Getting Out When It's Easy - 8-ball

6/7/5/4/3/2/8

I would start with either the 6 or the 7. It is easy to get from either of these balls to the right line on the 5. If you wait for the 6/7, it is fairly easy to get funny on either ball, which usually ends up with the player sitting down and asking the pool gods and everyone around how in the world could they not get out from that position :eek: :eek: . It is also much easier to stay in line on the 3/2 from the 4. It would depend on the angle, but I would prefer to play them 3-2-8.

Mark
 
Cuebacca:
I like getting rid of the 6/7 first because they are in the middle of the table, so less rails nearby to help me out if I land a little funny on them.
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I see the 6/7 very differently: they're the most forgiving balls on the table because they each have all 6 pockets open to them and all the rails available for shape. For that reason I like using them as "stepping stones" to get to the key balls (2/3) from the "trouble" balls (5/4).

pj
chgo
 
Patrick Johnson said:
I see the 6/7 very differently: they're the most forgiving balls on the table because they each have all 6 pockets open to them and all the rails available for shape. For that reason I like using them as "stepping stones" to get to the key balls (2/3) from the "trouble" balls (5/4).

pj
chgo
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Hey Patrick, I can't agree with you here. "Stepping stones" should be fairly simple shots. Even though these balls have several pocket-options, the chance that you may be off-angle is pretty high. I mean, not so high that it's probable but high enough that it's POSSIBLE. Also, there is a chance to leave yourself long. THERE ARE situations where middle-table balls CAN BE stepping stones but I don't consider this scenario to be one of them.
 
5, 4, 6 or 7, 3, 2=8
First off I think with this easy layout you could ask your opponent which ball he would like you to start with and not be risking the out. My reasoning for the above is the same as Patrick Johnsons...the third shot is an area shape shot and you adjust your pattern according to where you fall on the 6/7.
 
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Snapshot9 said:
I would go with the 7, 6, 2, 5, 4, 3, and 8 ball. Why? Even though the balls are spread out some, a rule of thumb in Pool is you always start in the middle because it gives you more room for error on the remaining balls.

The reason you take the 2 ball after the 6 is because if it is left with the 3 until the last, you may have the wrong angle, possibly a backcut angle, and you end up with bad shape to shoot the 8. Getting the 2 out of the way after shooting the 6 (six allows you to get the proper angle for shape on the 2), which allows you to get a good angle on the 5, and shape is natural after making the 4 on the 3 to finish up the run.
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This is the route I like most. Shooting both these after the four can be a little touchy for me. This method clears the middle up first leaving mostly hangers and natural shape. I play shape for the 2 to move the cue back to the middle off the end rail rather than draw off the side rail as that seems more predictable for a good angle on the five to stay off the rail when shooting the 5.
 
Jude Rosenstock said:
One person suggested leaving the 5-ball last.
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Sorry, I thought I was suggesting the 6 last to get shape on the eight. Just keeping the 5 there a while just in case disaster strikes. When there's a nice big part of the table safe like there is especially with the 5 blocking the bank on the eight, I might be tempted to keep it there depending on the situation.
 
Jude Rosenstock said:
So I was playing today and had a fortunate thing go my way and found myself solids with ball-in-hand. Instead of just smacking them all in, I took a very deliberate route to get out and figured I'd let you guys have at it, too. Most importantly, I'd like to know where you'd start and why.

CueTable Help

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Assuming I got my position all the way I'd go: 7-6-5-4-3-2-8.
Just noticed the sequence is this a trick question? :)

I'd start with the 7 & 6 because I feel those are the most difficult to obtain position on from elsewhere.
 
Jude Rosenstock said:
So I was playing today and had a fortunate thing go my way and found myself solids with ball-in-hand. Instead of just smacking them all in, I took a very deliberate route to get out and figured I'd let you guys have at it, too. Most importantly, I'd like to know where you'd start and why.
Click to expand...

I take a different philosophical approach to this kind of rack; the first question I ask myself is "what could stop me from getting out here"?

I find two answers:

Giving myself a harsh angle on a shot (where I'm not on any other ball),

OR

Ending up awkward on the key ball, where I have to either kill the CB, or force it on an unnatural route, to get good on the 8.

This is why I think the 2 is a terrible key ball. Imagine ending up dead straight on the 3. I guess I have to draw back a bit to decrease the angle on the 2 to where I can hold the CB for the 8. If I don't draw back enough, I have an ugly shot to force the CB across table and back to have a cut on the 8, a shot where it's easy to make a mistake. If I draw back too much, I have a longer shot where my only option is to slow-roll to make sure I hold for the 8, a shot where it's easy to make a mistake.

For me, the best sequence leading to the 8 is 4-7-8. If I'm on the right side of the 7 (almost guaranteed off the 4), there's nothing I can do to avoid getting a good shot on the 8. I love it when I can't think of a possible way I could screw up my position. Working backwards, I can actually do the whole rack this way; where there's nothing I can do to mess up my position.

I'd start with the 6, because that's where I ended up working backwards from the 4-7-8.

Shockwave's not cooperating with me right now, so I'll describe verbally.

Shoot the six in the lower side, following to get not-quite-straight on the 3.

Draw back from the 3, leaving yourself in the same side of the 2 (cutting the 2 slightly to the right). It's important to note here that since I'm going from the 2 to the 5, it really doesn't matter how I get on the 2, this is just my ideal position. As long as I can make the 2, I can get a shot on the 5.

Follow the 2 to the end rail and back up to the side rail above the upper side pocket. Just make sure to get far enough to see the 5 past the 7.

Shoot the 5 and stun (if straight in, this means leaving it on the rail, no big deal, if not straight, you come out from the rail a bit).

Shoot the 4 with follow, hitting the lower side rail, but staying below the angle on the 7 (cutting the 7 slightlyto your left).

Stun the 7 and drift down for the 8.

Absolutely enormous positional zones, ridiculously easy shots, no english. It may look funny that I'm not remotely starting with a problem ball, but the way I play it here, how can you call any ball on the table a problem ball? How can you argue with enormous positional zones, ridiculously easy shots, and no english?

-Andrew
 
Da Poet said:
Sorry, I thought I was suggesting the 6 last to get shape on the eight. Just keeping the 5 there a while just in case disaster strikes. When there's a nice big part of the table safe like there is especially with the 5 blocking the bank on the eight, I might be tempted to keep it there depending on the situation.
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Evenso, I think this is sorta a self-fulfilling prophecy. If you anticipate disaster, you will get it. You may not need a pattern to get to the 5 but you'll need one to get from the 5. You wanna take care of business down there and then leave the area and you want a good plan to leave the area otherwise, you could find yourself long and tough.
 
Snapshot9 said:
I would go with the 7, 6, 2, 5, 4, 3, and 8 ball. Why? Even though the balls are spread out some, a rule of thumb in Pool is you always start in the middle because it gives you more room for error on the remaining balls.

The reason you take the 2 ball after the 6 is because if it is left with the 3 until the last, you may have the wrong angle, possibly a backcut angle, and you end up with bad shape to shoot the 8. Getting the 2 out of the way after shooting the 6 (six allows you to get the proper angle for shape on the 2), which allows you to get a good angle on the 5, and shape is natural after making the 4 on the 3 to finish up the run.
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I didn't see this before I posted, but I'm glad somebody else thinks that the 2 ball is a bad key ball to get on the 8 because of the possibility of the wrong angle.

-Andrew
 
Jude Rosenstock said:
Hey Patrick, I can't agree with you here. "Stepping stones" should be fairly simple shots. Even though these balls have several pocket-options, the chance that you may be off-angle is pretty high. I mean, not so high that it's probable but high enough that it's POSSIBLE. Also, there is a chance to leave yourself long. THERE ARE situations where middle-table balls CAN BE stepping stones but I don't consider this scenario to be one of them.
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I agree with you here Jude.

Going from the 5/4 to the 2/3 is absolute cake. It would be very hard to screw that up.

On the other hand, going from the 5/4 to 6/7 isn't automatic by any means. If you come up short on position, then you could get yourself into real trouble.
 
Judging by the position of the eight, the 2 ball is definitely going to be my last ball.

Start with the the 5 and then the 4, because with the position of the 6, 7, and 3, there's NO WAY even I could get out of line bad enough to not have an easy shot to both make and play shape off of any of those 3 balls.

Should be able to shoot the 7 and 6 in the sides, but I never let myself get too devoted to that idea when I get in a line that makes it easier to play for one of them in a corner pocket. I see this happen a lot just because a ball is opposite a side pocket, players get into a mindsedt where they think they have to play it in a side pocket.

Anyway, big margin for error on getting on the 3 ball from either the 6 or 7, especially when they can be made in almost any of the pockets.

If you're a good 9Ball player, then the pattern taking the 6 and 7 first is just as easy, because the shot from the 4 to the 3 is very common. I just would like to have the 6 and 7 there "just in case".
 
Andrew Manning said:
I take a different philosophical approach to this kind of rack; the first question I ask myself is "what could stop me from getting out here"?

I find two answers:

Giving myself a harsh angle on a shot (where I'm not on any other ball),

OR

Ending up awkward on the key ball, where I have to either kill the CB, or force it on an unnatural route, to get good on the 8.

This is why I think the 2 is a terrible key ball. Imagine ending up dead straight on the 3. I guess I have to draw back a bit to decrease the angle on the 2 to where I can hold the CB for the 8. If I don't draw back enough, I have an ugly shot to force the CB across table and back to have a cut on the 8, a shot where it's easy to make a mistake. If I draw back too much, I have a longer shot where my only option is to slow-roll to make sure I hold for the 8, a shot where it's easy to make a mistake.

For me, the best sequence leading to the 8 is 4-7-8. If I'm on the right side of the 7 (almost guaranteed off the 4), there's nothing I can do to avoid getting a good shot on the 8. I love it when I can't think of a possible way I could screw up my position. Working backwards, I can actually do the whole rack this way; where there's nothing I can do to mess up my position.

I'd start with the 6, because that's where I ended up working backwards from the 4-7-8.

Shockwave's not cooperating with me right now, so I'll describe verbally.

Shoot the six in the lower side, following to get not-quite-straight on the 3.

Draw back from the 3, leaving yourself in the same side of the 2 (cutting the 2 slightly to the right). It's important to note here that since I'm going from the 2 to the 5, it really doesn't matter how I get on the 2, this is just my ideal position. As long as I can make the 2, I can get a shot on the 5.

Follow the 2 to the end rail and back up to the side rail above the upper side pocket. Just make sure to get far enough to see the 5 past the 7.

Shoot the 5 and stun (if straight in, this means leaving it on the rail, no big deal, if not straight, you come out from the rail a bit).

Shoot the 4 with follow, hitting the lower side rail, but staying below the angle on the 7 (cutting the 7 slightlyto your left).

Stun the 7 and drift down for the 8.

Absolutely enormous positional zones, ridiculously easy shots, no english. It may look funny that I'm not remotely starting with a problem ball, but the way I play it here, how can you call any ball on the table a problem ball? How can you argue with enormous positional zones, ridiculously easy shots, and no english?

-Andrew
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Jude, I'm eager to hear your critique of my thinking here.

-Andrew
 
Jude Rosenstock said:
Some answers I agree with, some not so much. Unfortunately, only one person has stated why they chose their beginning.

Although this does look easy, I see lots of people mess up what should be a no-brainer. I guess, the point isn't to state your pattern but to state your logic. The key balls are pretty obvious. The 2/3 have to be last. How do you get to the 2/3?
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It seems the 2 or 3 would be the best key ball but perhaps not. I'd probably choose the 4 as I love my key ball to be in this position as it gives me so many options to reach the 8. Natural shape takes the ball down table towards the 8. In my opinion, players too often chose the closest ball to the 8 for their key ball. This requires too exacting position on the ball before the key ball and if you get off, you're screwed.

The 2 and 3 are the biggest problems, imho, so I'd start with the 3, come off the rail to get similar shape on the 2. Next the 6 and 7 then the 5 thus getting the cueball near the foot of the rack, and then the 4 as the key ball.

I've been experimenting with this theory of a close-to-the-end-rail key ball this year and have had great results.

fwiw,

Jeff Livingston
 
SORRY, EDITED - THIS WAS IN RESPONSE TO MANNING

Hey Andrew

I think the position on the 7 is more work than position on the 2/3. I mean, I understand why you're concerned. The 2/3 aren't automatic but they're easier than the 7.

Just for a moment, consider the position zone you would need for the 7 and then consider the position zone needed for the 3.
 
chefjeff said:
It seems the 2 or 3 would be the best key ball but perhaps not. I'd probably choose the 4 as I love my key ball to be in this position as it gives me so many options to reach the 8. Natural shape takes the ball down table towards the 8. In my opinion, players too often chose the closest ball to the 8 for their key ball. This requires too exacting position on the ball before the key ball and if you get off, you're screwed.

The 2 and 3 are the biggest problems, imho, so I'd start with the 3, come off the rail to get similar shape on the 2. Next the 6 and 7 then the 5 thus getting the cueball near the foot of the rack, and then the 4 as the key ball.

I've been experimenting with this theory of a close-to-the-end-rail key ball this year and have had great results.

fwiw,

Jeff Livingston
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I like this observation. The 4 IS a decent key-ball to the 8 but i don't agree that it's the best one. You're sorta heading toward a pocket with this so you have to make sure your speed is slow enough that you can never scratch. Overcut this a little and you may still make the ball and head right toward that pocket.
 
You know, what's amazing here is, I still think just about everyone in this forum is going to get out here because the layout poses no problems whatsoever. However, this thread is already 3 pages because of all the different approaches to handling it. I think this is great.

I think I may post a few more today. One that's just as easy and one that's a little tricky.
 
3-6-7-5-4-2

I chose the following pattern......3-6-7-5-4-2..then I read all the responses...no one chose this pattern....I would still do it this way all day long.

I don't like leaving the 3-2 until last....For some reason I don't like leaving balls close together like that until last....I tend to wind up a little funny and then have to "hold" shape or something stupid.

I would clear the 3 off the rail and leave the easy hanger of a 2 ball as my last ball.

Since I have BIH...(and I am left handed) It is farily routine for me to get shape from the 3 to the 6....If I am positioned right...the rest are pretty much stop..or punch stroke shots...The shape from the 4 to the 2 would be really tough to mess up.

That is just the way I see it.....(for a left handed player anyway)
 
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