Elbow Waggle?

[nelldrake]

I don't know what else to call it. My arm is in the correct 90 degree angle with the forearm and elbow aligned with the cue/shot. I seem to miss shots because this does not remain steady and in line with the shot on my final stroke. I also tend to "chicken wing" on speed shots such as one with a lot of draw or follow, i.e. power shots. After reading some of the threads here I may be gripping harder when I am trying to impart more speed/power. Are there any exercises I can do to strengthen shoulder/upper arm muscles to help control the "waggle"? Or maybe some other technique to correct this??

 

[Scott Lee]

nelldrake...You're doing it wrong. A pendulum swing does not require strong muscles. You do not "hold" the shoulder. In fact, the shoulder is not involved in the swing at all...ideally. Try this...take your shooting arm, and let it hang by your side (do this standing up). Raise your hand to your shouder...if you're doing it correctly, only the forearm moves. There is no movement of the shoulder joint, or upper arm. You will feel your bicep touch your forearm. Now bend over, like you were standing in your table stance, and do the exact same thing. If you're doing it right, the upper arm doesn't have to move, and there are NO strained muscles anywhere...even with a fast swing. Hope this helps. :grin: If you really want to easily learn this concept, consult a qualified instructor, or pick up a copy of our instructional video, "Play Better Pool" Vol. 1, Mastering the Fundamentals.

Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com

I don't know what else to call it. My arm is in the correct 90 degree angle with the forearm and elbow aligned with the cue/shot. I seem to miss shots because this does not remain steady and in line with the shot on my final stroke. I also tend to "chicken wing" on speed shots such as one with a lot of draw or follow, i.e. power shots. After reading some of the threads here I may be gripping harder when I am trying to impart more speed/power. Are there any exercises I can do to strengthen shoulder/upper arm muscles to help control the "waggle"? Or maybe some other technique to correct this??

 

[randyg]

I don't know what else to call it. My arm is in the correct 90 degree angle with the forearm and elbow aligned with the cue/shot. I seem to miss shots because this does not remain steady and in line with the shot on my final stroke. I also tend to "chicken wing" on speed shots such as one with a lot of draw or follow, i.e. power shots. After reading some of the threads here I may be gripping harder when I am trying to impart more speed/power. Are there any exercises I can do to strengthen shoulder/upper arm muscles to help control the "waggle"? Or maybe some other technique to correct this??

Sounds like a tight grip.
randyg

 

[pooltchr]

Nell,
Start with the simple alignment drill, setting the ball on the headspot, and shooting it straight down the table to have it come back to your tip. When you are consistent with your results, gradually increase your speed. Watch for any sideways tip movement that would indicate a change in the muscles you are using in your stroke. You should be able to use your SOP stroke at virtually any speed.

I'm still willing to come down there for a weekend whenever you are ready.

Steve

 

[nelldrake]

nelldrake...You're doing it wrong. A pendulum swing does not require strong muscles. You do not "hold" the shoulder. In fact, the shoulder is not involved in the swing at all...ideally. Try this...take your shooting arm, and let it hang by your side (do this standing up). Raise your hand to your shouder...if you're doing it correctly, only the forearm moves. There is no movement of the shoulder joint, or upper arm. You will feel your bicep touch your forearm. Now bend over, like you were standing in your table stance, and do the exact same thing. If you're doing it right, the upper arm doesn't have to move, and there are NO strained muscles anywhere...even with a fast swing. Hope this helps. :grin: If you really want to easily learn this concept, consult a qualified instructor, or pick up a copy of our instructional video, "Play Better Pool" Vol. 1, Mastering the Fundamentals.

Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com

Thanks, Scott. I didn't mean to imply that I used my shoulder muscles. I was just wondering if that might be why my elbow waggles on speed shots. The rest of your suggestions were pertinent and helpful.

 

[nelldrake]

Nell,
Start with the simple alignment drill, setting the ball on the headspot, and shooting it straight down the table to have it come back to your tip. When you are consistent with your results, gradually increase your speed. Watch for any sideways tip movement that would indicate a change in the muscles you are using in your stroke. You should be able to use your SOP stroke at virtually any speed.

I'm still willing to come down there for a weekend whenever you are ready.

Steve

Thanks, Steve. I am still interested in getting some instruction from you. I read all your posts here and like the way you approach problems. I am certainly going to try the exercise with the spot shot.

 

[nelldrake]

I've been on my table practicing with a practice ball that shows (chalk mark) where you are hitting the cueball. I am putting unwanted right English on the CB. It very consistently comes off the end rail to the right (not a lot, probably an inch or 2). After watching my stroke in the mirror (don't have a video camera, darn it) I can see that I am pulling my grip hand slightly in toward my body. Any way to correct this? I seem to put less English to the right if I lengthen my follow through. Scott Lee's suggestion that I bring my forearm up to my bicep might help.
Frustrated in Alabama

 

[pooltchr]

Find the finish position that results in a straight stroke, and focus on bringing your grip hand to that exact point on every shot. If you have set yourself properly, and finish in the right spot, you don't even have to think about where or how you are hitting the ball or following through. Follow through is the result of finishing your stroke.

Steve

 

[Scott Lee]

nelldrake...This is still a grip issue, as randyg mentioned. You must quit clenching the cue when you strike the CB. Let the cue do the work...it's all you need...cue weight, speed and timing...no strength at all. There is only one finish position for your tip. When you swing your arm, the way I explained earlier, your hand finishes on or under your boob. Your tip will only go just so far past the CB with this kind of swing (unless you drop your elbow). More followthrough is not only unnecessary (and will not provide any better accuracy or anything else), but if you are trying to do more, you're defeating the purpose of the pendulum swing...KISS rules(keep it simple silly! :grin.

Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com

I've been on my table practicing with a practice ball that shows (chalk mark) where you are hitting the cueball. I am putting unwanted right English on the CB. It very consistently comes off the end rail to the right (not a lot, probably an inch or 2). After watching my stroke in the mirror (don't have a video camera, darn it) I can see that I am pulling my grip hand slightly in toward my body. Any way to correct this? I seem to put less English to the right if I lengthen my follow through. Scott Lee's suggestion that I bring my forearm up to my bicep might help.
Frustrated in Alabama