cue ball flying off table 2nd ball 8 ball break on bar table

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westcoast

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I generally prefer to use the 2nd ball break, especially on my home table as it is difficult to make a ball with a head on break (pockets are relatively small- 4 inches).

It works out decently on most occasions. However, I've noticed several complications. One is that it may lead to more tie ups/congestion than the head on break. Two, the cue ball often ends up behind the rack in the foot spot after the break sometimes leading to a difficult first shot.

However, the most vexing thing is that there is a tendency for the cue ball to hit the side rail after hitting the balls and then fly off the table (I'd say 1/10 times if considerable pace is used breaking). What is the way to counteract this? I know one way is to break softer, but I've seen pros use considerable pace with the 2nd ball break and they rarely jump the ball off the table.

Any tips?
 
alphadog said:
Keep your cue as level as possible. I know it has to be elevated but keep it minimal.
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And try moving the CB farther away or closer to the rack - to find the distance at which the CB's hop length (at your break speed) brings it most squarely into the target ball, minimizing after-collision hop.

Another thought: a touch of outside might help bring the CB more toward center table.

pj
chgo
 
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As far as the cue behind the rack, I’ve had a lot of trouble with this when I use a break cue with a break tip on it. My theory is it being harder to put any controlling English on the cue ball. As for the clusters, sometimes that’s not a bad thing.
 
Low outside with a stroke. Try to only hit CB hard enough to make sure you can get it in the center. Start soft and build up to speed.

If this fails, use high inside and 2 rail blast the rack from the back side. This is more likely to make the 8, but it's fraught with peril.
 
westcoast said:
I generally prefer to use the 2nd ball break, especially on my home table as it is difficult to make a ball with a head on break (pockets are relatively small- 4 inches).

It works out decently on most occasions. However, I've noticed several complications. One is that it may lead to more tie ups/congestion than the head on break. Two, the cue ball often ends up behind the rack in the foot spot after the break sometimes leading to a difficult first shot.

However, the most vexing thing is that there is a tendency for the cue ball to hit the side rail after hitting the balls and then fly off the table (I'd say 1/10 times if considerable pace is used breaking). What is the way to counteract this? I know one way is to break softer, but I've seen pros use considerable pace with the 2nd ball break and they rarely jump the ball off the table.

Any tips?
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You also need to keep in mind on a bar table you have often a larger and heavier ball, random object ball quality and size and rack tightness and random rails that may be too low for the spec. Those can make keeping the ball on the surface harder. This is why I almost never hit very hard on random bar equipment. And the cluster thing is why I also pretty much never use a second ball break, unless whoever is racking is bad at racking, then I hit the second ball to open them up a bit better, I guess in the same theory as hooking the ball in bowling.

I am guessing "bar table" is a different animal than a properly setup 7 footer LOL Kinda like having a "ho" and a "lady" technically being the same thing yet very different.
 
Cue ball off the table is your fault. I use that break as a concession to _drunks will never give you a frozen rack_. As long as you insist on the top balls being set well, you can get a good snap without a lot of force. As for the defensive outcomes, that's built in. If you make a ball you still get to choose. If you come up empty, there's still a chance the opposition will have a tough time getting out. Of course they could always out choose you but that's pool.
 
2nd ball break does leave clusters...I like it, you can develop those as you go, plus, even against really strong players, you're not necessarily giving up an easy run out if you fail to get out. As for the hop, a little draw helps...a little inside pulls the cue ball into the side rail and then back into the heart of the expanding group of balls, a little low outside pulls it to the side rail and then towards the center table--but I tend to scratch a bit more with that one. Also, taking some speed off the second ball break improves your accuracy, which pushes the eight ball closer to the side pocket. No need to crush it. Watch Mark Jarvis's second ball break clinic vs. Efren...he really dialled it in.

 
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boogieman said:
Low outside with a stroke. Try to only hit CB hard enough to make sure you can get it in the center. Start soft and build up to speed.

If this fails, use high inside and 2 rail blast the rack from the back side. This is more likely to make the 8, but it's fraught with peril.
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Low outside has definitely improved my break.

I experimented with different types of English the last 2 times I've practiced- low outside has definitely been the best thus far. I haven't jumped the ball off the table once, scratched a few times (in the opposite corner pocket), made the 8 ball twice on the break, and had one table run (I'm just an average league player- I can break and run maybe 1/30 times).

Thanks for the advice
 
westcoast said:
I generally prefer to use the 2nd ball break, especially on my home table as it is difficult to make a ball with a head on break (pockets are relatively small- 4 inches).

It works out decently on most occasions. However, I've noticed several complications. One is that it may lead to more tie ups/congestion than the head on break. Two, the cue ball often ends up behind the rack in the foot spot after the break sometimes leading to a difficult first shot.

However, the most vexing thing is that there is a tendency for the cue ball to hit the side rail after hitting the balls and then fly off the table (I'd say 1/10 times if considerable pace is used breaking). What is the way to counteract this? I know one way is to break softer, but I've seen pros use considerable pace with the 2nd ball break and they rarely jump the ball off the table.

Any tips?
Click to expand...
A little bottom outside, and break from as close to the side rail as possible, to give yourself a better angle at that second ball. However, if you do just barely clip that head ball first, you are libel to send the cue ball flying.
 
If the cue ball is jumping off the table, move away from the side at least two inches. Too close to the rail, you are forced to jack up. I sometimes have my cue ball six inches from the side rail and still hit the second ball. For my best break I hit the third ball.
 
I had the same trouble years back with jumping CB off the table or scratching so I tried this method; hit low outside english on CB hitting either 2nd ball or even try 3rd ball in rack, see if this changes things for ya.
Like someone said in earlier post, bar tables seem to have heavier CB so that may not work as well. Hope this helps you out
 
Pros are playing on 9” table so the angle is wider.


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Back when the 8 ball break was a winner. We had a 8 ball break pot that got up to $250. I snapped the 8 and put the cue ball on the floor. The other strong player in the tournament won the pot on his next break. Oh so close 🤷
Now that the 8 ball break is not a win I have no reason to hit the second ball break that hard. The tendency to leave the balls a little more clustered is a plus for the Old Man style of 8 ball. The cue ball near the foot rail gives the more experienced player options for tight safety play or short precise shape if the run out looks promising.
 
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