Something I do from time to time - on certain 'punch shots' that employ strange english is to actually let the cue "slide" forward in right hand. - Like a battering ram: kinda. Does anyone else ever do this?
Letting the cue go
- Thread starter DeadStrokeMan
- Start date
A while back I found myself doing this alot on shots where the cue ball was on the rail. Seemed to work at the time, but I haven't noticed if I'm still doing it. I'll have to check when I'm playing this weekend.
DeadStrokeMan said:
this is an advanced technique called a "stroke-slip" like the slip-stroke, but you slip during the stroke instead of after.
i do it all the time on certain shots
VAP
I do it all the time too. More for follow shots than anything though. Of course, if the speed is off, then itll be a miscue 100% of the time. I never let it slip too far though, maybe an inch or two.
seiyaryu55 said:
Well I'll be. Been doing it for years and just "noticed" it the other day. I find I do it on one shot in particular
Slow Speed + High Spin cut shot ... you know - the 91Degree cut
I thought perhaps I had developed a bad habit for certain shots - lol. Good to know I'm not the only one that does this. I don't slip more than a 'tad' / perhaps an inch or so. It's something to do with allowing the cue to absorb all the feedback from the CB... something I do by instinct rather than "intentionally" .
randyg said:
Its the "can't be done" cut shot -
or
the "Oh right, you're gunna cut that" shot.
or
the "OMG! I can't believe he cut that ball in !" shot
or
the "from here, it didn't look possible" cut shot.
This can be done with RADICAL (fixing - oops not outside ) inside spin - which not only reduces the friction upon strike to zero - but actually "throws" the OB just a tad as well.
The only issue with the shot is a WILD CB ....hard to know where the darn thing is gunna stop after it hits that first rail - ZOOOOM
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DeadStrokeMan said:
Or inside english too. Lots of spin, works wonders.
I stroke this way all the time. I actually let it slide through my hand quite a bit. I feel it is great for maximizing my stroke, aim and it is a much more relaxed way of shooting, i.e., I don't use as much physical effort. In other words, I let the cue do most of the work.
for myself, i do not let the cue slip in my hands, i do not squeeze on the butt but let the cue do its own work (as previously mentioned). alot of players use this method, Django, Mika, on delivery, the the gripping of the cue only comes after the cue ball has left the tip to prevent the cue from flying forward.
that the reason i realise that most of the top players play with a heavier cue eg 20 oz and above...., they let the cue do its down work.
Cheers
that the reason i realise that most of the top players play with a heavier cue eg 20 oz and above...., they let the cue do its down work.
Cheers
Wizardry said:
Prooving to be an interesting topic indeed - makes me think more. On the edge of the cue doing the work - closest to it is better. Hmmm...
Been rack running fool tonight - lots of fun.
slip stroke opinion
This is a technique that can easliy introduce a lot of uncertainty into your game. If the idea is to eliminate problem areas, avoid using this method. Consider this...for the cue to slip in your hand, the inertia (force) of the cue must overcome the friction of your grip. If you assume that the skin on your hand has limited compression resistance, and that resistance is less as you release your grip (the resistance curve is non-linear) then you can quickly deduce that sideways forces (almost always unwanted) can overcome the lower end of the curve more easily...even if you could accurately grip the sliding cue with the same force every time...which you cannot. This is the same as the deflection arguement...loose grip allows the handle to move sideways (off axis) more easily in your hand away from smaller and smaller sideways forces as your grip loosens more and more. Most players experiment with this grip and move on after honest appraisal of its worth. The arguement has been advanced that errors in the stroke itself can be lessened through a loose/sliding grip using this same rationale...this may be true...but what do you want to be working on? The symptom or the illness. I would be curious to hear another opinion. You be the judge.
This is a technique that can easliy introduce a lot of uncertainty into your game. If the idea is to eliminate problem areas, avoid using this method. Consider this...for the cue to slip in your hand, the inertia (force) of the cue must overcome the friction of your grip. If you assume that the skin on your hand has limited compression resistance, and that resistance is less as you release your grip (the resistance curve is non-linear) then you can quickly deduce that sideways forces (almost always unwanted) can overcome the lower end of the curve more easily...even if you could accurately grip the sliding cue with the same force every time...which you cannot. This is the same as the deflection arguement...loose grip allows the handle to move sideways (off axis) more easily in your hand away from smaller and smaller sideways forces as your grip loosens more and more. Most players experiment with this grip and move on after honest appraisal of its worth. The arguement has been advanced that errors in the stroke itself can be lessened through a loose/sliding grip using this same rationale...this may be true...but what do you want to be working on? The symptom or the illness. I would be curious to hear another opinion. You be the judge.
HittMan said:
I tend to sympathize with your conclusion to some degree. I believe in the above case of "absolutely letting the entire cue slide way into the CB" would be an extreme case this.
For me - I recall in me youth ..that instead of "powdering up the bridge hand" - I would instead powder up the RIGHT hand - to aid in the feel of the slide.
Now, this is one of the reasons I HATED that meucci - because the went and stuck "sticky" plastic over that fine linen . .... I don't miss that thing one bit. My game has been gettin' tough lately and I noted that the "slip factor" was much greater than in previous months (with a weaker game).
For now, I'll let 'er slip when it WANTS to ...but I'll probably not go into the shot with outward intentions of "slip stroke". Rather, if the conditions arise such that completion of a ball drop and shape "took" SLIP ...I'll let it happen. Time will tell as I've not had a table in my home since I was 15 years old
HittMan said:
Your points are well taken. I think the key is to have a good solid bridge. Mosconi said something like 80% of correct technique and aim should be accomplished with a good bridge. I think if you bridge correctly and control most of your shots through your bridge, it will help alleviate some of the problems you described. Try this shot with both a slide stroke and a gripped stroke and see which stroke you have better luck with:
Put a ball on the second diamond where the "kitchen" starts frozen to the rail and put the cue ball just to the left of the foot spot. Now shoot the ball in the corner pocket with low inside english and see if you can draw/spin the cb down below the bottom corner pocket after it hits the opposite side rail. If you can do that with a closed bridge, then your stroke is working for you. Personally, I have to use the slip stroke to make it happen. I don't seem to have that much of a problem with shooting consistency considering I work about 12 hours a day and shoot pool a couple of hours after work when I'm dead tired.
randyg said:
i don't think he's ever seen a real 90 degree cut randy..........
those impossible cuts that you have to spin in are usually in the 80 degree's if i'm not mistaken.
VAP
This throwing the cue at the cb has been discussed a lot but this is not a slip stroke. A true slip stroke is where the grip hand slides back on the cue as the backstroke begins.
Dammed if I know why but that's what the experts have been posting for a long time.
Do a search for slip stroke and see what I mean. Guys like Jewett and Rod etc will explain what a real slip stroke is.
Dammed if I know why but that's what the experts have been posting for a long time.
Do a search for slip stroke and see what I mean. Guys like Jewett and Rod etc will explain what a real slip stroke is.