Hoppy rail help

Busman said:
Actually I should have made that clear. The balls never go to the bottom, if you pot them dead center they are fine. If you catch any portion of the cushions around it, it then goes airborne.

Thanks I like the table even with the problems.

Are you saying that when you pocket a ball down the rail with speed, it flies out of the pocket? does it shoot up in the air or something? The pockets are done seriously wrong if that is the case! I am hoping to hear that you send this table back. There are so many jerkoffs out there in the table business that don't know their ass from a hole in the ground. There are only about 20 table mechanics in the country that do decent work, and only 3-4 that I would trust to do a table for me anyhow.
 
You should contact the manufacturer regarding this dealer/installer. You have a major problem and I do not think the manufacturer is aware of how he is being represented.

The point of the rail that the ball contacts should be 1 25/64" above the bed of the table. This should be consistent all the way around the table within 1/32". You should not be able to slide a credit card under the rail. The rails should be tight to the table and if washers are added or holes redrilled this is bogus and you have been ripped off.

A ball should not bounce after it hits the rail if it is not bouncing before it hits the rail. A ball being hit straight into the rail with high English should reverse its English within 1-3 inches of leaving the rail. On new cloth sometimes is can be a little longer.

One question---Does the sound of the ball hitting the rail hard, sound the same when hit at various places around the table?
 
I'm saying that when I shoot a ball, down the long rail into the corner pocket, if the ball doesn't go in clean, it has a chance to fly up and off the table or up and into the pocket. Not all the time but alot. The ball never hits the plastic part of the pocket when it jumps, the jump is caused by the end rail somehow.

If it catches the the point or the part of the end rail that is cut back(the angle) into the pocket it stands a good chance of jumping the table.

I can make it do it almost everytime by taking the cueball and shooting it at the point firmly with very slight top english. When I say firmly I am talking about enough speed to send the cue roughly 24ft or 3 table lengths.

Ill try to draw a picture if I can when I get home.

And no, I think there is a different sound at different portions along the rail. I can hear two different sounds, a dull thump, a hollow sound (best I can describe). The rails are DEFINITELY not flush to the bed of the table along the end rails...there are washers under the rails at those points and a credit card can be slide under with no problem.

I added a cardboard box on a chair near the cornerpocket beside the table, to catch the balls when they jump the table.
 
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this is definitely not how a pool table should react.. you should be able to hit the cueball as high and as hard as you want from that angle, and in no way should it go upwards. The pocket is not cut right, and may be too open as well.. Don't play on it anymore and try to decide if you can live with it... this is not how a pool table should play, nor how it should be set up. Sorry for all the particulars that you will have to deal with to get it fixed/returned, but these people will not be able to fix you table, they will continue to 'fix' your table with shoddy work. You need not settle for something you pay good money for, and especially something brand new.
 
From what I've read I would "guess"that you do not have the correct slate for the table/frame and rails, this probally wasn't discovered until it was time to bolt on the rails. This can happen when dealers sell several types of tables with different rail bolt patterns, that use thier own brand specific slate.
 
Apologies to whomever owns the copyright on this photo. This is not my table, but should suffice to illustrate what is going on.

The cue will follow the dotted white line to occupy the space as seen. The hit is made with a firm stroke and top english.

One of three things will occur:

Red line: It will hit the rail and elevate rapidly and then hit the rail and climb off the table.

Green line: It will hit the rail and elevate rapidly and arc into the pocket.

Yellow line: It will hit the rail and elevate slightly and rebound into the other cushion and then gain more height and hop the table.

That is about the best I can describe it.

Mechanic - What is the standard practice when you find you don't have the proper materials to assemble the table? Is it common practice just to do whatever you can get away with? I mean for $1700.00 I should expect better quality shouldn't I?
TAble.jpg
 
Yes, you should be satisfied with any table that has been professionaly set up. I'm guessing you were told and expected a professional install, you didn't get one. If the dealer is reputable they should fix it, this will inconveinence you but it shouldnt cost you anything. There's things you can work around if there not right like, pocket types, ball returns,legs, but the way a rail bolts to the slate is critical. The installer probally did what he had to do to get paid,the mixup may not have been his.
 
The Dealer probably could fix it.. But would u trust them. I agree with what was said earlier. Call the Manufacturer and have them help with this.. Mech/Player has a perfect point about the slate not matching the table. You Can't Put Like Brunswick Rails on Olehauson Slate. I just can't see it beeing ok to have to drill new holes and expect it to be anywhere near perfect.. let alone playable in this case
 
Busman said:
Apologies to whomever owns the copyright on this photo. This is not my table, but should suffice to illustrate what is going on.

The cue will follow the dotted white line to occupy the space as seen. The hit is made with a firm stroke and top english.

One of three things will occur:

Red line: It will hit the rail and elevate rapidly and then hit the rail and climb off the table.

Green line: It will hit the rail and elevate rapidly and arc into the pocket.

Yellow line: It will hit the rail and elevate slightly and rebound into the other cushion and then gain more height and hop the table.

That is about the best I can describe it.

Mechanic - What is the standard practice when you find you don't have the proper materials to assemble the table? Is it common practice just to do whatever you can get away with? I mean for $1700.00 I should expect better quality shouldn't I?
TAble.jpg


Can you post a photo showing their work with the drill?
 
I wish I could take a photo but I am currently without a camera. Also not sure I would want to take it apart. Apparently its really hard to put it together. :eek:

I might try to borrow a camera tomorrow and do it anyhow. ;)

Basically on the underside of the rail there is wood and the rails came from the factory with pre-drilled holes with metal discs in them. They didn't line up with the slate so they pulled the discs out and drilled some new holes inward toward the cushions and replaced the discs. :confused:

On a side note, I can now jump a ball off of the end rail and into my box that I have sitting on the floor about 70% of the time now. I been practicing. :p
 
Well I sent the manufacturer (Steepletons In Louisville, KY) an email this morning like a lot of you suggested. I will let you know how they respond or what they do.

Wish me luck.

I am intending to borrow a camera (thanks Mom) today and shoot a few photos this weekend.
 
we'll be watching

I trust that they will treat you right - good luck, and we're all watching here for the outcome you get from Steepleton's in Louisville, KY.

That table is just not right; I too think its a mismatch between rails & slate - there's no way new holes should ever have to be drilled, so that suggests minimally incorrrect rails for the table (or incorrect slate). Either way, its not what you bought!
 
Well, here is a photo of the "washer solution" the installer had.

Tablewasher.jpg


I will try to get a few photos of the drilled holes tomorrow.
 
The threaded disc that they removed and reinstalled on your rails is beveled ,so when the factory installs them they have to be countersunk into the rails so the rail mounts flush to the slate. When they removed/re-located them, they must have overlooked the fact that they must be countersunk into the rail, when they tightened them down,since the rail wasn't flush to the slate it tweaked the rails, this explains the different cushion hieghts as well as the crazy ball action you described. At this point I would expect a new set of rails that match the slate that is on your table and the finish of the table, or simply the correct slate/rail combo.
 
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Mechanic - They did attempt to countersink them, they took a large woodbit and drilled new holes to accomodate the discs. Made alot of wood chips and saw dust, they borrowed my vacuum to clean up the mess as it fell on the new covered table. That is what Im going to take photos of later this afternoon.

My fault for not explainig that better, I do appreciate your insight and advice.
 
Busman said:
Mechanic - They did attempt to countersink them, they took a large woodbit and drilled new holes to accomodate the discs. Made alot of wood chips and saw dust, they borrowed my vacuum to clean up the mess as it fell on the new covered table. That is what Im going to take photos of later this afternoon.

My fault for not explainig that better, I do appreciate your insight and advice.


I palyed on a pool table that had the cloth to tight on the rails. It doesn't take much to bring the points down. Anyway, the cue ball would go flying each time it hit a small section. You could look at the rail but almost not be able to see the very slight bend.
 
Here are some photos of what they did to move the discs when they ones from the factory didn't line up with the slate.

Upon inspection I found some of the disc things are NOT flush to the wood surface. Some are below and some are above.

disc1.jpg
 
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