dquarasr
Registered
Perceptive.
Does a heavier cue have an advantage over lighter cues?
- Thread starter fish2
- Start date
Thanks for the correction. I'm pretty ignorant about time. I thought he was Caesar Morlaes just last year. So he must have discovered something profound after he was here for a couple of years beating everyone in sight with his K-Mart special.Pretty cool you got to meet him and hold his cue. Maybe that one was indeed 18oz. Maybe, since he was Cesar Morales about 40years ago, we can forgive you if you're memory is off by a few ounces
The cue he won the color of money 100k match vs Earl in 1995 was a 21oz Mezz, which he played pretty much the entire time he was under contract with them in the 90s. My guess is he didn't switch from 18 to 21 and then much higher than that with his 61+inch cue he used to win the 1999 World Championships.
For more info, check out this fun lil azb thread on Efren and his cues.
Efren Bata Reyes and His Pool Cues
I came across a discussion centered on pool cues. The question on what cue does Efren Reyes, aka The Magician, use came up. Truth be told, this is a very popular topic among pool players and enthusiasts. Everyone is curious as to what type of cue Efren uses. Believe you me, everyone. I...forums.azbilliards.com
I knew Efren a little, but I knew his manager Rolando better. We had lunch on several occasions and of course, talked about his favorite subject --- Efren. People started getting in Efren's head after he was here for a few years and his real name exposed, telling him he shouldn't be playing with that cheap cue. Thus began his love-hate relationship with cues. Although he could pretty much play with anything, and he did, depending on the endorsement contract he was under at the time, he often reverted back to the cheap cue that suited him best.
Even in that thread you pointed out, weight was mentioned once --- the 21 oz Meucci --- which he really didn't like, regardless of how he played with it. Thanks to everyone buzzing in his ear constantly, he was all over the place with cues over the years. I thought it was pretty interesting in that thread that he actually switched back to his old cue mid-match once.
Oh and another thing about Meuccis back then. They were heavily back-weighted cues. That would not have suited Efren's style of play which is a finesse style. His preference would be more front-weighted cues with a balance point more forward.
And one other thing I want to mention. Efren is a joker. He does't always tell the truth. He likes to joke around a bit in interviews to throw people off. Who really knows if that cue really weighed 21 oz?
But to say that he preferred a heavier cue due to his loop stroke is a stretch. I really don't even know how anyone can draw that conclusion about him.
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WobblyStroke
Well-known member
yes I heard he didn't like the Mezz too. That said, he won a lot with it and played with it for many years so he couldn't have minded too much. His most famous cheap cue was on long side and heavy as well, tho not mentioned in that thread.
And I didn't say that his style is why he played a heavy cue, just that he did play one and that fits with what the players I spoke to who play that kind of stroke (myself included) tend to prefer heavier, or at least back weighted cues. For me, that type of balance makes the cues feel like they shoot themselves while a more forward balanced cue feels like I need to do more with it.
This is obv subjective and may vary person to person, afterall these are feels we are talking about. But that's been my experience anyway and it's been echoed by others with a similar style. I did offer up other possible reasons for this preference my friend observed on his visit to the Philippines in my original post.
Honestly, Efren's cue weight may just be a function of his preference for longer cues. He played mostly 59s till that longer 61+inch cue he won in 1999 with. All that extra wood adds up.
WobblyStroke
Well-known member
With all due respect, I don't think you understand this style and how it feels. Back weighted cues are ideal when playing around with gravity and momentum...even on touchy little finesse shots. I'm not saying I'm Efren by any stretch of the imagination, but I have spent thousands of hours playing this way and have had 100s of hours of conversations with other players that do as well. Back-weighted fits this style like a glove.
Break Cue = Force = Mass Times Acceleration = Lighter Cue Moves Faster, More Break Control
Playing Cue = Personal Preference
Playing Cue = Personal Preference
Well okay then. You know best. I'm out. You're experience in pool tops mine by a milestone.
WobblyStroke
Well-known member
C'mon, don't be like that. I'm a neophite compared to you in pool. But I've always been more interested in pool strokes than pool itself and only a complete motor-control junkie of a sports nerd like me would ever invest as much time studying various techniques and what makes them tick for as many hours as I have just for the love of trying to solve a motor-control puzzle. So in this department, especially regarding non-standard strokes, and I'm sure only this department of overall pool knowledge, I may have something to offer that you don't. In all other areas regarding the game, your knowledge and experience dwarfs mine.
1. Faster cue speed can = less control.
2. Heavier cue (same force with less cue speed) can = more control.
pj
chgo
Jump cue makers (and I) agree.
Another potential advantage: a lighter cue uses a wider range of speeds to deliver the same range of force, which might make fine-tuning speed easier.
pj
chgo
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I like a heavier cue when using a mechanical bridge.
I like a heavy cue. to me personally , it seems to slow down my stroke and I "feel" like I stroke smoother with a heavy cue.
You are correct (my thought was regarding the enhanced feel of a lighter cue in one's hands).
This has also been my experience too, after owning alot of cues. The best one, I found, ended up being a cue weighing over 21oz foward balance. With the balance point being around 17.5 inches from the bumper. Its not the weight thats important here, its all about the balance. The weight just makes it easy to swing, you can do more with alot less. For me personally, it is easier to control the cue, I find, I can keep it straighter and on line of the shot. Than i can, with a lighter one
I've always found that playing w a heavier cue can cause one to hit a bit firmer on the cue ball. Heavier = Harder.
You must compensate for the weight diff w your stroke. The balance points are diff as well. My pocketing speed has been called firm. I'm tall and like a heavier axe than most... 20 to 21 oz. This bears into the equation as well. Recently experimenting w extensions as 57, 58, 59s have all forced me to make adjustments w my stroke, including some elbow drop I'd like to eliminate. Hopefully, this pays off. Good luck w your inquiry.
SeniorTom
Well-known member
I am more of a new player than an experienced one, but my back hand is usually placed towards the bottom of the cue then the balance point. I am 6 ft 1 in, and it just seems natural to handle the queue at that position. The reason I mention this is that my hand is of course back much further than the balance point. I have tried to grip the cue at the balance point and it just doesn't feel right at all. Not sure if this is common, but that's the way I handle the cue, and I am a pretty good shooter this way.
WobblyStroke
Well-known member
Gripping at the balance point seems awful and isn't done by anyone. But a certain distance behind the balance point, somewhere mid wrap, maybe back 1/3 of the wrap is a place where the cue feels like part of the arm for a lot of players. At 6'3" I need a joint extension to grip it there and keep my spacing but it is most comfortable for me. Gripping at the very end doesn't feel great for me, even tho I play pretty well like that as well.