Double Elimination

[daddypool]

1stly, just to clarify.

the BCn website match schedule indicates:

LIVE Match times for Sunday 9/25:
Match #1: 12 Noon - Earl Strickland v Francisco Bustamante
Match #2: 2 PM - Alex Pagulayan v Jose Parica
Match #3: 4 PM - Winner Match #1 v Winner Match #2
Match #4: 7 PM Championship Match

the Match#3 should be winner match #1 versus LOSER match #2...am I right?...

Sorry if this had been discussed already, but is this a "True" double elimination? or is it all just 1 final match race to the title?

If It is just ONE match, then the player waiting in the "HOT SEAT" is not truly justified as everyone got a chance to try again after one loss ...am I right?

I ask this because in some countries, its just single elimination and I personally feel double is good...for a second chance in the same tournament and for "revenge"!.....but...i also feel it should be for the final as well!
Daddypool

 

[MarkJS]

You're right, Match #3 is Match #1 winner versus Match #2 loser.

And no, the tournament is double-elimination, not the Final match.

In my opinion, the point of the tournament IS to reach the final match. I'm not a fan of double-elimination finals.

This year, the final match is one race to 11.

Oh, and think about being on the Hot Seat this way. That player only had to play ..what... six matches? Seven? Double that on the Loser's side... There's all kinds of advantages to being in the hot seat.

 

[daddypool]

thanks for that clarification.
Yep, i suppose thats true...the hotseat gets you there, but the loser's bracket is one long road ahead...when i went over to the US, i manged to experience that, and it was always taking forever..never ending matches to get back to the final match!

i guess one of the reasoning for the player in the hotseat would be that "hey! I played tough matches too! I had one bad break which made me lose..which was the finals! but i wish i had a second chance too!"
daddypool

 

[SUPERSTAR]

I never understood the point of a double elimination tournament, just to have a single race for the title that isn't exteneded to a longer race to compensate.

Earl and Francisco got an opportunity to lose, as will either Jose, or Alex.

Why shouldn't the winner of the hot seat be afforded that opportunity as well?

Should be that the losers bracket has to win twice. Only then, has everyone in the tournament had the same opportunity.

 

[gregory]

how often does the person from the 1-loss side win the finals. gabe and JJ both won without losing a match. what about before that?

 

[Snapshot9]

You mean ...

That the person from the loser's side doesn't have to
beat the winner of the winner's twice?

If so, then that is not fair, IMO. It should be equal for
everyone.

I wonder what would happen if the loser side beat the
winner's side once for the Title, and the guy from the
winner's side that lost took it to court and claimed
'descrimination'. Think he could get damages?

 

[daddypool]

well, i hope you dont believe that will happen...cos players will have to know the rules and uhave nderstood them before participating. i think thats the difference between "double elimination & TRUE double elimination"!

 

[Snapshot9]

HEy ...

well, i hope you dont believe that will happen...cos players will have to know the rules and uhave nderstood them before participating. i think thats the difference between "double elimination & TRUE double elimination"!

If a lady can spill her hot coffee in a McDonalds, slip on it, fall down, and
hurt herself, and take it to court, and win damages from McDonalds, then
anything is possible.

 

[daddypool]

If a lady can spill her hot coffee in a McDonalds, slip on it, fall down, and
hurt herself, and take it to court, and win damages from McDonalds, then
anything is possible.

wow! thats interesting....McDonalds should really try to get a better lawyer for themselves! I would like their lawyer to represent the next pool roganisation i sue for 'hurting' my pride and confidence when i lose!

 

[Snapshot9]

Now ...

wow! thats interesting....McDonalds should really try to get a better lawyer for themselves! I would like their lawyer to represent the next pool roganisation i sue for 'hurting' my pride and confidence when i lose!

That is funny ..... on the other hand, my brother is a lawyer ... lol
and he has represented over 80 pool players on
various cases, although many were DUI's.

 

[SUPERSTAR]

Well, everyone knows that it's single elimination in the finals. No one in the tournament doesn't know that. I'm just a fan of TRUE double elimination, that's all.

...for example.

EARL. He lost a very controversial match in which his behavior and all around professionalism were questioned because of his antics.

Had he not been afforded another chance, he very might have left the tournament with people talking about him being a has been and not the player that he used to be....etc etc.

It is only because he had the chance to lose, go have a talk with himself, and come out a different person, that he is now on the hero side of things, and a true warrior, and people have had the opportunity to see that Earl, when he has his head screwed on straight, is a very lethal force in the pool world.

So what if the HOT seat guy, has a bum match?

Shouldn't he be afforded the same chance to go fix himself, and re-prepare himself to try and perform at his best?

If it's single elimination, then it should be single elimination the whole way through, if it's double, then it should be double the whole way through....like the Joss events.

The hot seat guy has earned the right to have to be beaten twice.

 

[daddypool]

That is funny ..... on the other hand, my brother is a lawyer ... lol
and he has represented over 80 pool players on
various cases, although many were DUI's.

pardon my ignorance..what are DUI's???

I can only imaging a pool related lawsuit would be for not being paid,etc...??

anyway,back to topic..i still feel its not totally fair..but then we are selfish beings at times..if we were in the loser side's view...it would be "better" for us...we would not complain...in this case..i'm happy for Bustamante...since he just won Strickland..and if he gets to the Final match..he got as good a chance as the guy in the hotseat!
daddypool

 

[Snapshot9]

Explanation ...

pardon my ignorance..what are DUI's???

I can only imaging a pool related lawsuit would be for not being paid,etc...??

anyway,back to topic..i still feel its not totally fair..but then we are selfish beings at times..if we were in the loser side's view...it would be "better" for us...we would not complain...in this case..i'm happy for Bustamante...since he just won Strickland..and if he gets to the Final match..he got as good a chance as the guy in the hotseat!
daddypool

DUI - Driving under the Influence

What is fair about your opponent being able to lose a match,
and win the Championship by only having to beat you once
in a DOUBLE Elimination tournament.... nothing is fair about it.
In the sense of justice and fair play, a double elimination tournament
should be equally fair to all players, and that includes the player
that happens to win the winner's bracket. What ... The winner
of the winner's bracket loses $20,000 because he loses 1 time,
and the winner of the loser's bracket doesn't lose $20,000 for
his 1 loss ... that's bullshit .... The only reason they eliminated
a second match was for convenience in running the tournament,
of not wanting to stay an extra 2 or 3 hours, or because TV had
to cut off, or some other bullshit reason, in otherwards for political
reasons.

Every player in the tournament gets 2 chances to win the tournament,
but the winner of the winner's bracket .... How is that fair?

 

[daddypool]

Every player in the tournament gets 2 chances to win the tournament,
but the winner of the winner's bracket .... How is that fair?

I agree with you, Scott. As I felt the same way, thus the thread. Again, the only time when I won't mind is when I'm the one from the one-loss side....(everyone for himself?)

well, I guess there is little we can do. If the format were to be changed now, imagine those players from past years suing them! now thats a scary thought...imagine Earl notbeing happy about it! (If he had been in the hotseat before and lost just once...to settle for runner-up)
daddypool