Intentional Foul Question

[salam4]

Ok I have a question. In the table layout posted the object is to tie the 3 ball up with the 1 ball. Now this post says intentionally double hitting is unsportsmanlike conduct and should be a loss of game. In the layout posted the cueball is very close to the 3 ball, shooting straight into the 3 ball could result into an obvious double hit. Does that mean the hit on the 3ball absolutely cannot double hit, which means the player MUST shoot at the 3 ball jacked up to avoid the double hit? So if in a big tournament should a person call the TD to watch this hit on the 3 ball to make sure the player does not double hit the 3ball.

You can intentionally foul as long as it's a legal stroke; i.e. the cue tip hits the CB once and only once, in a normal forward stroking motion.

If you intentionally hit the ball illegally, though, such as raking it with the side of the cue, pushing (rather than hitting), or intentionally double-hitting, then this is ruled as intentionally moving the balls by means other than a legal stroke, which is an instance of unsportsmanlike conduct. Unsportsmanlike conduct rules (usually loss of game) apply.

-Andrew

 

[mjantti]

Ok I have a question. In the table layout posted the object is to tie the 3 ball up with the 1 ball. Now this post says intentionally double hitting is unsportsmanlike conduct and should be a loss of game. In the layout posted the cueball is very close to the 3 ball, shooting straight into the 3 ball could result into an obvious double hit. Does that mean the hit on the 3ball absolutely cannot double hit, which means the player MUST shoot at the 3 ball jacked up to avoid the double hit? So if in a big tournament should a person call the TD to watch this hit on the 3 ball to make sure the player does not double hit the 3ball.

It's obvious that Andrew Manning is wrong on this issue. Intentionally double-hitting the cueball cannot be unsportmanship conduct except maybe in extreme cases. But the situation in this thread is not one of them. Read my earlier post.

 

[Ironman317]

i think according to texas express rules, the incoming player would have the option to put the 3 back where he thinks it was...just like when you bump a ball with your hand. it would also be up to the td whether or not to call it a loss of game. either way, its unsportsmanlike and the perp. should be dog cussed. imo.

 

[Dawgie]

In tournament play, intentional fouls are allowed. If you use the tip of the cue to make a normal stroke, you can make a foul. The problem is that there is no written rule on where to draw the line between a regular intentional foul and unsportmanship conduct. So, a referee/the TD has to make a ruling based on his judgment. This is how I would rule the following scenarios (remember, you might get different rulings from different referees/TD's):

a) intentional foul in which a player pushes the 3-ball to make a cluster - a regular foul, no unsportmanship conduct. Making clusters with a regular shooting motion using the tip of your cue is a basic strategy in pool. Doesn't really matter if he can make the shot with or without the push stroke, it's a foul anyway.
b) intentional foul in which player uses to the tip of cue, pushes through a whole row of balls/several balls with a regular shooting motion with a clear intention to gain advantage by for instance pushing many balls towards his hole in 1pocket - unsportmanship conduct and a loss of rack. (remember, unsportmanship conduct isn't always a foul straight away, a warning can also be issued if the situation is unclear on the players original intentions)
c) player double clutches the cueball, meaning he hits it slightly in his first try and immediately shoots again trying to cover his mistake and moves the 3-ball in the original scenario - I'd warn him for unsportmanlike conduct because he was trying to alter the situation after he had taken his shot, but I wouldn't penalize him further. I'd offer the oncoming player the option to replace the 3-ball in its original position or take the table as it lies (with BIH of course).
d) all other scenarios with a player moving/brushing all the balls with the intention to gain an advantage - unsportmanlike conduct on a "heavier scale". Loss of rack at minimum, probably forfeiture of the match or banning the player from the whole tournament.

Hope this helps. Would be nice to hear input from Bob Jewett as well.

Mikko Jantti
official EPBF referee

I agree and prefer Mikko's rule # C, if this was the first time the opponent did this. If not = loss of match. JMHO