Grip for break
- Thread starter mark187
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Players that grip forward on the break are generally lifting up or even moving slightly forward as they make contact. This movement effectively lengthens the lever between your elbow and grip compared to your setup position, so the initial forward position then becomes closer to 90 degrees at contact.
I’ve seen players start just a few inches forward of their normal position all the way up to starting near the front of the wrap. I’ve tried both and feel most comfortable being about a hand width (3 – 4 inches) forward. That being said, any upward or forward movement needs to be timed appropriately to get even a little extra power out of the break and often at the expense of accuracy. Unless you plan on practicing this movement and timing a LOT, you will probably have better results with a more controlled and accurate break.
Scott
I’ve seen players start just a few inches forward of their normal position all the way up to starting near the front of the wrap. I’ve tried both and feel most comfortable being about a hand width (3 – 4 inches) forward. That being said, any upward or forward movement needs to be timed appropriately to get even a little extra power out of the break and often at the expense of accuracy. Unless you plan on practicing this movement and timing a LOT, you will probably have better results with a more controlled and accurate break.
Scott
I'm not familiar with this technique. So, are you saying that the torso is moving forward but their arm is still in it's original position, thus changing the angle of impact to 90 degrees?
I'm wondering why the arm wouldn't move forward right along with the rest of the body.
Scott, would you or anyone be able to post a link to a player breaking this way? I think it would be a great idea for a study.
Hi Fran:
I don't know if you have seen this. I find it to be one of the best breaking instructional videos on the web.
http://billiards.colostate.edu/normal_videos/new/NVA-20.htm
While the video itself is not good Colin is a great instructor who tells you why, shows you why, and then executes.
I think this is a classic video and I think that SVB probably learned a lot from Colin's work.
BTW as Colin teaches the arm does indeed move forward with the body.
I don't know if you have seen this. I find it to be one of the best breaking instructional videos on the web.
http://billiards.colostate.edu/normal_videos/new/NVA-20.htm
While the video itself is not good Colin is a great instructor who tells you why, shows you why, and then executes.
I think this is a classic video and I think that SVB probably learned a lot from Colin's work.
BTW as Colin teaches the arm does indeed move forward with the body.
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Yes, Shane is a good example, I've seen Charlie Bryant and others do the same thing. I had a good local player show me something along those same lines, he consistently can break in the upper 20's and low 30's, while I'm at 25/26 on my hardest breaks, so I was listening to the knowledge he had gained from others and he mentioned the shortened grip as one component.
Thinking about it now, I'm not sure what part of the movement causes what I'm trying to describe. If it's the movement up, forward, hips driving, body twisting, etc. I know I can grip at the front of the wrap, which feels really, really uncomfortable, but after moving up and forward and making impact it feels very natural, so something is lengthening in the dynamic motion of the swing somewhere. I personally don't hold it this far forward, but I did experiment with it.
At work so can't access youtube etc., but if I get a chance I'll see if I can find some of the stuff I saw on this to post.
Scott
Thinking about it now, I'm not sure what part of the movement causes what I'm trying to describe. If it's the movement up, forward, hips driving, body twisting, etc. I know I can grip at the front of the wrap, which feels really, really uncomfortable, but after moving up and forward and making impact it feels very natural, so something is lengthening in the dynamic motion of the swing somewhere. I personally don't hold it this far forward, but I did experiment with it.
At work so can't access youtube etc., but if I get a chance I'll see if I can find some of the stuff I saw on this to post.
Scott
Wow, thank you so much for posting this video... Great information and I learned a lot about improving the power of my break. Thanks again.
I hadn't seen it. Thanks, Joe. It seems to me that the torso motion is ahead of the arm, so it is possible that the arm position is closer to or at perpendicular at impact.
I'm not sure about the big vs. small muscles as an explanation. Studies on muscle twitch fibers show that fast vs. slow fibers can vary from big to small muscles depending on the person. Some have faster twitch fibers in their big muscles, some have more in their small muscles. It's strictly genetic.
I'm an advocate of the wrist flick. It definitely adds more power when timed well.
It would seem to me that the forward position of the arm at address has to do with the fact that it lags behind the lunging torso and I think Jeff is right that this position helps correct that issue so it all coincides at impact; otherwise, you'd have the torso too far ahead of the arm, throwing off the timing of the break shot.
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Mark, it takes a lot of practice breaking, as shown in the video, but it works and works well. The speed of the cue is achieved with the coordination of your grip hand fingers with the movement of your body forward.
SVB demonstrates this action very well when he breaks.
John
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Replacing old habits
Here is a way to replace old habits with a new habit as discovered by a group in Australia. Apparently it is effective as it has been widely recognized as a useful technique. I think it would work to improve your break.
http://billiards.colostate.edu/PBReview/ChangingBadHabits.htm
It is important to start in slow motion and clearly differentiate the old habit from the new (to be learned) habit.
PS for instructors who might find this technique of use in their teaching here is a link to Hanin et al web page.
http://www.personalbest.com.au/
Here is a way to replace old habits with a new habit as discovered by a group in Australia. Apparently it is effective as it has been widely recognized as a useful technique. I think it would work to improve your break.
http://billiards.colostate.edu/PBReview/ChangingBadHabits.htm
It is important to start in slow motion and clearly differentiate the old habit from the new (to be learned) habit.
PS for instructors who might find this technique of use in their teaching here is a link to Hanin et al web page.
http://www.personalbest.com.au/
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