Bob seems to be the type of salesman who could "sell a refridgerator to an eskimo"! The eskimo knows he doesn't need a fridge, but somehow Bob can convince him he does! And when he buys it, it only hurts the eskimo because of the "side effects" of the fridge!
...Zim
...Zim
H
halhoule
Guest
Whatever the characteristics of cue or shaft, using back-hand english negates deflection.
Hal Houle
Hal Houle
H
halhoule
Guest
The cue is only a tool that propels the ball. The cue ball to object ball line-up has to be accurate to begin with. I do not have any trouble using any brand of cue to pocket balls. I think players pocket balls accurately and consistently, not cues.
Hal Houle
Hal Houle
J
JimR.
Guest
Deflection
Grain orientation has a lot to do with deflection. When using side english, if the grain is oriented vertically, you will get less deflection, than if it is horizonal. Likewise you will get better draw if the grain is horizonal. JimR.
Grain orientation has a lot to do with deflection. When using side english, if the grain is oriented vertically, you will get less deflection, than if it is horizonal. Likewise you will get better draw if the grain is horizonal. JimR.
J
JimR.
Guest
Deflection
Grain orientation has a lot to do with deflection. If using side english, you will get less deflection if the grain is orientated vertically rather than horizonally. Thus the red dot shafts, I marked mine with a magic marker. JimR.
Grain orientation has a lot to do with deflection. If using side english, you will get less deflection if the grain is orientated vertically rather than horizonally. Thus the red dot shafts, I marked mine with a magic marker. JimR.
S
SuperDave
Guest
Personally, I note very little deflection with my Meucci because I don't leave myself shots which require risking deflection. If you gotta play strong english after running the cue ball the length of the table, chances are deflection isn't your root problem. Getting good position is.
I like two things about my red-dot Meucci which I cannot have in a comparable cue for the money:
1) English, when I use it, requires much less forethought and concentration than other cues. It's a very intuitive process. I get the same english with half a tip that other brands can with a full tip. That, obviously, reduces the chance of a miscue. I also find it much easier to control the level of english applied, when it takes so little effort to apply it. If I don't want english, then I hit the centerline of the cue ball, the same way all of you do with your other brands. They all hit it straight when you swing it straight.
2) It's a real pleasure to play Meucci-bashers. They are so convinced that I'm a fool for buying such a piece of firewood that they dismiss me as a player. Anybody ever done that, only to get their ass kicked as a result? I have. However, being a Meucci owner, I get to give more often than I receive.
The point is, the person holding the stick is a whale of a lot more important than the stick they're holding. I'm no pro, maybe a B-level player, but I'm 97% as good with a bar stick as I am with my Meucci. If you can't say that, the cue isn't the problem.
I like two things about my red-dot Meucci which I cannot have in a comparable cue for the money:
1) English, when I use it, requires much less forethought and concentration than other cues. It's a very intuitive process. I get the same english with half a tip that other brands can with a full tip. That, obviously, reduces the chance of a miscue. I also find it much easier to control the level of english applied, when it takes so little effort to apply it. If I don't want english, then I hit the centerline of the cue ball, the same way all of you do with your other brands. They all hit it straight when you swing it straight.
2) It's a real pleasure to play Meucci-bashers. They are so convinced that I'm a fool for buying such a piece of firewood that they dismiss me as a player. Anybody ever done that, only to get their ass kicked as a result? I have. However, being a Meucci owner, I get to give more often than I receive.
The point is, the person holding the stick is a whale of a lot more important than the stick they're holding. I'm no pro, maybe a B-level player, but I'm 97% as good with a bar stick as I am with my Meucci. If you can't say that, the cue isn't the problem.
E
ecain
Guest
meucci far from fire wood
just recieved the meucci pp-2 w/ blackdot shaft. this cue is far from firewood. I couldn't get it to deflect; I was shooting from the first diamond across the spot, and directly into the center of the name plate every time. I was getting so much english that the cue ball would hit around the second diamond in the kitchen on the bank. I continued to shoot closer to the edge of the cue ball, until I miscued, and couldn't get any real deflection, and besides that the cue has one of the most amazing hits i have ever felt; I don't want to stop shooting!Adanac67 said:
Burn baby Burn
Meucci came out with a shaft (I believe it was the black dot) that didn't deflect as much as the 314 according to Bob's mechanical shooting mechanism. I have never tried one, and probably never will (you know that consumer confidence thing). Anything else is definately firewood!
Meucci came out with a shaft (I believe it was the black dot) that didn't deflect as much as the 314 according to Bob's mechanical shooting mechanism. I have never tried one, and probably never will (you know that consumer confidence thing). Anything else is definately firewood!
T
THE SILENCER
Guest
to the person who originally posted "i don't see much deflection" your not hitting too one side enough, believe me it's there, otherwise, pros would miss less often. as far as eliminating deflection completly, there is only one, i repeat one shaft that reduced deflection to 0. it's not predator 314 or the Z, it's not tiger X, it's not meucci red or black dot, no it's none of these bullsh@# shafts. the one and only shaft, that totally eliminates deflection is the schuler super constant shaft. for those of you who never heard of this shaft, and want a zero deflection shaft, meaning you could hit with all the side in the world, at top speed and have zero deflection this is the only shaft ever that eliminates deflection 100%! and for those out there who tried a schuler super constant shaft, write in and confirm, that it's all true what i'm saying. the reason why i and most players do NOT use the super constant is because the taper is so thick, it doesn't feel right through your closed bridge. but, if your willing to get used to it, or you play 3-cushion billiards where the taper is thick in the first place, this is thee shaft.
THE SILENCER said:
You have a good point here. I have a couple of schuler shafts, but not the super constant. One is a billiard shaft and one is a stiff pool shaft. I also have a couple of custom cues made by a guy who does mostly carom cues with varying shafts, including a billiard shaft. No shaft I own is anywhere close to as flexible as a meucci. All are much stiffer. If people have not hit with a billiard cue, their ideas of deflection are often wrong. My challenge is to go to a billiard table and find a shot that requires a good accurate hit with a lot of english where the cue ball is 7-8' away from the first object ball and has to go a long way after the hit. I have a 4 rail pattern I like to use. Get yourself a billiard cue with a nice fat taper and a small tip and hit the shot for a while. Now do it with a meucci. It will tell you more than debating bob meuccis mystery robot demonstration. Go hit some balls. If bob meucci were right, all the carom players would play with meuccis. He ain't, they don't.
Hal Houle
Hey Hal, glad to see you posting again. People have been wondering what happened to you.
I've never been able to play very well with backhand english, although I know a couple players who use it and they play very well with it.
On deflection, I have never really had much of a problem with it. If I play with the same cue for long enough, I'll learn how to aim with the deflection. The cue I use now doesn't deflect ALOT, but it does deflect. I've also found that when you have a good stroke, and are able to strike the cueball cleanly, basically more = less. In other words, if I wanna juice the ball up, I really don't have to apply that much english, it's just all in the stroke. If i'm not using that much english to juice up the cue ball, deflection isn't really a problem because the ball is not deflecting to the point where I really have to stop and think about how to aim. It all becomes feel eventually.
Hey Hal, glad to see you posting again. People have been wondering what happened to you.
I've never been able to play very well with backhand english, although I know a couple players who use it and they play very well with it.
On deflection, I have never really had much of a problem with it. If I play with the same cue for long enough, I'll learn how to aim with the deflection. The cue I use now doesn't deflect ALOT, but it does deflect. I've also found that when you have a good stroke, and are able to strike the cueball cleanly, basically more = less. In other words, if I wanna juice the ball up, I really don't have to apply that much english, it's just all in the stroke. If i'm not using that much english to juice up the cue ball, deflection isn't really a problem because the ball is not deflecting to the point where I really have to stop and think about how to aim. It all becomes feel eventually.
Deflection
Doesn't taper have anything to do with deflection? I don't care for the Predator shafts myself, each to his own. I've never heard of anybody with a Southwest or Capone talk much about it either. Maybe taper ,shaft wood quality and wood to wood joints all have an effect on deflection. Just some thoughts to go with my first cup of java. Have great day eveyone.
Doesn't taper have anything to do with deflection? I don't care for the Predator shafts myself, each to his own. I've never heard of anybody with a Southwest or Capone talk much about it either. Maybe taper ,shaft wood quality and wood to wood joints all have an effect on deflection. Just some thoughts to go with my first cup of java. Have great day eveyone.
drivermaker
Banned
Since FL isn't around to do some bashing on this, I guess I'll have to take his place. All of you guys that just love hammering Meucci, only because it's the "in" thing to do among custom cue elitists or those that really think they know a lot about cues in general, are total numb skulls and morons. Meucci's have been used by more Hall of Famers and big name players over the years than any other cue out there. At one time or another, Efren used one, Mike Sigel, Jim Rempe, Loree Jon Jones, Howard Vickery, and the list goes on. Why would they do that...because they don't know cues as well as you do or just stupid? No...it's because the damn things just play good. What I say here isn't going to change anyone's mind that can't stand a Meucci any more than someone can change mine about a Predator, but at least I gave a Predator a year's worth of hard play to come to that conclusion, whereas some of you never even played extensively with a Meucci and even admitted to not ever trying a black dot shaft. Meucci now has the deflection tests available on video for anyone that calls and requests it. 1-800-563-8224. Whether you feel any differently after viewing it or not, it is quite interesting and eye opening regarding different cues in the test and their results...forget about what Meucci does in the test. Some are just a lot better or worse than others and it's right there in front of your eyes to see. The test is done with a 10mph hit, which isn't really blasting the balls and a laser beam to insure accuracy on each hit with every cue. And besides, Hal Houle is 100% correct about using backhand english and negating deflection, that is unless you're using a Predator. Then you'll over correct and miss everything. The other thing is, there's two axis on a cue ball...horizontal and vertical. If more players learned how to become more proficient in just using vertical (follow, center and draw) with appropriate speed to create angles for the next shot, deflection is a moot point. You don't even need to give a rat's ass. But, more players than enough are horizontally inclined and either love seeing the CB zinging all over hell or are forced to because of lousy position play and are using far too much tip offset than is necessary for the task. I currently own 17 cues, a mix of mainly production and a couple custom cues, and I can say without a doubt, that a Meucci ranks among the top for PLAYABILITY and PERFORMANCE. For high end craftmanship and quality control problems here and there, it will occur in almost any production cue and it is that. Their incidents are a little higher than others, but it's not like Meucci's are going to all fall apart as the haters and bashers would lead one to believe.
drivermaker said:
In case you didn't know, most pro players that have played tournaments with a Meucci, did so because they were paid (sponsored) by Bob to use the cue. I know some of these players who have used the cue in a tournament and behind closed doors say that can't stand using the cue. Others, simply take the cue to a custom cuemaker and have custom shafts made. I know of at least one pro who took his cue to a custom cuemaker and had the cue rebuilt into a custom cue with new shafts and made to look like a meucci. There is a cuemaker in Florida and specializes in this.
The bottom line is, Meucci cues may be fine for some players, but you can't but any weight into which cue, pro players choose, when they are paid (sponsored) by Meucci.
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drivermaker
Banned
oceanweb said:
And I guess that doesn't apply to anyone else like, Cuetec, Predator, Falcon, Fury, 5280, Scorpion, Lucasi, Player's, Viking, McDermott, etc. Money and alterations NEVER come into play for the user, right?