How is it possible? Maddening….

chefjeff said:
Sometimes on those long shots, when I'm looking up to the object ball just before stroking he shot, I pause my eyes at where the cuetip will hit the cloth. Not always, but for long shots or if I'm out of whack a bit. It helps to keep the stroke as straight as I planned it to be.

It's a short pause, but it triggers my mind to follow through so the tip sits on that spot.

It works for me, maybe for others, too?


Jeff Livingston
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Yes, I've found that a pause at the cb right before the final stroke works very well.
 
dquarasr said:
I've been playing seriously, really trying to learn, for just over a year, playing very casually off and on for 20 years. I am APA SL4 in 8 and 5 in 9. I practice fairly often (retirement is wonderful!) I managed #1 MVP in APA 8-ball just concluded fall session.

But I cannot explain how I can do a stroke/alignment/aim drill (the Mother of All Drills cross-corner long shot), get dialed in, make four-five in a row, sometimes even having the CB follow the OB into the pocket a few in a row (ensuring it was hit perfectly), then, performing the exact same steps (seemingly), have the OB miss the pocket completely four-five in a row.

It is maddening. I can't explain it.

Thoughts, or even words of encouragement? Is this normal? Is this what it takes to develop the shot-making ability I seek? I know it supposedly requires the proverbial 10,000 hours, but I'm not even using any spin; I'm using center CB.

Thanks in advance for any insight or words of commiseration you can offer.
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The ball never goes where you want it to but it always goes where you put it ;)

Could be stroke but my guess is you are not lining up the balls correctly to begin with. That is, by far, the shot I show people when they are working on their stroke and EVERY time I do it I tell them "the balls MUST be lined up perfectly straight EVERY time or none of it matters". They chuckle and say, yeah, I know. I set up the first one and show them, edges of ball line up, centers lined up with center of pocket. Then I proceed to shoot it and follow it in (not always :)) then have them set it up. 99% of the time the balls are not lined up exactly spot on center of CB/center of OB/center of pocket.

The problem is, especially after playing as long as you have, you will automatically adjust for the difference - not realizing it.

I suggest you try putting the CB on the head spot and shoot down table to the center diamond and have the ball come back and hit your tip, this drill will help you notice any deficiencies in your stroke better than the other one as there are less things involved. When I get off track and stop focusing I have a tendency to put a little left on the ball, I use the spot drill to identify it.
 
Chili Palmer said:
The ball never goes where you want it to but it always goes where you put it ;)

Could be stroke but my guess is you are not lining up the balls correctly to begin with. That is, by far, the shot I show people when they are working on their stroke and EVERY time I do it I tell them "the balls MUST be lined up perfectly straight EVERY time or none of it matters". They chuckle and say, yeah, I know. I set up the first one and show them, edges of ball line up, centers lined up with center of pocket. Then I proceed to shoot it and follow it in (not always :)) then have them set it up. 99% of the time the balls are not lined up exactly spot on center of CB/center of OB/center of pocket.

The problem is, especially after playing as long as you have, you will automatically adjust for the difference - not realizing it.

I suggest you try putting the CB on the head spot and shoot down table to the center diamond and have the ball come back and hit your tip, this drill will help you notice any deficiencies in your stroke better than the other one as there are less things involved. When I get off track and stop focusing I have a tendency to put a little left on the ball, I use the spot drill to identify it.
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My alignment/stroke/aim drills are (numbers do not indicate priority):

1) diagonal long shot from the 2:1 Diamond to the opposite 2:1 Diamond; objective is to pocket the OB and follow the CB in.

2) The spot-to-spot drill with no OB, try to return the CB to the cue tip.

3) The spot-to-spot shot where the objective is to hit the OB so straight that it bounces off the short rail straight back into the CB.

I use these depending on my mood and what I’m trying to remedy.
 
I may have had another revelation (to me!)

This morning I was warming up. I noticed I felt unusually comfortable, making nearly every shot I tried. So I tried a 9-ball ghost, and I did a run out, exceedingly rare for me!!

OK, so, what is different about the feeling in this session (that I was able to replicate this afternoon) from other times when I struggle? I had read about "timing" and before today I don't think I really understood what it felt like or how to obtain the feeling. But today, I think that is the key to the "good feeling" I am having. When I consciously try to control cue stick speed or acceleration, all sorts of bad things happen. Today, however, when I naturally accelerate the cue, accuracy is significantly better. As you can predict, I'm also getting better CB action. I find I am able to maintain timing (so far) for a variety of cue speeds; so far so good.

So, I'll add timing to the things I may need to consider when troubleshooting accuracy problems. Again, I fully understand this is only one, a small sample set, but for now, not having to think about things and just letting a natural timing happen, it's working. We'll see how it is later today, tomorrow, next week . . . .
 
dquarasr said:
I may have had another revelation (to me!)

This morning I was warming up. I noticed I felt unusually comfortable, making nearly every shot I tried. So I tried a 9-ball ghost, and I did a run out, exceedingly rare for me!!

OK, so, what is different about the feeling in this session (that I was able to replicate this afternoon) from other times when I struggle? I had read about "timing" and before today I don't think I really understood what it felt like or how to obtain the feeling. But today, I think that is the key to the "good feeling" I am having. When I consciously try to control cue stick speed or acceleration, all sorts of bad things happen. Today, however, when I naturally accelerate the cue, accuracy is significantly better. As you can predict, I'm also getting better CB action. I find I am able to maintain timing (so far) for a variety of cue speeds; so far so good.

So, I'll add timing to the things I may need to consider when troubleshooting accuracy problems. Again, I fully understand this is only one, a small sample set, but for now, not having to think about things and just letting a natural timing happen, it's working. We'll see how it is later today, tomorrow, next week . . . .
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Timing is part of the pre-shot routine. If that is off, or not followed, you try to force the stick to do things and you usually tighten up which completely screws up the natural flow and follow through.

When you're forcing things you will tend to pull-back and try to stop the cue from following through and that affects the hit, the speed, and the aim.

It' why a lot of people incorporate a pause in their backstroke.
 
dquarasr said:
I may have had another revelation (to me!)

This morning I was warming up. I noticed I felt unusually comfortable, making nearly every shot I tried. So I tried a 9-ball ghost, and I did a run out, exceedingly rare for me!!

OK, so, what is different about the feeling in this session (that I was able to replicate this afternoon) from other times when I struggle? I had read about "timing" and before today I don't think I really understood what it felt like or how to obtain the feeling. But today, I think that is the key to the "good feeling" I am having. When I consciously try to control cue stick speed or acceleration, all sorts of bad things happen. Today, however, when I naturally accelerate the cue, accuracy is significantly better. As you can predict, I'm also getting better CB action. I find I am able to maintain timing (so far) for a variety of cue speeds; so far so good.

So, I'll add timing to the things I may need to consider when troubleshooting accuracy problems. Again, I fully understand this is only one, a small sample set, but for now, not having to think about things and just letting a natural timing happen, it's working. We'll see how it is later today, tomorrow, next week . . . .
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Great! You might want to consider this during your warmup. It's called: 'letting your stroke out.' It just means allowing yourself to miss, because for this purpose, it's just about allowing yourself to be natural at the table rather than start off trying to make every shot. Gene Nagy used to say to me that how he shot the first 10 shots of the day would determine whether or not he'd be struggling that day. I don't think it's that extreme, but if you start out tight, you will continue tight.
 
FranCrimi said:
You don't have to have such a rigid approach to learning and you don't have to solve every problem that arises. You can put things aside for the time being and move on to other things. Sometimes solving an unrelated issue winds up being the solution for something you couldn't figure out before. And make sure you take time out from learning to just have fun playing. Your sense of awareness won't go away if you're having fun. And who knows....you may discover something that you didn't realize. You have to change it up or you will remain stuck.
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So wise words full of iron- so damn well chosen words Fran :-)

wish you a merry christmas my dear-
take care :-)
 
dquarasr said:
I may have had another revelation (to me!)

This morning I was warming up. I noticed I felt unusually comfortable, making nearly every shot I tried. So I tried a 9-ball ghost, and I did a run out, exceedingly rare for me!!

OK, so, what is different about the feeling in this session (that I was able to replicate this afternoon) from other times when I struggle? I had read about "timing" and before today I don't think I really understood what it felt like or how to obtain the feeling. But today, I think that is the key to the "good feeling" I am having. When I consciously try to control cue stick speed or acceleration, all sorts of bad things happen. Today, however, when I naturally accelerate the cue, accuracy is significantly better. As you can predict, I'm also getting better CB action. I find I am able to maintain timing (so far) for a variety of cue speeds; so far so good.

So, I'll add timing to the things I may need to consider when troubleshooting accuracy problems. Again, I fully understand this is only one, a small sample set, but for now, not having to think about things and just letting a natural timing happen, it's working. We'll see how it is later today, tomorrow, next week . . . .
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To enhance your timing, think "smooth, buttery backstrokes" all the way back so that your ferrule comes to your bridge or even disappears in your hand. Then you have length to smoothly accelerate going forward, without conscious thought of acceleration.

Key is to stroke back SMOOTHLY not quickly, the two are often incompatible. A smooth, not hurried backstroke will allow you to smoothly transition to the forward stroke also, regardless of any conscious pause between them.
 
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