earl strickland,s temper problem

Gerry said:
You can't compare pool v golf....it doesn't work!

I played golf competitevely for about 8 years from jr high to leagues, and held a 4 handicap, so I qualify to compare the two.

If you added up the number of players that play pool at a pro level, and the number of scratch golfers out there, I believe golf would outweigh pool world wide.

If I had to compare the two....I'd say it was much harder for me to go to a regional pool tourney and cash then to go to an open low level regional golf tour and cash. I'd also say I play golf and pool at the same level.

and, the reason 90% of the population can't break 90 is they lack the physical skills needed to do it......AND they don't pactice thier short game!;)

Gerry


there are more scratch golfers, because there are more golfers period....
it is more popular worldwide...
I am a single digit capper myself...
physical abilities in golf can be learned much faster than course management and the rest of the mental aspects of the game... which take many years to learn... and no one has ever completely mastered...
There are thousands upon thousands of great ball strikers that won't ever make it on tour, because the mental side of golf is so tough....
 
PoolBum said:
I'll believe that when Tiger Woods has to play his ball from where his opponent leaves him......

I'll believe the opposite when Efren has made 18 great ball pocketing/ball spreading break shots in a row yet after 4 of them has had to play his next shot with the cue ball lodged in one of several large holes caused by unrepaired rips in the cloth made by a previous player:)

poolBum said:
..... (I'l believe that when Tiger woods) can lose a tournament without ever getting to shoot.....

In truth losing a tournament without getting to play a shot involves no mental toughness at all in specific respect of participating in that particular tournament, it only requires mental toughness in accepting the result and getting yourself up for the next tournament. For the duration of a match in which you never get to play a shot it doesn't matter a jot whether you are mentally tough or mentally weak, neither a mentally tough nor a mentally weak 'you' can do anything about it. Both sports frequently requre similar mental toughness to get 'up' for the next tourney after not doing anything essentially wrong in the last one yet still failing to win, but in fairness so do many other sports.

Indeed, as a side issue, there might be a valid school of thought which says that any 'sport' involving the striking of balls in which one participant may never get the opportunity to strike a single ball is clearly a sport with fundamentally flawed rules which need some amendment or more to the point probably isn't really a 'sport' at all.


PoolBum said:
...... I think golf is the tougher game physically, but pool is the tougher game mentally.

Absolutely no question whatsoever that golf is the tougher game physically. They do have different mental pressures and there are some areas where each game requires more mental 'toughness' than the other. The call is therefore harder to make on that score but in my opinion golf would still come out overall considerably tougher mentally.

Many years ago I played the equivalent of pro level pool in uk pool (there was no real official pro level then) and can still hold a cue. Nowadays I play golf close to European PGA Seniors Tour pro level and have competed in their tour events as a qualifying amateur. In both cases my personal experience is light years away from having the experience at the elite levels which would be required to make a definitive comparison of how it is at the top, but I hope this is an objective and reasonably informed assessment anyway:o
 
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good points, but I can't agree that golf is tougher mentally. In golf you have 1 ball, and 1 hole to concern yourself with. Obviously the other variables come into play like weather, turf, terrain etc. In pool (especially 14.1) you have 15 balls AND the cueball, table conditions, conditions IN the pool room (smoke, loud music, stupid people etc.) I'm no mathematician, but calculate those variables and compare to see where there is more thought to get the job done. Good thread though.

Gerry
 
BPG24 said:
Golf is by far the most mentally challenging sport in the world.... That is why 80% of golfers in the world can't break 90 when playing by the rules.....

How can you even argue this? Unless you haven't played competitive golf

What about jai alai? People can die playing that sh!t man! And for less than $50,000 a year. Those dudes risk their lives for a game they love. Golfers just do a lot of walking.

:D
 
This is totally not pool related...... and I am sure to draw the falmes of a few but the toughest mental game in the world isnt golf.. isnt pool...

But it is the one and only good ole American football.......
NOTHING matches the physical levels and mental levels that football demands...

22 men..22 specific assignments.. assignments that vary depending on the movements ofthe other 21 guys on the field...

Just think about how many "plans" most be accounted for before a lineman can throw a "simple" block ....
 
The king of games for mental toughness - My First Uno, Thomas the Tank Engine edition. We just bought this for our son (4 next month). He's cleaning both mine and mommy's clock on this game. He puts down a "change color" card, chooses a different color than what his last card is, and ends up getting out because I end up having the card that matches the character on his. FRUSTRATING!

All kidding aside, the king of mental toughness, in regards to games is chess. No arguments about it. Golf and pool have great parallels, and I think neither holds an advantage over the other. Look at the greats in the pool world. Archer and Deuel are sub-4 handicaps, and there are many other players that have single digit handicaps that play pool well also. There are different pressures for each sport, and I think they all add up to a similar amount.
 
travis trotter said:
i read that earl is back to his old temper again and almost got thrown out the door at a pool tournament is this true ?:)

thanks

Maybe he got tired of reading your idiotic posts. I know that would make me irate enough to be thrown out of a tournament!
 
smokeandapancak said:
This is totally not pool related...... and I am sure to draw the falmes of a few but the toughest mental game in the world isnt golf.. isnt pool...

But it is the one and only good ole American football.......
NOTHING matches the physical levels and mental levels that football demands...

22 men..22 specific assignments.. assignments that vary depending on the movements ofthe other 21 guys on the field...

Just think about how many "plans" most be accounted for before a lineman can throw a "simple" block ....

This is by far the worst call yet. Football? The toughest mental game?!?! There is NOTHING mentally challenging about football. Like you said. 11 positions on either side. That's 22 different guys with 22 different jobs (excluding special teams). And only a select few have to be profocient at all aspects of the game. The reast are as one dimiensional as can be.
 
Gerry said:
good points, but I can't agree that golf is tougher mentally. In golf you have 1 ball, and 1 hole to concern yourself with. Obviously the other variables come into play like weather, turf, terrain etc. In pool (especially 14.1) you have 15 balls AND the cueball, table conditions, conditions IN the pool room (smoke, loud music, stupid people etc.) I'm no mathematician, but calculate those variables and compare to see where there is more thought to get the job done. Good thread though.

Gerry

Yes Gerry, fair enough but......a few points....

1 ball and 1 hole (about 72 times) in a round of golf, sure....but 14 clubs from which to select the right one for each and every shot after taking into account whether the ball is above or below your feet, whether the target is uphill or down hill, upwind, downwind or crosswind, at what windspeed, whether the terrain allows you options of running the ball on to the green or throwing it all the way to the flag, whether you are going to play a low or high trajectory shot, whether there is a water or other hazard or out of bounds area play safe away from or to 'take-on' for risk and reward.

In 9 ball pool the "green" is always the same size and you have 6 pockets to chose from each time the ball needs to be holed, not just 1 choice like in golf........ and all 6 pockets which you have to choose from each time you are trying to hole the ball are always in the same position and always on a flat surface. You are playing with one club of one size/length (except the break and the odd jump shot) with which you can quite easily repeat the same stroke for the same result.

In pool you are playing one person at a time and you know you are definitely going to get a head to head opportunity with rivals for the title. In stroke play golf you are generally playing the course not the man and quite often you will be beaten by someone who you may not have even seen strike a single ball in the competition, let alone have played alongside so you may need to guess what he is up to.

In pool every shot is played off the same surface, in golf within the same round you may have to play shots off closely mown dry or wet turf, ankle high dry or wet grass, knee high dry or wet grass, clumps of grass in front of or behind the ball through the striking area, dry or wet sand (deep or shallow) and your swing or stance may be physically impeded by terrain or obstructions in a myriad of diferent ways.

Personally I could not imagine ever having to put as much thought into 18 frames of 9 ball as into 18 holes of golf on a Championship standard course. I would like to think that the necesary thought patterns in both games come to me in the main naturally and instinctively as I have never had lessons at either.

That being understood, mental toughness is of course not just about the extent of thought that requires to go into shot selections etc and I can certainly see where a form of mental toughness peculiar to pool tournaments specifically has evolved.

Thanks for your thought provoking contribution to this. I agree it's a good thread and think it would also be great to hear views from some others with solid pool and golf experience at tournament level.
 
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memikey said:
In truth losing a tournament without getting to play a shot involves no mental toughness at all in specific respect of participating in that particular tournament, it only requires mental toughness in accepting the result and getting yourself up for the next tournament.

Yes, but you miss the point. The point is that mental toughness correlates with pressure, and there's no pressure in golf like the pressure in pool having to play your top game knowing that a single miss can cost you the match or the tournament. If Tiger Woods plays a bad shot he can recover on the next one, or if he has a bad hole he still has 71 other holes to make up for it. In pool, whether it's 9-ball, 14.1, or 1-hole, any single mistake can cost you the match or the tournament. That's pressure, and that's why I say pool is tougher mentally.
 
cuetechustla said:
I've been meaning to post this for the longest and keep forgetting. Hope this is not a repeat :o Earl explains his temper issues in this report.

Link
That's the best article on Earl Strickland i've ever read and I want to thank you for posting the link. I've enjoyed watching Earl play over the years and there will never be another player like Earl! When he's holding it together mentally and playing his game he's almost unbeatable.

James
 
one of the main reasons i said that pool was the toughest mentally to spark this debate, is the fact that you need to be completely mentally relaxed, at ease, and at one with yourself to play even decent. the slightest twitch or tenseness in your arm will affect your play. the smallest thought of the object ball jawing will make you contact that cue tip just a hair off where you wanted to and will cause you to miss. and the results are more in your face with pool. instantly the result of what you've done is in your face - watching the ball miss the pocket again - it chips away at your mental strength.

somebody mentioned american football. i don't agree it's even comparable - it's too different. i am a huge football fan (soccer to you yanks :) and can bang on all day about the skill and gift it takes to be able to play at a high level. but you are outside in the fresh air running about on a pitch. this makes a difference. with pool you are cooped up indoors. how many times have you just got so tense and stressed and wished you could run outside and run a mile to run the stress off? theres the intensity of the mental pressure and tests in pool.
 
[QUOTE=worriedbeef]one of the main reasons i said that pool was the toughest mentally to spark this debate, is the fact that you need to be completely mentally relaxed, at ease, and at one with yourself to play even decent. the slightest twitch or tenseness in your arm will affect your play. the smallest thought of the object ball jawing will make you contact that cue tip just a hair off where you wanted to and will cause you to miss. and the results are more in your face with pool. instantly the result of what you've done is in your face - watching the ball miss the pocket again - it chips away at your mental strength.


Do you not think that all of these things relate directly to Golf as well?
 
memikey said:
Yes Gerry, fair enough but......a few points....

1 ball and 1 hole (about 72 times) in a round of golf, sure....but 14 clubs from which to select the right one for each and every shot after taking into account whether the ball is above or below your feet, whether the target is uphill or down hill, upwind, downwind or crosswind, at what windspeed, whether the terrain allows you options of running the ball on to the green or throwing it all the way to the flag, whether you are going to play a low or high trajectory shot, whether there is a water or other hazard or out of bounds area play safe away from or to 'take-on' for risk and reward.

In 9 ball pool the "green" is always the same size and you have 6 pockets to chose from each time the ball needs to be holed, not just 1 choice like in golf........ and all 6 pockets which you have to choose from each time you are trying to hole the ball are always in the same position and always on a flat surface. You are playing with one club of one size/length (except the break and the odd jump shot) with which you can quite easily repeat the same stroke for the same result.

In pool you are playing one person at a time and you know you are definitely going to get a head to head opportunity with rivals for the title. In stroke play golf you are generally playing the course not the man and quite often you will be beaten by someone who you may not have even seen strike a single ball in the competition, let alone have played alongside so you may need to guess what he is up to.

In pool every shot is played off the same surface, in golf within the same round you may have to play shots off closely mown dry or wet turf, ankle high dry or wet grass, knee high dry or wet grass, clumps of grass in front of or behind the ball through the striking area, dry or wet sand (deep or shallow) and your swing or stance may be physically impeded by terrain or obstructions in a myriad of diferent ways.

Personally I could not imagine ever having to put as much thought into 18 frames of 9 ball as into 18 holes of golf on a Championship standard course. I would like to think that the necesary thought patterns in both games come to me in the main naturally and instinctively as I have never had lessons at either.

That being understood, mental toughness is of course not just about the extent of thought that requires to go into shot selections etc and I can certainly see where a form of mental toughness peculiar to pool tournaments specifically has evolved.

Thanks for your thought provoking contribution to this. I agree it's a good thread and think it would also be great to hear views from some others with solid pool and golf experience at tournament level.


yea...but...but....I bet my dad can beat up your dad!

good post!

G.
 
BPG24 said:
Ok in this article Earl says that pool is tougher than golf or tennis....

He has definately lost his mind....... He couldn't be more wrong.....
Golf is much more difficult both mentally and physically... and so is tennis..
I am talking about at a top or close to top level, not casual play

I agree, I used to play both sports (before a disease put a stop to my golfing) and golf was MUCH TOUGHER IMO. Its much harder to me to shoot par than it is to run a rack in 8 ball.

I'm left handed and had so many problems swinging a club I decided to play right handed and played much better. Still didnt shoot 'good' at all. The mental and physical part of the game is much tougher on the body in golf as it is pool (I used to could play pool for 24+ hours, damn sure couldnt do that in golf).

Just my worthless few cents ;-)

BTW-I like Earl and his game, but after seeing him do a few things on t.v. and him acting like a baby I quit rooting for him. He acts like I did when I was about 9.
 
PoolBum said:
Yes, but you miss the point. The point is that mental toughness correlates with pressure, and there's no pressure in golf like the pressure in pool having to play your top game knowing that a single miss can cost you the match or the tournament. If Tiger Woods plays a bad shot he can recover on the next one, or if he has a bad hole he still has 71 other holes to make up for it. In pool, whether it's 9-ball, 14.1, or 1-hole, any single mistake can cost you the match or the tournament. That's pressure, and that's why I say pool is tougher mentally.

:D No bud.....you've actually changed the point:D

Your original post which I responded to concerned the the issue of losing a match "without ever getting to play a shot". You will appreciate that in terms of mental pressure never getting to play a single shot in a match is very different from "playing a shot or series of shots whilst worrying that if you miss you might never get another shot in the match", for reasons which I described in my post

The former involves no mental pressure (and certainly no mental pressure which can affect your stroke/game because you ain't gonna be playing any shots:D) the latter of course does ........and if that was what you had originally posted my response would of course have been different. We don't have any significant disagreement on the thrust of the changed argument you are now putting forward, only perhaps on the extent of mental pressure which those circumstances exert:)
 
memikey said:
:D No bud.....you've actually changed the point:D

Your original post which I responded to concerned the the issue of losing a match "without ever getting to play a shot".

Sorry, you did miss my point because you took literally what was meant figuratively. :D

My point is that pool is a sport played to such a high level of perfection that any mistake can cost one an entire match or even a tournament. If you play a poor shot in golf you can recover on your next shot, or next hole, or next round. If you play a poor shot in pool you may never get a next shot. That's the difference in pressure between the two sports, IMHO.
 
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pharaoh68 said:
This is by far the worst call yet. Football? The toughest mental game?!?! There is NOTHING mentally challenging about football. Like you said. 11 positions on either side. That's 22 different guys with 22 different jobs (excluding special teams). And only a select few have to be profocient at all aspects of the game. The reast are as one dimiensional as can be.


Spoken like a true "bench warmer"

There isnt one position on a football that runs on it own....everything is reactionary.. EVERYTHING...

No mental challenge..pssssshhht.... take one of those "simple positions" a lineman... do you have any idea how many reads he has to make in a 5 seconds before the ball is snapped? Not to mention the adjustments and pick ups he has to make in the 3 secs it takes to execute a play... oh yeah .. all ofthat has to be done while he takes on an equally aggressive D lineman hell bent on screwing up all of his plans ....

And that isnt even a "skill" position....
 
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