Dallas West and Me

I believe Lou's wife bought him a very high end Ginacue as a present a few years back.


Good memory, Bill :-) For those so inclined:

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My 10th Anniversay Gina":

I've posted this before, but since you asked:

I owned an eight-point Gina when I was a teenager, growing up in SF. ALL the top players on the West Coast, at that time, used a Gina -- a few, played with a TAD. I bought it off a fellow named Dennis, who, in a moment of temporary insanity, sold it to me -- with three shafts and a black alligator Gina case -- for $150. Several years later, I sold it back to him for $250. Ah, youth.

Flash forward 25 years or so and for our tenth anniversary, my wife asked me what I would like for the event (keep in mind that I had a custom made,1 carat emerald cut diamond, with baguettes, in the works for her). I blurted out that I always regretted selling that Gina, so many years ago. She said, "If he's still around making cues, get on the phone and get what you want."

I called Ernie and told him the story and described the cue I had previously owned. He said, yes, he remembered the cue, but didn't make them quite that way any more, and if I wanted one, he'd have to pull out the drawings, spend some time on the computer, and reload the specs. I said great, but with some small changes: I wanted the joint, the inlays, and butt plate in ivory, and a leather wrap. He said no problem and that he would be happy to charge me appropriately. He said eight months.

Six months later he called and said he was sending leather samples for the wrap. He also said that when he looked at the drawings, he saw that he used to make this particular cue with an additional ring below that wrap that I had forgotten to mention. He said he took the liberty of adding it, in ivory, at no additional charge, so that it would look just like the cue I had previously owned.

A week later it was in my hands. It was absolutely flawless -- exactly as I remembered it, but better.

As to it's playing characteristics, I will tell you the following in complete honesty: when I first got it, I wasn't sure I liked the way it hit. It's a firm solid hit, that somehow, sounds soft. Sorry, I can't describe it any other way. In fact, it was only after three or four other players asked to take a few shots with the cue, that I could hear how soft a hit it had (with hard Mooris).

But nonetheless, despite my minor misgivings, I seemed to make a lot of balls with the cue. After just two days, I felt like I was playing a couple of balls better with this cue than I had with any other. I dismissed it as just being "new cue syndrome."

But then, people started telling me (mostly opponents I was relieving of cash) that I had suddenly improved two balls. My practice runs jumped way up. My confidence went way up. After a couple of months I called Ernie and told him how much I loved the cue. And then I asked, "You know, everyone tells me I'm playing two balls better than before with your cue." And he said, "I've built special test equipment and my cues are 97% accurate. The cue alone is worth a ball and a half." Now, you can take that as "a sales story," or hype, or PR or whatever you want. But for my money, you couldn't pull this cue out of my hands with a Mac diesel.

IMO, Ernie is THE greatest living cue maker. And, IMO, you should get one while you can. It will cost you. But it will be worth every single last penny.

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About the "refinishing" job:

In a recent discussion about TAR's interview with Ernie Gutierrez, of Ginacue fame, I mentioned that I had visited with Ernie last year. I thought one or two of the cue fanatics out there might get a chuckle out of it.

(Insert flashback music.)

I was in Ernie's shop last August. I was visiting my Mom and it turns out his shop is just a mile from my sister's house. It was time to refinish the Gina so I shipped it out to him in advance of my trip and then followed up with a visit to his shop to talk to him about what I wanted done.

To this day, I don't know what happened to me. It was like some pool spirit (more like a demon) took over my brain and the next thing I knew, I was in his shop talking to him, and then, all of a sudden, someone else was talking with full control of my faculties. I was virtually talking in tongues.

See, all I really wanted done was to have the cue refinished -- it had developed several small chips in the finish along the edge of the butt. I was starting to get worried about the ivory butt cap discoloring where it had chipped. I also figured I'd have it re-wrapped too.

So we're talking and Ernie eventually asks, "What kind of leather do you want? I just got some brown elephant ear, and trunk, in." (As best I can remember, that's about when I started to feel a little "funny.") So he walks me over to this table with all kinds of leathers piled on them, and it turns out that when Ernie says he "just got some elephant trunk in," he's not kidding: it was the whole, long, brown, wrinkled, elephant trunk skin, right there in my hands.

The trunk was a little rough in texture for me. But the ear got me right where I lived. Beautiful color and amazing texture, kinda like rough micro-cloth. Ernie then takes me over to his machine for splitting the leathers, and explains it's an expensive piece of machinery, but he wants to be able to get his leather as thin as he wants, so that the player gets good feedback through a thin wrap.

So now I'm in for a re-finish and an elephant ear (cognac) wrap, and I tell him I want new ferrules and tips (with pads) on all three of my shafts. Oh. And two of the shafts re-tapered to where my playing shaft is.

Once again, not too much of a problem. I had even brought black Kamui SS's tips along with me. But now I'm starting to sweat a bit. I have no idea what the elephant ear is going to cost -- but I know it's not going to be your ordinary, everyday leather re-wrap kind of bill. I know the ferrules, pads, and tips are around a hundred a pop. No idea what re-tapering is going to cost...

And then for no reason that I had planned, I just blurt out: "Oh, and could you make me two new shafts?"

Two new shafts?!

"What the hell are you thinking?!" I says to meself. "How many frippin' shafts do you need, exactly?"

"I don't know,” I answer myself calmly. “But wouldn't it be cool to have two brand new, un-hit, un-chalked, beautiful, pristine, Ernie shafts to match the cue?"

Ernie kindly promises to taper these two new additions to my order, to the same specs.

Now my arm pits are soaked, beads of perspiration are forming along my temples and slowly working their way down my sideburns. And I just fully give myself to forces more powerful than I have the will to control and it just comes out so fast that I can't halt it: "And how about some ivory joint protectors?"

Ernie calmly does the math and says, "Sure. Five for the shafts and one for the butt."

We talk a while longer about my cue, and how it somewhat resembles one he made for Eddie Taylor, long ago. He writes up the order and I pull out all of the cash I have in my pocket for the week. I give him the vast majority of it.

I say my farewell and stumble out into the Burbank sun feeling light-headed, more than a bit dizzy (almost nauseous), thinking about the "bottom line" I just racked up on what was suppose to be a modest refinish and re-wrap job.

I call my wife and tell her what I've done and she goes, "What?" in that peculiar tone of voice and inflection that only a wife of 20-some odd years (and who has heard her husband say some pretty goofy things), can achieve. Sort of like that note singers are reputed to be able to hit that can bust stemware. I survive the call, I get in the car and sit for a moment until I feel lucid enough to drive in California traffic.

Six weeks later, the cue, shafts, and joint protectors are in my hot little mitts and it's all beautiful. I hope whatever spirit possessed me is satisfied... because I sure am :-)

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About the "25th Anniversay Gina"

lol, I have a 17a in the works, not that it's going up for sale or would meet your needs.

I have a custom eight-point Gina and my wife asked what I wanted for our 25th anniversary coming up and I said, "Well, I've always wanted a plain Gina that I could check with the airlines when I travel to tournaments." And she says, "Sure, go a head and order it."

So I call Ernie and tell him what I want and he says, "So. You want it to be a twin of your other cue."

And I'm like, "Yeah. Exactly."

And so he says, "So you want the the ivory joint?"

And I'm like, "Well, yes. Of course."

And then he asks, "Ivory butt plate?"

And I go, "Um... Yes."

And then he asks, "Elephant ear wrap?" And I hesitate (but only for a moment) and say, "Ah, yes, in black."

And so, my "plain" Gina player ended up plain, but not so cheap :-)

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Lou Figueroa
 
Good thread. Sometimes pros cant teach but you were indeed lucky to have one who could. Great gift BTW.


Thanks, Bob. Dallas is a great teacher. I may be up in Chicagoland again this year and might even go back for another class :-)

Lou Figueroa
 
Lucky you! I still have the VHS tape of Dallas running 100 balls and explaining the run as it goes along. Mentioned in the Straight Pool forum recently, if memory serves.


Thanks, PO. You know, I saw the discuss of that tape in the 14.1 forum and that was one of the reasons that I got motivated again to make the lesson with Dallas happen.

Lou Figueroa
 
My thoughts exactly - I wish I had been the first to say it.

Of course, it takes a pretty special husband to get that kind of treatment from a wife. And I am the first one to say that.

Rich


Thanks, Rich. Hard to believe my wife and I are coming up on 25 years.

Lou Figueroa
 
Lou,

I was lucky enough to take instruction from Dallas West many moons ago. I spent a few months going back and forth from Chicago to Rockford to learn from the US Open winner.

He'd put me out of several tournaments, so I decided to try and join him instead of fight him. That was one of the best decisions of my pool life and it opened my eyes as to how the game was really played. Always the gentleman, Dallas cheerfully explained the nuances of surgically tearing out small portions of the rack in 14.1, and how to come into the rack on break shots. He showed me how to keep from getting stuck in the rack and the patterns that developed as you created break balls from nothing.

Today's straight pool game is like an eight ball break. Hit 'em hard and rely on the fast cloth to spread the rack. Years ago Dallas worked the rack and moved balls into position for his break ball. It took several lessons to quit trying to blast the rack and taking the chance of getting stuck in a cluster.

He was no slouch at nine ball, either. He showed me how to spin the cueball and back cut balls that seemed impossible to pocket. Boy, could he spin the cue ball! You could almost hear it hum on that old nappy cloth.

I remember he worked with Tom Karabatsos quite a bit and it shows in Tom's game and stroke. A lesson with Dallas is worth years of playing experience. You will never learn what he can show you in a few hours. I still remember him saying, "See, you can cut a ball backwards!", as he beat me in a nine ball tourney. He had rolled out to an impossible, 90+ degree cut and I commented how it couldn't be made. I let him shoot again and watched as he easily cut the ball in, never touching a rail! He just smiled and politely looked at me and we both laughed. He's that kind of guy, even when he's trying to beat you in a match.

Best,
Mike
 
Great story about the cue, Lou!! Or, cues, I should say. Very special lady you got there!
 
Lou,

I was lucky enough to take instruction from Dallas West many moons ago. I spent a few months going back and forth from Chicago to Rockford to learn from the US Open winner.

He'd put me out of several tournaments, so I decided to try and join him instead of fight him. That was one of the best decisions of my pool life and it opened my eyes as to how the game was really played. Always the gentleman, Dallas cheerfully explained the nuances of surgically tearing out small portions of the rack in 14.1, and how to come into the rack on break shots. He showed me how to keep from getting stuck in the rack and the patterns that developed as you created break balls from nothing.

Today's straight pool game is like an eight ball break. Hit 'em hard and rely on the fast cloth to spread the rack. Years ago Dallas worked the rack and moved balls into position for his break ball. It took several lessons to quit trying to blast the rack and taking the chance of getting stuck in a cluster.

He was no slouch at nine ball, either. He showed me how to spin the cueball and back cut balls that seemed impossible to pocket. Boy, could he spin the cue ball! You could almost hear it hum on that old nappy cloth.

I remember he worked with Tom Karabatsos quite a bit and it shows in Tom's game and stroke. A lesson with Dallas is worth years of playing experience. You will never learn what he can show you in a few hours. I still remember him saying, "See, you can cut a ball backwards!", as he beat me in a nine ball tourney. He had rolled out to an impossible, 90+ degree cut and I commented how it couldn't be made. I let him shoot again and watched as he easily cut the ball in, never touching a rail! He just smiled and politely looked at me and we both laughed. He's that kind of guy, even when he's trying to beat you in a match.

Best,
Mike


Great stuff, Mike! And you're right -- Dallas covered a lot of that stuff with me too, like how not to get stuck in the rack and secondary patterns. As I said, I may be up ther again in a few months and may have to work woth him again.

Lou Figueroa
 
Well, I finally did it and got my 14.1 lesson with the great Dallas West.

Just by way of background: I got some Accu-Stats 1pocket DVDs for Christmas this past year from my wife. But the gift that really got me was a series of small boxes she had individually wrapped and then strung together. She insisted I open them in order.

The first was a gift certificate that she had personally made up on the computer, complete with graphics, that entitled me to gas money to the city of Rockford, IL. The second box, also with artwork, had another gift certificate, valid for dinner at any restaurant in Rockford. The third was another gift certificate with a photo of a Marriott property in Rockford and good for a one night stay. And the final box held, surprise, one last certificate. It had on it a color picture of Dallas West and was good for "One Pool Lesson with Dallas West."

Apparently, sometime during the last year I had said over dinner that one day I'd love to get a 14.1 lesson from Dallas West, up in Illinois, or perhaps Ray Martin, if I was ever out in Florida again. She had figured out where Dallas was and put together the boxes for my gift. (Sorry about that, Ray.)

As a 14.1 aficionado, I have always considered Dallas to be one of the Straight Pool Greats, with a very pure 14.1 style. Even back on RSB, his name would occasionally come up and I recall discussing a Dallas West vs. Nick Varner match with Grady commenting and relating that Dallas got so good at 14.1 by repeatedly throwing three balls on the table and then practicing getting on a break shot.

Back at the 2000 DCC I actually got a chance to play the great man himself, in the 1pocket division. And, if you ever get a chance to see the Accu-Stats Grady/Varner match, you may catch a glimpse of me playing Dallas on an adjoining table. He beat me 3-2 (I had him 2-1!). Dallas was gracious in victory and provided me with what was probably the highlight of the tournament for me personally. Now admittedly, he may say this to all the girls, but as we were shaking hands after the match he said, "I really like your game. I was lucky to beat you." For a guy that came up playing straight pool and idolized the 14.1 gods, that meant a lot coming from a World Champion Hall of Fame guy like Dallas. That same year, at the 2000 US Open 14.1 Championship in NYC, I was repeatedly drawn to his matches and watched him play and defeat Ginky and John Schmidt and lose to Efren.

And so, with the help of Duane Tuula (thanks, Duane!) and subsequently Dallas’ son, I was eventually able to get in personal contact with Dallas and set up a lesson in Rockford. As I spoke to him on the phone I told him that my basic idea was not to spend much time on basics, but rather let me pop a rack wide open, start a run, and have him talk me through the shots, position, and racks, explaining why one shot should be selected over another.

So on a Monday morning about three weeks ago, I met Dallas and his wife, Shirley, at the Rockford Denny’s and we sat and chatted a bit. Dallas is still as gentlemanly and cordial as ever and over coffee he explained to me that he doesn’t shoot much anymore, having had an eye operation to insert a lens that didn’t quite take -- he said that nowadays he has difficulty focusing out past six feet. We drove out to his studio in a converted barracks out near the Rockford Airport. An old Brunswick table with clay style balls, and true to my request, he had me set up a break ball and that’s were the fun started.

I asked him about break ball theory and asked him to set up the balls for his ideal break situation. And he showed me the set up and where he wanted to go into the stack. That alone was worth a lot. From there we went off to discuss break balls in general: do you prefer a higher or lower break ball (higher); all things being equal will you chose a poorer break ball on the left side in lieu of a better position on the right side (right side); do you play for break balls underneath the rack (no, it sends too many balls up table); do you favor follow or draw for your break shots (draw, to a surprising degree).

And then we had a chuckle when I asked him what he thought of the side pocket break, popular at Bob’s DCC 14.1 Challenge. He didn’t know about this event, so I explained as much as I knew and we finally came back to my original question and he kind of just shook his head and asked me, with a twinkle in his eye, “I don’t like it. Let me ask you something: when they shoot that break shot, what happens? Do the balls open up pretty good?”

And I said, “Sure -- they bust wide open.” And he shot back, “Exactly. And that’s why it’s no good -- it opens them up too much. You lose control of the balls.” And that’s when he threw out one of what was to be many simple but insightful gems, “Work the rack, don’t let the rack work you.” From there we talked about Mosconi, and Greenleaf, and Caras, and Joe Diehl and their preferred styles of playing and breaking and he showed me Caras’ favored break shot which made me blurt out, “Really?!”

All this and neither of us had hit a ball yet.

And so he said, ”Let’s go, open them up” and I rearranged the balls to his favored position and off we went. Each shot, I’d suggest a ball to be shot and what position to be played and often, frequently, well, almost every time I was wrong and he’d correct me and say, “No, you want to do this instead” and then explain why. In all honesty, I’d have to calculate that I was wrong in my selection around 60% of the time. At another point I had two balls on the end rail behind the rack and it was an obvious play: shoot the first ball into the right pocket, lay the cue ball on the rail for position for a gentle back cut on the second ball to the opposite pocket to go up table. I shoot the first ball and lay it on the rail and he stops me and says, “No. You let it go too far.”

What I had done was to gently shoot the first ball with slow follow and the cue ball had rolled forward, like maybe an inch or two. What Dallas was telling me was that the right way to shoot the shot was with draw to bring the cue ball back an inch or two: a total discrepancy of maybe three inches and he said, “That’s what you have to do: fight for every inch, don’t get lazy.” That was an eye opener.

And so it went, shot after shot until, without realizing it, I had run somewhere around 70-80 balls fresh out of the gate. When I finally missed (I had no shot and was frozen against the stack and missed a table length kick) he said, “You have a real nice touch, Lou. And, I know you didn’t want to get into basics, but… would you like to know what took me from being a 70-ball runner to the next level? Because I can see that’s where you’re at and it’s something you could work on.” And I said (wait for it), “Yes.” And he told me and frankly it’s not something I’m going to give away. You all need to see Dallas for that one, but believe me, it has been helping me *A Lot.* In this same vein, he showed me two shots and their variants that he said were essential for me to learn to excel at straight pool (I knew one of them from my 1pocket endeavors, but not the other.)

We also talked about aiming systems and I described current thoughts on the subject and he just shook his head and said, “Just an appeal to the vanity of man.” (I’ll let you figure out what he meant by that ;-) Manufacturing, or as he likes to call it, “fabricating” break balls and key balls. How to use other object balls to break up clusters. How some cut shots are deceptive. How to kill cue ball angles off object balls. He showed me caroms and combos and in particular a two-ball frozen combo that I swear I thought wouldn’t go. (In fact, I was incredulous and swore it wouldn’t go. But he showed me how to do it.)

At the end of four hours I could tell he was getting a little tired (he’s 70 now, but looks great) and I called it a wrap. Honestly, spending those four hours with Dallas was probably one of the best things I‘ve ever done for my pool game and I loved every minute of it. For the entire time I spent with him I felt as though Dallas was willing to share with me any and all knowledge he had and provided a thoughtful answer to each of my queries. And here’s one of the best things about the whole experience that goes beyond any specific tidbit of information he gave me: when I play 14.1 now, I hear Dallas in my head as if we were still back in his studio while he is talking me though the racks. I now have him in my brain and know what the right shot is. And, it’s kinda funny because every once in a while I’ll go against what Dallas is telling me to do and, almost invariably, the shot turns out badly for me and I have to laugh out loud -- me, the student, questioning The Master.

And so that’s it. If you love 14.1, and can get to Rockford, IL, you need to go now.

Lou Figueroa

What a blessing just to be able to hang with Dallas for 4 hours and have him share all that knowledge. Thanks for the wonderful details of your lesson. Great gift you got there!! Shoot straight and good luck:-)....
 
What a blessing just to be able to hang with Dallas for 4 hours and have him share all that knowledge. Thanks for the wonderful details of your lesson. Great gift you got there!! Shoot straight and good luck:-)....


Thanks, Mark.

Lou Figueroa
 
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