How shouls a 5,6,7, play?

Jeff

Jeff

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
In APA 8 ball league play, as a general view. how would you expect a 5,6,7, to play?

Should a 7 be able to break and run 3 out 4 four racks with good breaks? Would you be surprised to see a 5 break and run two racks?

When you play one of these handicaps, what surprises you, when do you say a a 6 shouldn't be that good? When does a 5 you are playing make you say, "This guy has been sandbagging"?
 
Jeff said:
In APA 8 ball league play, as a general view. how would you expect a 5,6,7, to play?

Should a 7 be able to break and run 3 out 4 four racks with good breaks? Would you be surprised to see a 5 break and run two racks?

When you play one of these handicaps, what surprises you, when do you say a a 6 shouldn't be that good? When does a 5 you are playing make you say, "This guy has been sandbagging"?
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Unfortunately, any pro would be a 7 in the APA so the range of skill of a 7 could be anything from just OK to superior.

I would be surprised to see a 5 in the APA break and run one rack. Of course it happens, but not very often.

Lately, I have come to believe that any APA player rated 5 or lower would not qualify to be a "C" player in Phil Capelle's rating system. Most 6's and 7's are just barely a "C" player.

Jake
 
I had posted this reply a few months ago when the same question was asked. I hope this helps.

This is how I feel like it breaks down in my experience regarding 8 ball. The worst person I hate being matched up with is a 4 (I am a 7) so it is a 5-2 race (I think, but I know it is a decent size spot I give a 4). The reason I would least want to play a 4 is that they are rather decent shotmakers. If I do mess up late in the rack, they are more than capable of running out the last couple balls to get out alot of the time. And remember, they only have to get two games..

By the numbers, it might look like this -

* 3's - Just introduced to the game, still will miss the easiest of shots. They generally have no idea of patterns or game strategy. Just doing their best to pocket balls. Usually do not get out with 3 balls left on the table.

* 4's - They are decent shotmakers, but dont usually play patterns. They will usually hit the first open or easy ball they see, and probably doesn't look for problem balls. They in a jam will maybe play the easiest of safes. They tend to shoot out the easy ones and then are in trouble at the end of the rack with clusters or blocked balls. Watch out though, I have seen some phenominal play from a 4 from time to time!

* 5's - Shotmaking obviously improves but you will see a 5 take much harder shots than before, so it may look like shot making ability acutally is not as good. They look maybe three balls ahead at this level to run out, but still tend to ignore problem balls and clusters. They put more thought into their safes at this level.

*** Sidenote***

Sixes are most favorite to match up with. They invariably will always try to run out, even when the rack isnt runable. They feel with their skill level, if they shoot this low percentage shot, go three rails and try to hit these two balls over by the rail over there, that it will work perfectly, it invariably doesn't. They still save their problem balls for last alot. They however will run out the first 5 or 6 balls beautifully. I dont know if it ego or what but I hardly ever see a 6 intentionally miss a ball they could make to block a hole and control a pocket. It is like they don't want anyone to think they actually missed it. I see again players running out all of their balls, just to try to play some creative safe at the end. That is almost impossible or at least very difficult to do when I have usually 6 or 7 options on the table!

* 6'S - Shotmaking is much improved. Pattern play is more developed. Comes with alot of great shots to get out - the game winners. They still save problem balls for last too much, or at the end of their pattern. When or if they do break it out, there aren't very many insurance balls for them to shoot at. They depend too much on the shot after the breakout, or shooting one of the balls they just broke out, hoping they get position on that. They have trouble knowing what is truly a low percentage shot for them. If they have made it before just like that, they are sure they can make it just like that again. 7's know the difference.

Just my .02

girlwon1
(7 in 8ball and 9 in 9ball)
 
The only problem with APA ratings in 8ball is theres such a wide variety of skill level. I am a APA 6, basically since last session, and i became a APA 6 by my 5th match. Why? because i was only playing 3's n 4's and beating up on them. My first match as a APA 6 i played a 5, and lost 4-1 the week after i played a lady who was a 4, and lost on the hill.

The only person i beat after becomming a 6 was a guy who was a APA 5, we played to the hill, but the next week he was back to being a APA4, because, as he told me, he had lost as a 5, for 10 straight matches.

Now this session, i have played 8matches and only won 2 of them, against a 2 and a 4. All the other matches where against 5's thru 7's and i lost very badly.

So does that make me a APA 6 hell no..............


Now i will say that alot of the time people in the APA sandbag or drag out innings to keep thier handicap lower. Plus the whole handicap system sucks my big fat dick. One guy whos on the board for our APA league comes in bragging how he won both his matches last week, and went from a APA 6 to a APA 5 WTF !!!!!!

Now in general, a APA 2-3 are beginners to bangers, people who probably know how to play pool but thier pocketing skills and position play is bad.

APA 4's are average players, who know how to pocket balls and play position and know when to play safe, and can probably get out of a rack, if the table is open after you missed a ball.

APA 5's depending on the player, they have been around for a while, and know how to play the game, safties, postion and probably have a break n run or 8ball snap every now n then.

APA 6-7's The only problem i see with these players is theres such a wide variety of skill level here, we have one guy on our league who is a OPEN rated player whos a APA 7, lol and then we have our one nite a week players who are APA 6's who can run racks and play lock up safes, and probably play just as good as most APA 7's.

dave
 
Another thing i compare alot of times to show how wide of a skill level variety there is in APA 8ball, is the difference between someone who has a skill level in 8ball and 9ball too.

Alot of the guys who are APA 6's or 7's in 8ball, are between a SL 7 - SL 9 in 9ball.

which is more compare-able i think. Expecially since i am a APA 6 in 8ball yet i am only a APA 5 in 9ball.

Personally, i think the APA 8ball should have the same ratings as 9ball SL 1 - 9

And then they could increase the amount of games you could possibly play to 11games instead of 9.

dave
 
StormHotRod300 said:
And then they could increase the amount of games you could possibly play to 11games instead of 9.
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The big problem there is time. More games you have to win = longer matches - and there's five matches in a night.

Our league starts at 7pm - and there have been many times we didn't finish our matches 'til midnight.
 
ScottW said:
Our league starts at 7pm - and there have been many times we didn't finish our matches 'til midnight.
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Midnight? You are lucky. That's an early game here. I've had many a match go on past 2am.
 
StormHotRod300 said:
Personally, i think the APA 8ball should have the same ratings as 9ball SL 1 - 9
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Some regions have a Super 7 level. This means that your opponents have to win one less game compared to a regular SL7. You need to have a very low inning count and to never lose. I'm only a B+ player but I'm 25-0 last 25 as an SL7 and I'm closing in on S7. The problem is the wide range in the APA7 level. I know a D+ player that is an APA7 (albeit with a 50% win record). Unless there are other similar ranked SL7s in your division, it does become a little unfair if you play 8-ball on regulation tables. With 9-ball I can lose 5 racks to a D in a 10/5 race. With 8-ball too much skill, and a lot less luck, is involved for that to happen.
 
Good post girlwon1. I really can't find any fault with your analysis.

Stormhotrod300. Don't worry about your SL until you get over 20 games into the computer. You only have 15 now. That means that your very best games are counted toward your SL and the others are meaningless.

The formula looks at your best ten matches out of the last 20 matches.
And evidently your first 3 matches were your very best. So it will take 23 weeks for them to drop off.

Jake
 
jjinfla said:
Unfortunately, any pro would be a 7 in the APA so the range of skill of a 7 could be anything from just OK to superior.

I would be surprised to see a 5 in the APA break and run one rack. Of course it happens, but not very often.

Lately, I have come to believe that any APA player rated 5 or lower would not qualify to be a "C" player in Phil Capelle's rating system. Most 6's and 7's are just barely a "C" player.

Jake[/QUOTe
Click to expand...


I'm a S/L 5 in APA & have sevral B&R pins
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I'm an APA 6 as well. The way I see the main difference between a 5 and a 7 is consistency. A 5 may have an open 8-ball runout, but he'll miss one along the way more often than not. A 6 will make them more often than a 5 and will have a few more tricks in their bag (more so if they're closer to being a 7). A 7 will have many or very many tricks in their bag and will not miss anything on that runout more often than not. A 7 is the closest to true rating a person can have, imho. I didn't know that they actually had an S7 rating, though I had heard of being a "super 7", which would be that person that has very many tricks and will leave you without a shot on nearly all turns that you get a chance. 9-ball ratings make sense to me, since my 8-ball game is pretty good, but there's a lot of things I need to do better for my 9-ball game (and I'm a 6/6). You also have to remember that 9-ball is based on point counts and not just 9-ball drops.
 
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