Improve the IPT Qualification process?

[recoveryjones]

I understand that the IPT is independent and that they have there own qualification tournaments that see the top two players get their tour cards.

Other players like Wu for instance, who have won World championship titles in both 8 and 9 ball are left out, much to the chagrin of pool fans.I'm thinking that perhaps the IPT should consider pool players who have won major tourneys like the World 8 ball championships, The WPC's, The US Open, the BCA. the world pool masters, or even the World Snooker championships.

Golf honors players who win Majors, exemptions to other majors
The fans like to see the populiar players and populiar players sell tickets.

JMO,
RJ

 

[Jimmy M.]

The IPT has no room for improvement. It's already perfect. Many here will tell you that, though not so bluntly.

 

[jjinfla]

The IPT has no room for improvement. It's already perfect. Many here will tell you that, though not so bluntly.

Aw gee, you took the words right out of my mouth. What are you doing up at 1:00 am?

This is the first year of the Tour and they had to start somewhere. But I do believe that a long time ago I stated that in the future maybe the Tour will go to a draft type system where either KT or KT and the top 100 players select who they want on the tour.

But I also think I heard KT mention that if an opening exists he has the option of filling the vacancy from a list he has, which can mean anything you want it to mean. I believe when all is said and done WU will be on the tour. Hell, I would prefer to see Ga Young Kim on the Tour before WU. WU didn't impress anyone in the qualifiers. No one seemed to fear him.

But you do have to admit that having qualifiers is a pretty good income generator plus it gives the IPT a lot of free publicity.

The first year is a shake out year. Only the best will survive and make it to 2007.

Did you guys see that part about health insurance and pension plan in Deno's latest memo? I'm sure there will be tons of players now saying, **** WU, get me on the tour.

Jake

 

[jay helfert]

Aw gee, you took the words right out of my mouth. What are you doing up at 1:00 am?

This is the first year of the Tour and they had to start somewhere. But I do believe that a long time ago I stated that in the future maybe the Tour will go to a draft type system where either KT or KT and the top 100 players select who they want on the tour.

But I also think I heard KT mention that if an opening exists he has the option of filling the vacancy from a list he has, which can mean anything you want it to mean. I believe when all is said and done WU will be on the tour. Hell, I would prefer to see Ga Young Kim on the Tour before WU. WU didn't impress anyone in the qualifiers. No one seemed to fear him.

But you do have to admit that having qualifiers is a pretty good income generator plus it gives the IPT a lot of free publicity.

The first year is a shake out year. Only the best will survive and make it to 2007.

Did you guys see that part about health insurance and pension plan in Deno's latest memo? I'm sure there will be tons of players now saying, **** WU, get me on the tour.

Jake

Health insurance and a pension plan. Uh huh.
Is anyone interested in a bridge I have for sale? It's in Brooklyn.

 

[TheOne]

LOL some great replies lol, very funny!

Jimmy you forgot to say, hey don't worry "eventually" the best players will be on the tour, you just wait until 2008, then you'll see!

 

[Timberly]

Hell, I would prefer to see Ga Young Kim on the Tour before WU. WU didn't impress anyone in the qualifiers. No one seemed to fear him.

Jake you weren't at that qualifier, and you have no idea if people did or did not fear him.

Also, and this is the biggest point of this post, so please pay attention.... Not every player plays perfect all the time. Just like us, champions have bad days and slumps.

Who are you going to "fear" most, Shawn Putnam or Efren? Shawn beat Efren at the DCC in ONE POCKET.

Who are you going to "fear" most, Joey Korsiak or Johnny Archer? Joey beat Johnny at the Expo last yr.

Who are you going to "fear" most, Timmy Hall or Corey Deuel? Timmy beat Corey at the UPA event in Athens.

I could go on & on but I hope by now you get the point.

 

[recoveryjones]

Good points Timberly.

I think if you are in the IPT you should really be fearing no one as fear can paralyze your stroking arm.Everyone, however, should be respected because in any given set anyone can beat anyone.

With regard to respect, I certianly feel that Wu has the respect(2 World championships) of the pool world.I hardly doubt that anyone who played him, didn't respect who they were playing.
RJ

 

[jjinfla]

Jake you weren't at that qualifier, and you have no idea if people did or did not fear him.

Also, and this is the biggest point of this post, so please pay attention.... Not every player plays perfect all the time. Just like us, champions have bad days and slumps.

Who are you going to "fear" most, Shawn Putnam or Efren? Shawn beat Efren at the DCC in ONE POCKET.

Who are you going to "fear" most, Joey Korsiak or Johnny Archer? Joey beat Johnny at the Expo last yr.

Who are you going to "fear" most, Timmy Hall or Corey Deuel? Timmy beat Corey at the UPA event in Athens.

I could go on & on but I hope by now you get the point.

Well Timberly it seems that you proved my point. Why give a spot to WU then? He has to earn it just like everyone else. I'd rather give the spot to Rob Saez. Now that makes two people I would pick over WU.

Jake

 

[Timberly]

Well Timberly it seems that you proved my point. Why give a spot to WU then? He has to earn it just like everyone else. I'd rather give the spot to Rob Saez. Now that makes two people I would pick over WU.

Jake

Never once did I say "give Wu a spot on the IPT". You said "no one feared him" and I replied to that statement alone.

I'm friends with Robb and I would love to see him on the IPT. He's worked very hard the last few yrs to get where he is today.

Just like Wu, GaYoung, and anyone else NOT on the tour, they'll have to earn their spot in a playoff.

Pool is like any other sport... people have their favorites and they have the ones they dislike. You obviously do not care for WU and don't care if he gets on the IPT. SOMEONE out there does like him and would like to see him on it, while at the same time, maybe they don't like Robb and don't want to see him on it.

The freebie enrollment was over when the 150 was announced. Any talk of anyone being given a spot on the tour now is simply a waste of bandwith.

 

[nick serdula]

Sour Grapes!

The cream always rises to the top! And if you aint floating on top you aint cream! GET A JOB!
Nick

 

[IPT-hopeful]

Aw gee, you took the words right out of my mouth. What are you doing up at 1:00 am?

This is the first year of the Tour and they had to start somewhere. But I do believe that a long time ago I stated that in the future maybe the Tour will go to a draft type system where either KT or KT and the top 100 players select who they want on the tour.

But I also think I heard KT mention that if an opening exists he has the option of filling the vacancy from a list he has, which can mean anything you want it to mean. I believe when all is said and done WU will be on the tour. Hell, I would prefer to see Ga Young Kim on the Tour before WU. WU didn't impress anyone in the qualifiers. No one seemed to fear him.

But you do have to admit that having qualifiers is a pretty good income generator plus it gives the IPT a lot of free publicity.

The first year is a shake out year. Only the best will survive and make it to 2007.

Did you guys see that part about health insurance and pension plan in Deno's latest memo? I'm sure there will be tons of players now saying, **** WU, get me on the tour.

Jake

That's strange. Wu didn't impress anyone in the qualifiers? That's not what the sportswriter coverage of the event wrote, which was that many had the impression he had one of the best breaks in the business today, and the ability to run 6 racks or more. Even Sigel said he shoots straight, has no fear, and breaks good. It's easy to look at the mild mannered guy who's 16 years old and not fear him, but try playing him on the table with a lot at stake and most people will feel differently, I'm sure.

Caveat - Oh, unless the critics out there think the sportswriter for the qualifiers is under IPT hypnosis too. LOL

Anyone out there that doesn't fear Wu's game can try to play him in his home country, I'm sure lots of backers there will take on the people who don't fear him. Try Yang too, since they're at it. But better check with Buste first what happened on his attempt to do so.

 

[jjinfla]

Hey IPT Hopeful if there is one spot left on the IPT and it could only go to you or WU would you rather have to play him for the spot or would you want KT to just give it to WU?

The talk was that WU would win a qualifier easily. But now it seems that he is having trouble winning.

Everyone wanted Breedlove to be on the IPT. Should KT have just given him the spot? No, Breedlove went out and proved that he deserves to be on the IPT by winning a qualifier spot.

Simple - if WU qualifies then he deserves a spot. If he doesn't then he doesn't.

Next qualifiers start in ten days. The available talent will be spread out to five sites. Surely WU will have an easy time qualifying now. Who is left who can beat him?


Jake

 

[IPT-hopeful]

Agreed jake, he should have no problem qualifying, provided he makes it to one of the venues. I hear it's tough to find sponsorship in some countries to travel the distance.

Not disagreeing with you Jake, just clarifying the comments on Wu's game.

 

[Cameron Smith]

I don't like the idea of giving anybody spots on the tour. I didn't like it when they were doing it in the fall and I wouldn't be impressed now. I think the qualifying format is the best and most impartial manner in which to add players to tours or tournaments. However I believe KT mentioned something about sponsorship exemptions for the Open tourny's. As an aside I think that is funny because he is the sponsor.

Wu is an incredible player and he will win a qualifier eventually. But due to the fact that he is 16 he should have to earn his way in. That way nobody will be able to take anything away from him. Right now it is easy to say that the world championships were a fluke, or that he just had a couple of good tournaments last year and they happened to be both world tournaments. And to date it is all he is accomplished. I know that sounds silly to say that he has only won 2 world titles, but at the end of the day a tournament is a tournament, the only thing that seperates one from the other is name of the title on the trophy. The World 14.1 Championships is a perfect example of this.

He will get in, just give it some time. Same thing goes for guys like Vilmos Foldes or Eric Hjorilfjfkjalfjalfkjalfj, or however you spell his last name. The only thing that can stop them is if they quit. And if they quit they didn't deserve to be there.

 

[IPT-hopeful]

Last year's picks of the fall were just the start. They tried IMO to pick characters that :

1. filled out their forms in time (clearly they are not going to beg anyone to join their tour).
2. in their opinion (again I say in their opinion, and they are entitled to their opinion when they are coming out with the money), were the best of the lot they had by the deadline given.
3. as much of a worldwide participation flavour as possible, making it a bona fide international event.

Imagine even after they did that, 10 spots still popped out due to one reason or another (I know a few of those guys are kicking themselves right now), and those 10 spots took another 5 qualifiers which were the toughest qualifiers ever, in many participants' opinions. IMO they did the right thing so far. Had they just open the 150 slots for qualifiers, it would have take a little less than forever, plus provide wonderful ammo for many of the critics out there would just have shot down the whole effort as an attempt to collect money and not deliver, like the charlatans in that past. The 5 qualifiers for the season already had its share of loud critics questioning what happened to all that money collected. What more for 140 more slots.

Projecting credibility was obviously their main concern, and the money paid out so far goes to show they have deep pockets, so in this circumstance I would argue they achieved their goals.

 

[hanisch]

I don't like the idea of giving anybody spots on the tour. I didn't like it when they were doing it in the fall and I wouldn't be impressed now. I think the qualifying format is the best and most impartial manner in which to add players to tours or tournaments. However I believe KT mentioned something about sponsorship exemptions for the Open tourny's. As an aside I think that is funny because he is the sponsor.

Wu is an incredible player and he will win a qualifier eventually. But due to the fact that he is 16 he should have to earn his way in. That way nobody will be able to take anything away from him. Right now it is easy to say that the world championships were a fluke, or that he just had a couple of good tournaments last year and they happened to be both world tournaments. And to date it is all he is accomplished. I know that sounds silly to say that he has only won 2 world titles, but at the end of the day a tournament is a tournament, the only thing that seperates one from the other is name of the title on the trophy. The World 14.1 Championships is a perfect example of this.

He will get in, just give it some time. Same thing goes for guys like Vilmos Foldes or Eric Hjorilfjfkjalfjalfkjalfj, or however you spell his last name. The only thing that can stop them is if they quit. And if they quit they didn't deserve to be there.

i don't know how you can conclude that "... at the end of the day a tournament is a tournament, the only thing that seperates one from the other is [the] name of the title on the trophy."? don't you think that you are abstracting out too much relevant information?

winning grand slams in tennis and majors in golf are much tougher than winning other tour events precisely because of that "name of the title on the trophy." those premiere events bring out all (or at any rate nearly all) the best players, as well as those players wanting to win just a little bit more, giving it that extra effort--just beyond their otherwise best effort.

william

 

[Cameron Smith]

i don't know how you can conclude that "... at the end of the day a tournament is a tournament, the only thing that seperates one from the other is [the] name of the title on the trophy."? don't you think that you are abstracting out too much relevant information?

winning grand slams in tennis and majors in golf are much tougher than winning other tour events precisely because of that "name of the title on the trophy." those premiere events bring out all (or at any rate nearly all) the best players, as well as those players wanting to win just a little bit more, giving it that extra effort--just beyond their otherwise best effort.

william

Its all in your head.

The Slams are not much different than the ATP Masters tournaments. Sure its longer, and the sets are longer (for the guys), but it is generally those guys from the ATP Master Series who win in the end. All the other guys who enter (with a few exceptions granted) are just cannon fodder. Guys like Federrer and Hewitt, Safin and Nadal don't even try to play they're best game until the later stage, because they don't have to.

But I guess I just pointed out the difference, that the tournament is longer and more fatigueing if not played right.

But think about it, in theory the world championships are more prestigoues than the US Open in pool. Why? They both have many great players, the US Open has a larger field, so what makes it different. I guess it's the promoter, the name on the trophy and the purse.

I could in effect hold the a World Championship tournament tomorrow and claim the winner is the World Champion, and whether or not he is depends on whether you recognize them to be that. The IPT is a prime example with last years World Championships.

 

[hanisch]

Its all in your head.

The Slams are not much different than the ATP Masters tournaments. Sure its longer, and the sets are longer (for the guys), but it is generally those guys from the ATP Master Series who win in the end. All the other guys who enter (with a few exceptions granted) are just cannon fodder. Guys like Federrer and Hewitt, Safin and Nadal don't even try to play they're best game until the later stage, because they don't have to.

But I guess I just pointed out the difference, that the tournament is longer and more fatigueing if not played right.

But think about it, in theory the world championships are more prestigoues than the US Open in pool. Why? They both have many great players, the US Open has a larger field, so what makes it different. I guess it's the promoter, the name on the trophy and the purse.

I could in effect hold the a World Championship tournament tomorrow and claim the winner is the World Champion, and whether or not he is depends on whether you recognize them to be that. The IPT is a prime example with last years World Championships.

anyone can reach any conclusion they wish by omitting relevant information.

only a few of the top players enter any particular non-grand slam or non-major tournament in tennis and golf. in fact most of those events pay the top players to enter--whether they win or not!--just to get a few big names. however, for the slams and majors, it's big news when a top players doesn't enter. furthermore, do you really think any of the players you mentioned treat every tournament like they treat the us open and wimbledon? when roddick was a kid, which tournament do you think he dreamed about winning? how about mickelson in golf?

the prestigious tournaments in golf and tennis are prestigious mainly from their history. the purse is also a significant factor, but the top players in those sports are driven by glory first, money second.

i don't know if the world championship holds more prestige than the us open in pool. my reply to you was not in any way to defend wu. rather, i was criticizing your over abstraction that "at the end of the day a tournament is a tournament."

you can convince yourself all you want that your abstraction is sound, that "t's all in [my] head," but again consider this: do you really think the players themselves think that all tournaments are the same? and if not, don't you think their performance will reflect this difference?

william

 

[Cameron Smith]

anyone can reach any conclusion they wish by omitting relevant information.

only a few of the top players enter any particular non-grand slam or non-major tournament in tennis and golf. in fact most of those events pay the top players to enter--whether they win or not!--just to get a few big names. however, for the slams and majors, it's big news when a top players doesn't enter. furthermore, do you really think any of the players you mentioned treat every tournament like they treat the us open and wimbledon? when roddick was a kid, which tournament do you think he dreamed about winning? how about mickelson in golf?

the prestigious tournaments in golf and tennis are prestigious mainly from their history. the purse is also a significant factor, but the top players in those sports are driven by glory first, money second.

i don't know if the world championship holds more prestige than the us open in pool. my reply to you was not in any way to defend wu. rather, i was criticizing your over abstraction that "at the end of the day a tournament is a tournament."

you can convince yourself all you want that your abstraction is sound, that "t's all in [my] head," but again consider this: do you really think the players themselves think that all tournaments are the same? and if not, don't you think their performance will reflect this difference?

william

In my original post I didn't go into too many details, or any I guess. I was referring to tournaments that do have the top players in the world. You are right that the importance of a tournament differs in prestige and money. However my point is that the US Open at Pinehurst No. 2 with all of the top players is no different than some other tournament at pinehurst No.2 with all of the top players. The best example of this is Ranking events in snooker, the top 16 players are almost always there, however the World Championships are somehow more difficult to win than the UK Championships. Why? Because they believe it to be.

To answer your question, they do believe it is different, and yes it does affect their performance. I suppose that is where difference comes into play. It is very difficult to stand back from a situation and severe the mental connection that makes something more or less important. For example a test that could influence your entire future would cause you to be very anxious, but to realize that it is no different from any other test you have ever taken (provided that is truly the case), can have great calming effects. This philosophy aided me greatly throughout university, I was always the calmest person in the exam room.

It's all philosophical, mumbo jumbo, bs. But I enjoy thinking about useless stuff like this.