Chameleon Rack at Valley Forge Gabriels 8-Ball Event

Dana Bufalo said:
I heard that the Chameleon Rack was used last week at the Super Billiards Expo - Gabriels Open 8-Ball Championship event?

Did the players like using this rack?

Anybody witness the "racking problems" that you typically see at a tournament?

Did anyone see or try the rack at the Expo?

Any comments?
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Hey Dana-I saw it tried out for a while on the Xbreaker table. It was of no apparent help.

Like a normal rack -as soon as it was removed, the balls started heading in different directions.
 
The pros did not use the rack correctly. They seemed to have an easier time racking with it like a normal rack. They did not seem to like it either, I remember Corey Deuel picking up and looking at it funny and kind of shaking is head. Some of the pros were even using the rack upside down or with the point in one of the back corners just to get a good rack.

I tried it out at the demo of it and didnt care for it myself, the person demonstrating it was not good with it either. Well the rack just did not seem to work to well at all. Once you push all the balls together and lift the rack up, they would still roll out of place.

If you want to get a good rack, it seems the new Sardo 5000 is the better pick and is the same price. My father went to the show and wanted to check out the Chameleon rack because he was interested in it. After he saw the demo, he left the show with a new Sardo.
 
I was very tempted to buy one myself but after reading this I think i'll do some re-thinking.

It looked more convenient to carry around than the Sardo.

I may go for the Master Rack instead.
 
Icon of Sin said:
... Well the rack just did not seem to work to well at all. Once you push all the balls together and lift the rack up, they would still roll out of place. ...
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The table has to be trained or the balls will roll into (other) craters.

They had a trained table in Las Vegas for the Mosconi Cup and were using a normal (but well-made) rack and were getting a tight rack. The team captains had decided to rack the balls about 2/3 of a ball up from the spot, and the wing ball still went in most of the time.
 
Bob Jewett said:
The table has to be trained or the balls will roll into (other) craters.

They had a trained table in Las Vegas for the Mosconi Cup and were using a normal (but well-made) rack and were getting a tight rack. The team captains had decided to rack the balls about 2/3 of a ball up from the spot, and the wing ball still went in most of the time.
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In Japan for many tournaments, they are training the table and using NO Rack-Just rolling them into place by hand with little or no problems.
 
Bob Jewett said:
The table has to be trained or the balls will roll into (other) craters.

They had a trained table in Las Vegas for the Mosconi Cup and were using a normal (but well-made) rack and were getting a tight rack. The team captains had decided to rack the balls about 2/3 of a ball up from the spot, and the wing ball still went in most of the time.
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We went to the Chameleon Demo thursday morning because Dad was seriously interested in getting one. The table and felt was brand new at there booth. There were no craters. I don't know, just definately does not seem worth it to me.
 
JasonDevanney said:
I was very tempted to buy one myself but after reading this I think i'll do some re-thinking.

It looked more convenient to carry around than the Sardo.

I may go for the Master Rack instead.
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The Chameleon offered no better rack then a wooden rack.

My Master Rack doesn't do anything that ensures that the balls stay in place either.

The M5000 Sardo does everything it advertises, and doesn't do everything the doom and gloomers say it does.

Fred
 
Cornerman said:
The Chameleon offered no better rack then a wooden rack.

My Master Rack doesn't do anything that ensures that the balls stay in place either.

The M5000 Sardo does everything it advertises, and doesn't do everything the doom and gloomers say it does.

Fred
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Hey Fred-
Good meeting you at Valley Forge.
Anyway, I have a question. I don't know what it is that the doom and gloomers have been saying about the Sardo rack so, I could be reiterrating some previous concerns. If so, I'm sorry. But doesn't the Sardo rack require that you make impressions on the table where the balls are to be racked, thus creating the possibility of untrue rolls in the area if the speed is slow enough?
Just curious.

Thanks. And again. Great meeting you at Valley Forge. I opted out of the Bluegrass trade. I wasn't one hundred percent convinced. Instead, I'll be selling it and using the money to commission another Mottey/White cue. Whaddaya think?

-Brian
 
Cornerman said:
The Chameleon offered no better rack then a wooden rack.

My Master Rack doesn't do anything that ensures that the balls stay in place either.

The M5000 Sardo does everything it advertises, and doesn't do everything the doom and gloomers say it does.

Fred
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Fred, serious question, not trying to be smart or anything like that. Can you carry a Sardo around a tournament with you and use it on any table you get assigned? In other words, is it true a table must be trained or the Sardo will not work?
 
pharaoh68 said:
Hey Fred-
Good meeting you at Valley Forge.
Anyway, I have a question. I don't know what it is that the doom and gloomers have been saying about the Sardo rack so, I could be reiterrating some previous concerns. If so, I'm sorry. But doesn't the Sardo rack require that you make impressions on the table where the balls are to be racked, thus creating the possibility of untrue rolls in the area if the speed is slow enough?
Click to expand...

I can answer with a few notes:

  • On regularly used tables, the rack area is already a mine field when rolling slow. The SARDO will not make that any better or worse. I think this is important because people (including myself in the past) have reported that the SARDO divots make the balls go all over the place through the rack area. But this is already a problem on most tables if anyone cared to look. They just might be falsely blaming it on the SARDO.
  • On my table, my rack area is several times better than most tables you will see in pool halls and bars. And I use the SARDO on every rack.
  • If you run your hand across my table, you'd never know there was any diffference. If you run a ball across my table, you'd never know there was any difference.
  • The impressions are minute. It's not like you have to pound a rut in the cloth, but rather just flatten out some of the cloth in spots. I think people assume there are these huge impressions that you can see in the cloth. There aren't.

Fre
 
CaptainJR said:
Fred, serious question, not trying to be smart or anything like that. Can you carry a Sardo around a tournament with you and use it on any table you get assigned? In other words, is it true a table must be trained or the Sardo will not work?
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I have one, maybe I can answer. The table doesnt exactly have to be trained. But they recommend marking the table so the rack gets placed in the same spot every time.
 
Icon of Sin said:
I have one, maybe I can answer. The table doesnt exactly have to be trained. But they recommend marking the table so the rack gets placed in the same spot every time.
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Let me ask this way. I walk into the pool hall and they give me table number 17. I go to rack the balls and there is a good wooden rack. I put the balls in the rack and when I lift up the 1 ball rolls out, so I push the rest of them up to it and then the wing ball rolls out. I push them to that side a little and the other wing ball rolls out. I start over and happen to hit the right spot and get a good rack.

In other words this tables cloth has some dents in it that are making it difficult to rack the balls. Question, If I have a Sardo with me over beside my case, will it solve the problem. Can I expect to rack them up, push the handles down once and get a good rack the first time?
 
CaptainJR said:
In other words this tables cloth has some dents in it that are making it difficult to rack the balls. Question, If I have a Sardo with me over beside my case, will it solve the problem. Can I expect to rack them up, push the handles down once and get a good rack the first time?
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It is highly unlikely.
 
Cornerman said:
I can answer with a few notes:

  • On regularly used tables, the rack area is already a mine field when rolling slow. The SARDO will not make that any better or worse. I think this is important because people (including myself in the past) have reported that the SARDO divots make the balls go all over the place through the rack area. But this is already a problem on most tables if anyone cared to look. They just might be falsely blaming it on the SARDO.
  • On my table, my rack area is several times better than most tables you will see in pool halls and bars. And I use the SARDO on every rack.
  • If you run your hand across my table, you'd never know there was any diffference. If you run a ball across my table, you'd never know there was any difference.
  • The impressions are minute. It's not like you have to pound a rut in the cloth, but rather just flatten out some of the cloth in spots. I think people assume there are these huge impressions that you can see in the cloth. There aren't.

Fre
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Thanks for the info Fred. You see, Roger (buddha162) and I play in a room with a group of tables. But we only play on the house table because the pockets are tighter and its in extremely good condition. However, its nearly impossible to tight-rack someone because, when others play there, they rack all over the place and leave loose racks and do just about all sorts of things to make the head spot brutal to rack on.

Roger thought would help to use a Diamond rack but i think the thing is terrible. Maybe I'll convince him to shell out for a Sardo.
 
CaptainJR said:
Let me ask this way. I walk into the pool hall and they give me table number 17. I go to rack the balls and there is a good wooden rack. I put the balls in the rack and when I lift up the 1 ball rolls out, so I push the rest of them up to it and then the wing ball rolls out. I push them to that side a little and the other wing ball rolls out. I start over and happen to hit the right spot and get a good rack.

In other words this tables cloth has some dents in it that are making it difficult to rack the balls. Question, If I have a Sardo with me over beside my case, will it solve the problem. Can I expect to rack them up, push the handles down once and get a good rack the first time?
Click to expand...
No, but if you use the same table all the time, once you find the sweet spot for racking where no balls roll out, mark the sardo there, then you wont have to worry about finding it again.
 
Icon of Sin said:
No, but if you use the same table all the time, once you find the sweet spot for racking where no balls roll out, mark the sardo there, then you wont have to worry about finding it again.
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The problem is that most "wild" tables have at least some of the craters in the wrong spots and it's impossible to get a tight rack in the cratered area. See

http://www.onthebreaknews.com/Jewett4.htm#July05

for a related story.
 
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