I bought a Jflowers cue it came with a Moori medium tip. It seemed to hold up pretty well even tho I probably was scuffing it to often. I put a cuesoul soft tip on and it flattens out after just a week of playing daily. Is this typical of a soft tip or is it the quality of the cuesoul tip? I don’t break with this cue and use the smaller diameter on the last 4 ever combo tool. Any suggestions on a tip to try would be greatly appreciated.
Cue tip flattening
- Thread starter whittle
- Start date
I tried those cheap Cuesoul tips and you get what you pay for.
I went back to LePro tips and they work just fine.
I went back to LePro tips and they work just fine.
boogieman
It don't mean a thing if it ain't got that ping.
I'm gonna tell you the God's honest truth here. A good single layered leather tip is just as good and performs just as well as any tip on the market. It also has less points of failure.
People say single layered tips aren't consistent. Weight them and pick a heavy one out of the box. Some people put them in water and throw away the floaters. I prefer pressing the tips. Most tips are pressed to some degree from the factory, but when a company is making a batch of a thousand tips from a natural material in one pressing they are not going to be consistent. If you press them yourself you can be consistent. Tips soaked in milk or other materials and then pressed are also far more consistent.
So the only thing that can be called a downside to single layered tips is consistency. This can be mitigated by weighing tips, dry pressing, or milkdudding. If you remember way back when tips started to play their best when they were about the thickness of a couple nickles stacked together. You would see people having tips the thickness of a dime before they replaced them. They hit their sweet spot because they had been "pressed" thought the action of playing tens of thousands of shots with them. Some people hit their new (uninstalled) tips with a hammer to press them.
Now speaking layered tips, I'm not going to say they are bad, they are generally just fine. Layered tips claim to fame is consistency, but they are anything but. Stack and glue 8+ layers of leather, maybe from different animals and different parts (cheaper thinner parts) of the hide and call it a tip. Now if the manufacturer cares about quality and is meticulous in their effort you can get a well made consistent tip.
But... It's common knowledge that leather hardens/presses down with use. If you start with a Kamui super soft, you will be playing with a medium in two or three months. Layered tips harden up just like any other. The only way to somewhat maintain a hardness level is to replace them every couple months. Now a hard layered tip isn't as effected. But leather is leather and it will compact/press/harden with use.
Layered... there are glue lines between every layer. This may or may not cause an issue. I've had it cause issues. I've had it leave flecks on the cue ball. Some say it can cause miscues. It probably depends on a lot of factors, glue used, etc.
Maintenance: You aren't supposed to pick layered tips. You have to be somewhat careful how you maintain them. It's not an issue if you simply use a gator grip type tool or 1" square of sandpaper to lightly clear the tip of old chalk and lift the fibers of the leather. It is an issue if you get carried away. I maintain my tips the same no matter what type, and after initial shaping the previously mentioned method is how.
Layered tips, being layered and all can have more points of failure. All it takes if for one layer to dry out differently than the other layers, one glue line to fail, etc. It's much less likely to damage a single piece tip. You don't really see chunks coming off single piece unless they are decades old and dried out. You see it more often on layered. Layered tips are fine, again not knocking them, but they do by definition introduce more potential points of failure.
Fellow forum member pooldawg8 makes a great milkdud tip. Extremely consistent results and reasonably priced. Outsville makes a good one they call technodud. You can buy a press on ebay and DIY milkduds, or simply use the press to dry press single layered tips. This ain't rocket science and being layered isn't inherently better and at times can introduce more potential for problems.
If you want to go super high tech the recent recoil playing tips by Bulletproof Billiards are really good tips. I have the green on one of my sticks and anyone who's tried it says it's a good tip.
To directly answer your question some manufacturers care about quality, some care about price point/profit. I'm gonna go out on a limb here and say Moori probably cares more about quality than Cuesoul. You're seeing the difference in real time.
xX-Wizard-Xx
Well-known member
best soft tip on the market are royal oak .... get you sum sucka
What a bunch of bs. Today's layered tips are very consistent. That 'glue line' crap just doesn't hold water. Been using nothing but layered for at least 15yrs and the only one that was no good was a really cheap tip from JBarringer that i tried. Other than that i've had ZERO issues. No separations or miscues due to any glueline. 'Potential points of failure' just doesn't happen with any of the better layereds sold today. I'd say that there are more inconsistent SL tips than multi-layer. Tweeten stuff is great IF you get a good one. Lucky if 10tips in a box are worth a shit. Never used Outsville so i can't comment on those. Once i discovered Ultraskins and Thoroughbreds i quit looking. Great prices and never had a single issue with either.
xX-Wizard-Xx
Well-known member
Talisman Tips played great but were awful at separating .... i wonder if they fixed them?
xX-Wizard-Xx
Well-known member
what about the Thomas tips?
Not saying some didn't have issues but even then probably 90% of supposed layered tip probs. were installer error. Too dull a blade or too high lathe speed ruined many good tips. The one i got from Barringer, a Samson, was installed correctly and still fluffed-up like a Julia Child souffle. When i reported it to him he went SMOOTH off on me and the installer. Even barred me from his Ebay store. Glad that douche sold his co, whatta colossal tool.
Never heard that of Tal's. I knew a few cuemakers that used them a lot and never had any problems. I still think that in almost all 'separation cases' it the installer's fault. Not always but often.
I went to a flea market in NJ yesterday. They had a few round tins of Mooris on the table. I didnt pick them up
boogieman
It don't mean a thing if it ain't got that ping.
BS? Isn't it about time to chase some kids off your lawn?
I mean this as respectfully as I can, but it seems your reading comprehension has gone down the tubes lately. You jump to conclusions instantly and come off as argumentative. Yes, modern quality made layered tips are usually good. But you can get bad ones. All tips aren't created equal. And I never said layered tips were bad, I said "A good single layered leather tip is just as good and performs just as well as any tip on the market."
There are good layered tips. There are bad layered tips. Of all the tips with chunked off pieces, de-lamination, etc guess what... It's almost ALWAYS a layered tip. It can come down to bad installation, improper maintenance, or bad quality. You can't argue the fact that the more complex something is, the more POTENTIAL for failure exists. On a single layer tip there are two points of failure, glue popping off the ferrule (not the tip's fault), or it being 30 years old and dried out. Same for layered tips, but instead of one glue line you have multiple. On an 8 layered tip, you have 8 failure points, counting the one to the ferrule.
I'm not a "real" cue repair guy but I've personally replaced about half a dozen layered tips that have failed in some way. Was it user error? Maybe. Was it poor installation from the guy who did it before me? Maybe. The only single layered tips I've dealt with were either old and hard as a rock, the player had finally wore them/ground them down to the point they needed replaced, or they wanted to try something different. Again, not saying all layered tips, I've also cut off layered tips and replaced them where the player had used them for a long time to the point they needed replaced. But the "emergency" replacements are almost always layered. Single layer tips age gracefully for the most part, when a layered tip fails it's all at once and leaves you in a pickle. Sometimes you can remove a bad layer or two and they are alright. But then your confidence in your equipment is ruined and you usually replace it anyway.
Basically just because you've had good luck with them with a good brand tip doesn't mean it's not a problem that comes up.
Layered tips are here to stay and have essentially replaced single layer tips for the premium market. I still put LePro tips on house cues. 
If premium tips of good quality are made by a company that cares, they're simply the better choice.
Yes, a competent person can still learn how to select a decent single layer tip, and they still work just fine. But it's a fading skill and not really necessary when you have the ability to use tips that do not need any expertise to select.
If premium tips of good quality are made by a company that cares, they're simply the better choice.
Yes, a competent person can still learn how to select a decent single layer tip, and they still work just fine. But it's a fading skill and not really necessary when you have the ability to use tips that do not need any expertise to select.
How often does a layered tip delaminate thru play?? I'm gonna say its less the 3% maybe less than that. I don't remember the last time i saw/heard of a layered tip coming apart from playing with it. We had a good cue guy at Magoo's that put on hundreds if not thousands of tips and his success rate with layereds was easily 95%+. It was the pos Tweeten single layered tips that weren't/aren't worth a shit. How good is product when 'maybe' 10 out of 50 are usable? BTW, my reading comp. is fine pal. As long as people throw out pseudo-facts i'm gonna respond the same way. Don't fkng like it feel free to put me on Ignore.BS? Isn't it about time to chase some kids off your lawn?
I mean this as respectfully as I can, but it seems your reading comprehension has gone down the tubes lately. You jump to conclusions instantly and come off as argumentative. Yes, modern quality made layered tips are usually good. But you can get bad ones. All tips aren't created equal. And I never said layered tips were bad, I said "A good single layered leather tip is just as good and performs just as well as any tip on the market."
There are good layered tips. There are bad layered tips. Of all the tips with chunked off pieces, de-lamination, etc guess what... It's almost ALWAYS a layered tip. It can come down to bad installation, improper maintenance, or bad quality. You can't argue the fact that the more complex something is, the more POTENTIAL for failure exists. On a single layer tip there are two points of failure, glue popping off the ferrule (not the tip's fault), or it being 30 years old and dried out. Same for layered tips, but instead of one glue line you have multiple. On an 8 layered tip, you have 8 failure points, counting the one to the ferrule.
I'm not a "real" cue repair guy but I've personally replaced about half a dozen layered tips that have failed in some way. Was it user error? Maybe. Was it poor installation from the guy who did it before me? Maybe. The only single layered tips I've dealt with were either old and hard as a rock, the player had finally wore them/ground them down to the point they needed replaced, or they wanted to try something different. Again, not saying all layered tips, I've also cut off layered tips and replaced them where the player had used them for a long time to the point they needed replaced. But the "emergency" replacements are almost always layered. Single layer tips age gracefully for the most part, when a layered tip fails it's all at once and leaves you in a pickle. Sometimes you can remove a bad layer or two and they are alright. But then your confidence in your equipment is ruined and you usually replace it anyway.
Basically just because you've had good luck with them with a good brand tip doesn't mean it's not a problem that comes up.
And that's the name of that tune!! Well said. Kudos.