into with those balls. If he gets a new cue ball, it will be 169-170, probably. That will not work so well with the lighter balls for draw shots. Again, he may not notice.
mdc said:
True, and yes, I already agreed to take the set back and refund his money. It just seems strange to me.
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Good move. The best way to handle crazy people is get away from them before you catch whatever they have.
 
Bob Jewett said:
His scale may have a 1% error, but that's not random on each reading. Comparing weights near each other is going to be far more precise than the overall error. He seems to have a scale that reads to 0.5 gram. That should be fine for showing 4 gram differences.

Balls are known to get lighter over time. Some of that is due to wear, but I have a report from a reliable technical guy that he has an unused set that has gotten lighter over time. Some kind of outgassing/evaporation? Maybe he stored them next to his heater.

I wonder if the buyer can actually notice the difference in play. You mention 7 grams, but the important thing is the range of ball weights. If they are all 162 grams, he is unlikely to notice any problem. However, on a few shots, if the player is very skilled, it is possible that 4 grams difference -- the actual spread of ball weights you mentioned -- will be noticeable. I doubt he plays that well, or he would not be buying used balls.

There is a problem he might run into with those balls. If he gets a new cue ball, it will be 169-170, probably. That will not work so well with the lighter balls for draw shots. Again, he may not notice.

Good move. The best way to handle crazy people is get away from them before you catch whatever they have.
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Yeah, I mentioned that his scale could be off, but of course that doesn’t explain the variance, I don’t think. He claims it’s accurate to 0.1 grams, idk. As you point out, it’s the variance among the set that’s the problem, not that the average weight is or isn’t X, as long as that number falls within official specs. I mentioned 7 grams because he sent me a picture of a ball on a scale reading 162.5, and he says Aramiths are supposed to be 170 g. I didn’t notice until later, but he also sent two other pictures, one ball that reads 163.4 and another that reads 164.6, so yeah, definitely not all the same. He said the range was between 161 g and 165 g, a difference beyond Aramith standards. Correct me if I’m wrong, but from what I’ve been reading a quality set of balls, especially Aramiths, should have no more than a gram or so difference between the lightest ball and the heaviest.

He didn’t say anything about having played with them or feeling/noticing any issues that way, only mentioned the weight discrepancy.

Yeah, I have no problem doing a refund, it just upsets me that I seem to have paid $200 for a substandard set of balls.
 
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I was explaining all this to my uncle, who knows nothing about pool but was with me when I sold the balls. He asked me, how are you gonna know that this guy gives you the same set of balls back? Maybe he’s trying to scam you, buy your good balls, pretend there’s this weight problem and then pull a switch by “returning” a lower quality set. Do pool balls have some kind of numbers on them? I couldn’t resist, I said, yeah they’re numbered 1 to 15, hehe.
Seriously though, I told him there’s no serial numbers and no way to tell just by sight other than matching design details. Even so, I said, that seems a highly elaborate and implausible scam. Counterfeit balls would still need to look like Aramiths, and my set specifically, which has to cost something. I don’t exactly know how much such a set would cost but I doubt the difference between them and my used set could hardly be worth the trouble. Surely scammers have far more lucrative schemes with less overhead, haha.
 
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