Pathetic Shark
Banned
Decide where the CB is going when you're stood up. Solely focus on making the ball when you're down on the shot.
Can't Improve. Should I quit?
- Thread starter CurvedCue
- Start date
Decide where the CB is going when you're stood up. Solely focus on making the ball when you're down on the shot.
I am not a serious pool player but I have been a scratch golfer for more than 25 years. Both disciplines require one thing above all else. A mental approach that sets up success as opposed to failure. One thing I noticed early on in pool is that the mental side of pool is almost identical to golf. For this reason I began to play hours and hours of pool in the winter to keep my mind sharp, mostly on positive imagery. I've lost some of you by now but hear me out. Your mind determines your success so much more so than any mechanical fundamental or perfect stroke. No one every gets over a tough shot thinking they'll most likely miss and pulls it off. Conversely, we've all had the one damned near impossible shot and for some reason we just felt it deep in our minds we were going to make it and did. The subconscious takes cues form our conscious mind. If you're consciously focused on positive outcomes the result is dramatic for someone who is starting form the negative side of the spectrum. We all have the same physical skills for the most part. You sound like a perfect example of what I like to call the mechanical man. I have known many golfers in my life that worked their asses off only to be disappointed in their performance when it mattered. Their swings looked like a tour pro they could putt and do all the things one would expect of a great player except perform when it mattered. The space between your ears is ultimately what is holding you back. It takes some work but there is hope... Sorry gotta go for work stuff but I'll return.
relax enjoy the game
I think your doing to much at one time. Just relax & enjoy the game. Work on one thing at a time.
I recently took up pool again after a long hiatus and find myself not only much worse than I ever was, but also unable to improve, even marginally, despite hours of practice.
I joined an APA league, but am getting annihilated every week and by guys whose stance, bridge, fundamentals, etc, look god-awful, but who NEVER miss. Meanwhile, I'm OCS about that stuff, but can't make a shot.
I practice drills, I read books, I take lessons. Nothing seems to help. Only seems to further my overall sense of mass confusion. For example, I understand the basic concepts of Stun, Follow, Draw, Tangent Lines, 30-degree Rule, etc, but when I come up to the table that all goes right out the window and I only see a morass of unbelievable complexity and soul-crushing chaos. (Excuse the hyperbolic lingo). For example, my estimation of the tangent line is often off by 40-50 degrees!
And when I try to practice the diagrammed drills in books, I can't recreate the shots. For example, there's a "simple" draw cut shot in 99 Critical Shots, but every time I do it, the cue ball NEVER follows the path as shown in the book, but diverges in a TOTALLY DIFFERENT path. This is despite trying up to a 100 times! :angry:
So are there people who simply should not be playing pool? Just as there are midgets who shouldn't be playing basketball? Am I too geometrically-challenged?
I did flunk geometry in high school, btw.
I just want an honest appraisal. That way I won't expect anything more of myself, and try to accept that I'm genetically handicapped in regards to this game.
I think your doing to much at one time. Just relax & enjoy the game. Work on one thing at a time.
Very good post...& great avatar pic.
there is more to spf
Lessons can greatly help. There are many things that accompany this method. I recently had a set of lessons from randy g. I could not run three balls for about a month. I utilized the drills and am now pocketing playing good position and stringing racks. I don't know who you got lessons from but Randy gave me drills to continue to use to incorporate the method into my game. Don't give up you have to put in the time and pay your dues. Get lessons from one of the best. Honestly most people don't really know how to teach
Good luck
Lessons can greatly help. There are many things that accompany this method. I recently had a set of lessons from randy g. I could not run three balls for about a month. I utilized the drills and am now pocketing playing good position and stringing racks. I don't know who you got lessons from but Randy gave me drills to continue to use to incorporate the method into my game. Don't give up you have to put in the time and pay your dues. Get lessons from one of the best. Honestly most people don't really know how to teach
Good luck
Ok I am back...
I know this sounds Zen like or or some sort a magical smoke and mirrors to some, but ultimately every single high performing athlete in the history of the world had one thing which is certain. They believed they could, to a level that if you could get into the head of Michael Jordan, or anyone else of that stature you'd find a mind that wasn't just confident it was deleteriously so. What I mean by that is they had such enormous confidence in their ability that it made them at least internally so arrogant that they believed they could do anything humanly possible. Micheal playing baseball or golf for example, at one point he honestly thought he could be professional at either. These ultra high achievers typically had problem in their personal lives. Not because they were bad people but they had expectation of themselves and the people around them. Tiger Woods is a perfect example of this. In his prime he was everything to himself and could not fail, he did what he choose to do without considering anything but a positive outcome. When that all came crashing down so did his game. I don't think you'll need to worry about being the best player on the planet or having Efren ask you for some weight but you truly need to get your mind right. A good start is to play and practice with no expectations. Play with a completely even keel. No highs, no lows, just play. Positive mental imagery is the key but it can be done without expectations. I find expectations for most players that wish to improve to a high level are ultimately too high and when anyone of those expectations falls short you end up in a trap of negative thinking. Hours of practice do little more than establish a rational base in which to believe in yourself. The more you practice the more strongly you rationalize your ability to be great. Essentially you convince yourself that you're great because of all the time you put in. But if you practice for thousands of hours without that steadfast belief in yourself you just wasted thousands of hours. Visualize every shot, this only takes a second or two. Like seeing a movie play in your head of exactly what the balls are going to do. Always make the visualizations positive in every aspect. Feel the shot during that moment see the ball going in, hear it in your mind and the resulting perfect shape. one negative thought anywhere in this process and you should start over. It takes time to get it. Many people call this being in the zone. Everyone's "zone" is different but almost everybody who has tried to build a skill like pool has experienced it at least once. Positive mental imagery is a way to capture it and call upon it when needed. I mention even keel earlier. This means do not get excited or pissed based on the outcome of a shot, it will ruin you for the next shot. After a great match or set gives your self a little high five or whatever you like but never during the match or set. Play with a single focused purpose, hitting this shot the way it needs to be hit and repeat until the game is over. There are tens of thousands of words I could write on this subject, but i hope you get the idea. Basically in your mind I want you to think you're the greatest ****in human being to ever hold a pool cue and believe it. Keep this to yourself of course otherwise you'd probably get your ass kicked. What you described here makes you the poster child for positive thinking changing things around. That space between your ears can be your best friend or worst enemy, totally up to you. Good Luck :thumbup:
I know this sounds Zen like or or some sort a magical smoke and mirrors to some, but ultimately every single high performing athlete in the history of the world had one thing which is certain. They believed they could, to a level that if you could get into the head of Michael Jordan, or anyone else of that stature you'd find a mind that wasn't just confident it was deleteriously so. What I mean by that is they had such enormous confidence in their ability that it made them at least internally so arrogant that they believed they could do anything humanly possible. Micheal playing baseball or golf for example, at one point he honestly thought he could be professional at either. These ultra high achievers typically had problem in their personal lives. Not because they were bad people but they had expectation of themselves and the people around them. Tiger Woods is a perfect example of this. In his prime he was everything to himself and could not fail, he did what he choose to do without considering anything but a positive outcome. When that all came crashing down so did his game. I don't think you'll need to worry about being the best player on the planet or having Efren ask you for some weight but you truly need to get your mind right. A good start is to play and practice with no expectations. Play with a completely even keel. No highs, no lows, just play. Positive mental imagery is the key but it can be done without expectations. I find expectations for most players that wish to improve to a high level are ultimately too high and when anyone of those expectations falls short you end up in a trap of negative thinking. Hours of practice do little more than establish a rational base in which to believe in yourself. The more you practice the more strongly you rationalize your ability to be great. Essentially you convince yourself that you're great because of all the time you put in. But if you practice for thousands of hours without that steadfast belief in yourself you just wasted thousands of hours. Visualize every shot, this only takes a second or two. Like seeing a movie play in your head of exactly what the balls are going to do. Always make the visualizations positive in every aspect. Feel the shot during that moment see the ball going in, hear it in your mind and the resulting perfect shape. one negative thought anywhere in this process and you should start over. It takes time to get it. Many people call this being in the zone. Everyone's "zone" is different but almost everybody who has tried to build a skill like pool has experienced it at least once. Positive mental imagery is a way to capture it and call upon it when needed. I mention even keel earlier. This means do not get excited or pissed based on the outcome of a shot, it will ruin you for the next shot. After a great match or set gives your self a little high five or whatever you like but never during the match or set. Play with a single focused purpose, hitting this shot the way it needs to be hit and repeat until the game is over. There are tens of thousands of words I could write on this subject, but i hope you get the idea. Basically in your mind I want you to think you're the greatest ****in human being to ever hold a pool cue and believe it. Keep this to yourself of course otherwise you'd probably get your ass kicked. What you described here makes you the poster child for positive thinking changing things around. That space between your ears can be your best friend or worst enemy, totally up to you. Good Luck :thumbup:
Ok, I can get you those steroids for free, at least in a written form. It's kind of an ultimate strategy for lower players to use in order to surprise and beat much better ones. Since you're going through this slump for some time, you could also benefit from it, and if not, at least it won't harm you. I'll post it as soon as I get internet for my laptop. Don't expect miracles, as it's actually a last resort strategy, not tipical for situations like yours, but what I hope is that you'll temporarily change the approach to the game so much while trying it out, it will shock your brain and get you out of this bad routine. Stay tuned and pm me if you still couldn't find it by the end of next week.
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I recently took up pool again after a long hiatus and find myself not only much worse than I ever was, but also unable to improve, even marginally, despite hours of practice.
I joined an APA league, but am getting annihilated every week and by guys whose stance, bridge, fundamentals, etc, look god-awful, but who NEVER miss. Meanwhile, I'm OCS about that stuff, but can't make a shot.
I practice drills, I read books, I take lessons. Nothing seems to help. Only seems to further my overall sense of mass confusion. For example, I understand the basic concepts of Stun, Follow, Draw, Tangent Lines, 30-degree Rule, etc, but when I come up to the table that all goes right out the window and I only see a morass of unbelievable complexity and soul-crushing chaos. (Excuse the hyperbolic lingo). For example, my estimation of the tangent line is often off by 40-50 degrees!
And when I try to practice the diagrammed drills in books, I can't recreate the shots. For example, there's a "simple" draw cut shot in 99 Critical Shots, but every time I do it, the cue ball NEVER follows the path as shown in the book, but diverges in a TOTALLY DIFFERENT path. This is despite trying up to a 100 times! :angry:
So are there people who simply should not be playing pool? Just as there are midgets who shouldn't be playing basketball? Am I too geometrically-challenged?
I did flunk geometry in high school, btw.
I just want an honest appraisal. That way I won't expect anything more of myself, and try to accept that I'm genetically handicapped in regards to this game.
How many hours have you put in practicing since you have been back playing? It sounds to me like you play like a beginner because you are one. How much pool did you play before you quit? Put up a video hitting a few balls and then you will get the help you need.
I recently took up pool again after a long hiatus and find myself not only much worse than I ever was, but also unable to improve, even marginally, despite hours of practice.
I joined an APA league, but am getting annihilated every week and by guys whose stance, bridge, fundamentals, etc, look god-awful, but who NEVER miss. Meanwhile, I'm OCS about that stuff, but can't make a shot.
I practice drills, I read books, I take lessons. Nothing seems to help. Only seems to further my overall sense of mass confusion. For example, I understand the basic concepts of Stun, Follow, Draw, Tangent Lines, 30-degree Rule, etc, but when I come up to the table that all goes right out the window and I only see a morass of unbelievable complexity and soul-crushing chaos. (Excuse the hyperbolic lingo). For example, my estimation of the tangent line is often off by 40-50 degrees!
And when I try to practice the diagrammed drills in books, I can't recreate the shots. For example, there's a "simple" draw cut shot in 99 Critical Shots, but every time I do it, the cue ball NEVER follows the path as shown in the book, but diverges in a TOTALLY DIFFERENT path. This is despite trying up to a 100 times! :angry:
So are there people who simply should not be playing pool? Just as there are midgets who shouldn't be playing basketball? Am I too geometrically-challenged?
I did flunk geometry in high school, btw.
I just want an honest appraisal. That way I won't expect anything more of myself, and try to accept that I'm genetically handicapped in regards to this game.
Instead of reading all the post I'm just going to respond to yours based on my experience
In my opinion you need to get into some aiming systems. Pro one,SEE and TOI. This will give you pre-shot routine discipline and you'll never look at the balls the same way
I just wish they were available 20 years ago. When you can make every ball you can see your game will get better. I'm not trying to debate this with other posters but in my opinion it's a game changer.
FYI - the diagrams in 99 Critical Shots are NOT true to form. You won't get an accurate representation of the table layout. The ball size to the table is 2X so you aren't going to use the diagrams for real world.
Use the book to understand the concepts he is presenting - sort of a poorly graphed theory of operations.
I am 45 and was struggling with my game. I have never done drills in my life. I started doing drills and working on my stance and backhand. I did switch from thumb and three finger grip to thumb and two finger grip. I keep my grip loss and I stroke thru the cue ball. I get all the power I need and touch as well. Back to drills. After focusing on my stance and backhand. I would set up the cue ball one foot from the object ball leaving a long straight shot. I paid attention to the english I wanted and the reaction of the cue ball. Some times it would roll forward and others it would spin. So I wasn't hitting where I was aiming. I focused and kept hitting the same shot over and over and over until I was making the shot and the cue did what I was playing english for. So league night comes. My stroke has probably never felt smoother. It helps create muscle memory. That way you dont have to think about your stance or stoke when you get to the table. Just what you want to do with the shot.
And don't forget the benefits of the kitchen table.
Here's a trick to get a true straight through stroke:
1. On the kitchen table, place a tomato paste can.
2. Slowly push your cue tip into the can for a full-stroke.
Benefits: you quickly figure out if you really are hitting center.
Allows enough time during the stroke to check for any excess body movement.
When you can push the small can straight for 8-10 inches, move to a larger can and push it a little faster as you watch for slippage, etc.
And - this is in the privacy of your home with no table costs ;-)
Here's a trick to get a true straight through stroke:
1. On the kitchen table, place a tomato paste can.
2. Slowly push your cue tip into the can for a full-stroke.
Benefits: you quickly figure out if you really are hitting center.
Allows enough time during the stroke to check for any excess body movement.
When you can push the small can straight for 8-10 inches, move to a larger can and push it a little faster as you watch for slippage, etc.
And - this is in the privacy of your home with no table costs ;-)
Let's see that video.
There is bunch of people on here that would love to help you.
I have learned a lot in the past, this is a great site.
Sometimes, everyone gets a little too holy about the way they believe things should be done but in the end the more ways of playing are discussed the better for everyone.
In general:
Don't make judgments on other people's game.
It is not about winning it is about finding pleasure in the little things. Wining will come.
Live in the moment.
Don't over think it.
Relax the mind and the body.
Don't put yourself down.
Have FUN!!!.
Once again don't judge other peoples abilities. Really DO NOT!
If your high runs were 4-6 balls after long break from the game then 2-3 balls would be the norm.
Few years ago my high runs were 3-4 tables, I'm lucky to run 1, and after I do it is back to 4-5 balls. My game fell apart before I quit. I was playing less and tried to improve my fundamentals and it had the opposite effect.
Now I can shoot any style you want just not very well.
Get the point? Different things work for different people.
Without seeing you play, here are general observation from what you wrote.
You are not hitting the ball where you think you are, your dominant eye and cue are not aligned. Your stroke is not straight, etc.
Odds are good you are jacked up and shooting down on the whitey.
Are you jacking up the shoulder behind your head and then letting the shoulder drop?
Guys that put a lot of pressure on themselves tend to take a lot of practice strokes.
Fewer practice strokes.
Some people let that elbow travel with every pre-stroke.
For right hander it is a nice looking trip left to right, funny stuff.
Make your stroke ugly and shorten it.
BTW. Stroke is from back stop forward and through the QB.
Not that pretty back and forth that happens before.
Ball in hand: When you placed the QB on the table, did you get up?
Forget about drills that are too hard for your level.
Give yourself some nice easy shots that you can execute more often, built your confidence, little steps.
Play more for FUN with friends. When you play with them concentrate on the shot not the 100 other things.
Advice that 'to get better you must play for money' is given to beginners to separate them from cash.
As for tournaments, if they let you use the tables for free after you are out of tournament then there will be a lot of people to play with for FUN.
Cheers
There is bunch of people on here that would love to help you.
I have learned a lot in the past, this is a great site.
Sometimes, everyone gets a little too holy about the way they believe things should be done but in the end the more ways of playing are discussed the better for everyone.
In general:
Don't make judgments on other people's game.
It is not about winning it is about finding pleasure in the little things. Wining will come.
Live in the moment.
Don't over think it.
Relax the mind and the body.
Don't put yourself down.
Have FUN!!!.
Once again don't judge other peoples abilities. Really DO NOT!
If your high runs were 4-6 balls after long break from the game then 2-3 balls would be the norm.
Few years ago my high runs were 3-4 tables, I'm lucky to run 1, and after I do it is back to 4-5 balls. My game fell apart before I quit. I was playing less and tried to improve my fundamentals and it had the opposite effect.
Now I can shoot any style you want just not very well.
Get the point? Different things work for different people.
Without seeing you play, here are general observation from what you wrote.
You are not hitting the ball where you think you are, your dominant eye and cue are not aligned. Your stroke is not straight, etc.
Odds are good you are jacked up and shooting down on the whitey.
Are you jacking up the shoulder behind your head and then letting the shoulder drop?
Guys that put a lot of pressure on themselves tend to take a lot of practice strokes.
Fewer practice strokes.
Some people let that elbow travel with every pre-stroke.
For right hander it is a nice looking trip left to right, funny stuff.
Make your stroke ugly and shorten it.
BTW. Stroke is from back stop forward and through the QB.
Not that pretty back and forth that happens before.
Ball in hand: When you placed the QB on the table, did you get up?
Forget about drills that are too hard for your level.
Give yourself some nice easy shots that you can execute more often, built your confidence, little steps.
Play more for FUN with friends. When you play with them concentrate on the shot not the 100 other things.
Advice that 'to get better you must play for money' is given to beginners to separate them from cash.
As for tournaments, if they let you use the tables for free after you are out of tournament then there will be a lot of people to play with for FUN.
Cheers
A plastic water bottle opening is even better. In the old days it was a glass Coke bottles. I guess today you could use a beer bottle.
I didn't say do drills. I tried to give him a simple drill that allows anyone to test their stroke. Everyone keeps saying just have fun. I agree the game should be fun. However, once any of us achieves a certain skill set and we aren't meeting our expectations. It can take the fun out of the game. Doesn't matter what skill level we are. First you have to test your stoke. Second your aim. Third your mental status. Any can affect your game. However by doing simple drills you can become confident your stroke and aim are good. By having that confidence it will help your mental status. Once you lose confidence in any aspect of your game no matter what your skill level is it will affect your entire game.
I recently took up pool again after a long hiatus and find myself not only much worse than I ever was, but also unable to improve, even marginally, despite hours of practice.
I joined an APA league, but am getting annihilated every week and by guys whose stance, bridge, fundamentals, etc, look god-awful, but who NEVER miss. Meanwhile, I'm OCS about that stuff, but can't make a shot.
I practice drills, I read books, I take lessons. Nothing seems to help. Only seems to further my overall sense of mass confusion. For example, I understand the basic concepts of Stun, Follow, Draw, Tangent Lines, 30-degree Rule, etc, but when I come up to the table that all goes right out the window and I only see a morass of unbelievable complexity and soul-crushing chaos. (Excuse the hyperbolic lingo). For example, my estimation of the tangent line is often off by 40-50 degrees!
And when I try to practice the diagrammed drills in books, I can't recreate the shots. For example, there's a "simple" draw cut shot in 99 Critical Shots, but every time I do it, the cue ball NEVER follows the path as shown in the book, but diverges in a TOTALLY DIFFERENT path. This is despite trying up to a 100 times! :angry:
So are there people who simply should not be playing pool? Just as there are midgets who shouldn't be playing basketball? Am I too geometrically-challenged?
I did flunk geometry in high school, btw.
I just want an honest appraisal. That way I won't expect anything more of myself, and try to accept that I'm genetically handicapped in regards to this game.
If your trying this hard and got nothing to show for it. Let pool go and find something that you can do that makes you happy.
Here's an idea that may work for you. Forget the "education" for a while. Just let your mind relax and hit the balls in. Go back to your old ways, not putting any pressure on yourself to apply anything you have learned. Do this for a month or so.
Then try applying the newly learned stuff again - just one thing at first. Then something else. Let your comfort level dictate how much new knowledge to integrate into your game and how fast.
EDIT: Nice avatar.
Fatz
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Fatz,
It does look nice but...
Do you realize that that pic is representative of the downfall of Pinocchio in the story?
Best,
Rick