Have exotics inflated in price as much as plywood?
- Thread starter JC
- Start date
I think it's more of a construction-oriented phenomenon. I was browsing Gilmer Wood a couple weeks ago, and prices didn't seem inflated. Not the highest quality data, so I'm curious to hear other people's experiences.
I work in the architectural industry and the prices of wood are killing construction costs, as you probably know, but I have not seen it affect hardwoods, etc. I just purchases about 6 board feet of 8/4 hard maple for cutting boards and I didn't pay anymore then I would've a year ago.
Funny side story - we had a MAJOR accident here last week (interstate was shut down in both directions for hours!) and it turns out a flat bed of lumber was involved and the truck caught on fire (there's video of the guy jumping out) and one of the architects in the office saw the video and goes - "I don't want to sound callous but the fact that truck full of wood is going to burn up hurts, that shit's expensive". LOL
Price versus quality.
Hahahahahaha
Somebody shoot me.....
Please!
But Plywood. Makes you just wanna cry.
Hahahahahaha
Somebody shoot me.....
Please!
But Plywood. Makes you just wanna cry.
Last edited:
MesdupBoogie
Registered
I thought the exact same thing about that crash, right after grumbling about the mess it would make of the commute.
I do millwork, or used to.
It's been a few years since ordering by the MBf.
But i did get a couple hundred ft of QS w oak in March and it seemed to me the quotes were nearly double from just a year or 2 ago.
Ended up getting it from a regular supplier who had the end of a bundle she wanted to get rid of, & offered same price as slab sawn, if i took it all. Nice thing was it was mostly wide boards. Brief RFQ's for other materials indicate that at least in the range of a hundred or couple hundred ft, the prices are up "considerably" though not multiples of 2 years ago, like 2 x's and construction plywood.
OTOH, hardwood lumber is always cyclical.
Depends on what the fashion is: dark furniture (walnut, mahogany) or light (Maple, painted, birch)
O refined/fine grain woods (cherry) or bolder grained materials (red oak, ash, w. oak)
Also depends a lot on Asia and sometimes Europe - what they are importing by the container load.
Asia puts most of the stress on rare exotics.
Generally exotics are not something most people or businesses get in or out of causing big swings in the market, because the base price is so high.
It's been a few years since ordering by the MBf.
But i did get a couple hundred ft of QS w oak in March and it seemed to me the quotes were nearly double from just a year or 2 ago.
Ended up getting it from a regular supplier who had the end of a bundle she wanted to get rid of, & offered same price as slab sawn, if i took it all. Nice thing was it was mostly wide boards. Brief RFQ's for other materials indicate that at least in the range of a hundred or couple hundred ft, the prices are up "considerably" though not multiples of 2 years ago, like 2 x's and construction plywood.
OTOH, hardwood lumber is always cyclical.
Depends on what the fashion is: dark furniture (walnut, mahogany) or light (Maple, painted, birch)
O refined/fine grain woods (cherry) or bolder grained materials (red oak, ash, w. oak)
Also depends a lot on Asia and sometimes Europe - what they are importing by the container load.
Asia puts most of the stress on rare exotics.
Generally exotics are not something most people or businesses get in or out of causing big swings in the market, because the base price is so high.
When I said quality, I was referring to the quality of the data point I had to offer, not the quality of the product. But now I've seen your post, I get the hahas
My apologies. I wasn't referring to your post. I should have explained better.When I said quality, I was referring to the quality of the data point I had to offer, not the quality of the product. But now I've seen your post, I get the hahas
I bought some exotics recently. The price went up which I don't usually care about but the quality was poor.
So of course I questioned it, the response was...
Well it's the best I had at this time.
Cool, so instead of me thinking bad things about you, maybe you just should have said. I don't have the pieces in the quality your looking for.
Pretty simple.
Instead of losing a customer and me telling my friends you sold me junk.
Sorry to hear that! That's not good business practice, for sure. Especially one where it's a relative small customer pool. Guess your supplier took a gamble that the customer wouldn't know better. That's not a very good gamble when selling to a cue maker
Last time I bought solid black ebony it was only about 20-25$ a 18 inch stick. Look around...tell us what you see now?
Last I looked easily 60 for grade B- stick, 75-100$, if you can find it, for anything that resembles being black.
Last I looked easily 60 for grade B- stick, 75-100$, if you can find it, for anything that resembles being black.
JC
Coos Cues
If only we didn't know it once came in solid black we could embrace those little blonde streaks as being exactly as god intended.
The price of ebony has been climbing steadily. What's so bad about ebonizing something else? Especially with the kind of finish used on a cue, could you really tell the difference even looking closely? And if you want something black with a bit of character when looking very closely, African blackwood seems readily available. I think it really is just a name thing. Especially considering ebony used to mean Ceylon ebony until they cut all those trees down and had to find another black wood to take its place. At least they're in the same genus.
Then it would not be ebony and only look black.
AF Blackwood is not black. More purplish/brown. It is also in the rosewood family (Dalbergia melanoxylon) not ebony. Very good cue wood however you have to pay attention cause it can bleed and stain (ruin) your project if you're not careful.
Ebony has always meant Gabon ebony to me and originated from Africa. I never cared for India ebony. Can have weird mineral streaks that show up in it.
The best ebony in the entire world came from Madagascar. No longer available for export and only occasionally will pop up for resale in the states.
CITES has put the kibosh on so many nice cue woods. Blame them for the prices.
A small sample of what real ebony should look like.
It's been a few years for me as well but I did see that the price went from around $350 to $1350 per mbf.
The fires in Oregon had a bit to do with the softwoods going up, supply and demand. Here is a video of just a small area and how much we lost there, it's only 20 miles from me.
Lucky for us, Africa, South America and our East Coast did not burn.
Gilmore is a great place, one hour from me and their prices have been very stable but their doors were closed for a long time, only online ordering. Their prices will go up with new inventory.
In the past I could count on a few deals each year on crackslist from woodworkers selling off their wood stashes but nothing in a over a year. The prices are usually good on there because the people had the wood for many years and their cost basis was lower.
Good thread JC.
Ironically, the original ebony from ancient Egypt "hbny" where we got the word ebony was African Blackwood.
Anyway, I'm mostly just stirring the pot. If all you want is something black or nearly that for its appearance, there are many options.
The exotic wood industry is much smaller. A few covid-related wrinkles in a high-volume plywood/lumber process causes supply delays and the "bull whip" effect is obvious as prices snap up dramatically in response to dramatically increased demand.
Blame the folks who couldn't handle brief delays and paid 10,000% more for wood, driving costs up higher
Blame the folks who couldn't handle brief delays and paid 10,000% more for wood, driving costs up higher
stick size = 3/2 in thick x 1/8 ft wide x 3/2 ft long = 9/32 Bd Ft. => $72 to $89 Bd Ft.
Round numbers, about $75 to $85 a few years ago. I agree, though it was out there cheaper.
Now it's about $100 "in the obvious places" which, if a person is buying 1-1/2 x 1-1/2 x 18" turning squares = about $28 to $30 same size stick.
Seems about right.
I don't need anything exotic right now, so can't call & dicker, but a quick check yesterday does look like many of the more expensive exotics are up around 10% - 15%. More at some retailers.
What i have seen over the past dozen/20 years is that exotics used to be available from a fair number of wholesalers.
There is a wider range of exotics available today, but fewer dealers anymore at the midpoint between complete wholesale, and "mostly wholesale with some retail accommodation for smaller quantities". My gripe is they keep moving south and boosting prices. I bought from World Timber when they were cheap, and in Allentown. Pretty much grew up with West Penn Hardwoods when he started selling his FIL's sawmill products nearby in Olean & grew from there to a range of imports. Then he move south a few years ago, too.
I don't know what grade B is AFA a hardwood lumber grade, however
can still find really black in boards. But unlike you my tastes have changed with age. Before making more furniture i wanted any exotic/featurewood without sapwood, and ebony that was pure black like coal. In the past 20 years, i prefer more variety. Ebony with gold flecks, even some white. AFA my limited production of cues, i want some grain or feature that clearly states wood from across a room, not "could be plastic" from 2 ft away.
Yes/no - the reason is because China's middle & upper middle clast is bigger than ours, and they got a hankering for "traditional" Chinese furniture of which there is not a lot, much that exists is in the West. So they bought up production throughout 3rd world countries putting pressure on the stocks and CITES stepped in. Same thing as with elephant ivory & rhinocerworst horn.
All that said, wherever the pressure comes from, conservation is essential.
Sounds like softwood construction lumber?
I don't remember FAS KD RWL Rgh true QS w. oak under $1450ish since Taylor split and then went under.
You'd be shocked at current prices.
smt
Yes Sir, that's where in the major cost increase is at, not really affecting the hardwoods as bad at this time.
I used to get my logs milled for $185 per thousand board feet, nine self loading log trucks at one time. Lots of Western Maple with incredible figure but I never used it in cues. I had some of the Fir professionally graded and used it to build a 32' x 64' shop, it was two stories tall, sold it a few years ago.
Thanks for responding, I always enjoy your posts, gave you post of the month or something once I believe lol.
It's very simple...it's not grade A.