McDermott cue question

[jed1894]

Are all McDermotts made the same?

I have two and both are a little butt heavy....or at least more than my Joss and Schon. However, they are both wrapless. My McDermotts are about 1 1/2to 2 inches off (balance point) from the Schon and Joss.

Just wondering if all the same? Will the wrap change balance? I want a McDermott that is more forward balanced (at least more then I have now). I'm sure McDermott will make me one, but the cost will probably increase significantly. Any other suggestions or comments on this?

Thanks, JED

 

[billyjack]

McDermott Balance

Jed,
You can probably accomplish a more forward balance just by moving the weight bolt. Typically, Joss uses a 1/2-13 headless bolt that's threaded well into the butt. McDermott uses a similar bolt but with a larger head, so it's at the extreme rear of the butt. Replace your McD bolt with a Joss bolt, or just cut one from 1/2- 13 threaded rod and cut a slot in one end for a screwdriver. Wind it all the way in untill it bottoms. With a 2 oz. weight bolt you'll move the balance point forward about an inch. My Joss and both McD's are all within 1/2 inch of each other after modifications.
Hope this helps.

Bill

 

[jed1894]

Jed,
You can probably accomplish a more forward balance just by moving the weight bolt. Typically, Joss uses a 1/2-13 headless bolt that's threaded well into the butt. McDermott uses a similar bolt but with a larger head, so it's at the extreme rear of the butt. Replace your McD bolt with a Joss bolt, or just cut one from 1/2- 13 threaded rod and cut a slot in one end for a screwdriver. Wind it all the way in untill it bottoms. With a 2 oz. weight bolt you'll move the balance point forward about an inch. My Joss and both McD's are all within 1/2 inch of each other after modifications.
Hope this helps.

Bill

Thank you very much for the insight. Before I remove that pain-in-the-butt butt cap, let me ask one more thing. Is the bolt on the McDermott kind of like the Meuccis (the one's with the flange bolt that held on the butt). Next, are the Joss threads and McDermott's the same? I have various headless wgt bolts (Viking, Meucci and few others) laying around. Last thing, how far up with the threads go in the McDermott?

Thanks in advance.

JED

 

[jed1894]

It is a flange bolt, but they must have glued that thing in. I could not get it to back out with a screw driver. I didn't want to try a power tool out of caution. Anyway, I see your point. Just wondering how far up the butt (lol) I can go with the flangless bolt.

JED

 

[Nick B]

I find them all butt heavy

They seem to be of good quality but almost all are butt heavy. Most of the guys who like them are playing with 20~21 ouz it seems.

Nick

 

[billyjack]

It is a flange bolt, but they must have glued that thing in. I could not get it to back out with a screw driver. I didn't want to try a power tool out of caution. Anyway, I see your point. Just wondering how far up the butt (lol) I can go with the flangless bolt.

JED

Both my Joss and McD's (EF3 and EF27) have about a 6" deep hole threaded with a 1/2-13 thread. Can't measure now since I'm headed for work soon, but I can always check tonight if you'd like to know. Joss may even be a little deeper. Never had a Meucci, but I know some cues use the weight bolt to hold the buttcap on. McD's must be glued together well, since I've had no issues with loose buttcap after changing to a headless weight bolt, and it's been over a year. I know some older McD's used a larger weight bolt (around 3/4-7/8"). Those used a small machine screw that held the bumper on, and most likely don't have a cavity that's as deep. Net gain would depend on the weight of the bolt in your particular cue, but it was about 1 1/4" forward in balance point for me.

Bill

 

[Shawn Armstrong]

Are all McDermotts made the same?

I have two and both are a little butt heavy....or at least more than my Joss and Schon. However, they are both wrapless. My McDermotts are about 1 1/2to 2 inches off (balance point) from the Schon and Joss.

Just wondering if all the same? Will the wrap change balance? I want a McDermott that is more forward balanced (at least more then I have now). I'm sure McDermott will make me one, but the cost will probably increase significantly. Any other suggestions or comments on this?

Thanks, JED

There's a major difference in the three cues you are talking about. Joss and Schon, for the most part, have stainless steel joints. McDs, on the other hand, usually have a plastic joint, like a Viking or Meucci. That accounts for about an ounce and a bit more weight in the front of the cue. So, naturally the Joss and Schon will be more front heavy. The Joss and Schon also use a brass insert in the shaft, and that adds weight to the front of the cue as well.

If you want a McD to be similar in balance to the Schon or Joss, buy a McD with a stainless steel joint collar, and/or an exotic front section like cocobolo or ebony. That will shift the weight forward. The weight bolt trick will move the balance point a maximum of 1/4", so it's really not worth the effort. Trust me - I've tried this very thing with my McDs. I ended up switching to stainless steel jointed McDs to counteract the back balance.

 

[Purdman]

There's a major difference in the three cues you are talking about. Joss and Schon, for the most part, have stainless steel joints. McDs, on the other hand, usually have a plastic joint, like a Viking or Meucci. That accounts for about an ounce and a bit more weight in the front of the cue. So, naturally the Joss and Schon will be more front heavy. The Joss and Schon also use a brass insert in the shaft, and that adds weight to the front of the cue as well.

If you want a McD to be similar in balance to the Schon or Joss, buy a McD with a stainless steel joint collar, and/or an exotic front section like cocobolo or ebony. That will shift the weight forward. The weight bolt trick will move the balance point a maximum of 1/4", so it's really not worth the effort. Trust me - I've tried this very thing with my McDs. I ended up switching to stainless steel jointed McDs to counteract the back balance.

Here is what comes in the new Joss cues. Let me know if I can help you out.
Peace, Purdman :smile:
Sorry about the lousy picture.

 

[Shawn Armstrong]

Here is what comes in the new Joss cues. Let me know if I can help you out.
Peace, Purdman :smile:
Sorry about the lousy picture.

Yeah, I have the same stuff you do. You can't change the balance point drastically on a McD by placing set screws farther up in the wrap. You'll change the balance point by about a 1/4" max. Not worth the effort, especially if he's trying to get them to be balanced like a Joss or Schon.

 

[jed1894]

Both my Joss and McD's (EF3 and EF27) have about a 6" deep hole threaded with a 1/2-13 thread. Can't measure now since I'm headed for work soon, but I can always check tonight if you'd like to know. Joss may even be a little deeper. Never had a Meucci, but I know some cues use the weight bolt to hold the buttcap on. McD's must be glued together well, since I've had no issues with loose buttcap after changing to a headless weight bolt, and it's been over a year. I know some older McD's used a larger weight bolt (around 3/4-7/8"). Those used a small machine screw that held the bumper on, and most likely don't have a cavity that's as deep. Net gain would depend on the weight of the bolt in your particular cue, but it was about 1 1/4" forward in balance point for me.

Bill

I like the 1 1/4 difference if it can be done. Shawn doesn't think it's possible based on his experience. I called McDermott and Jamie told me I'd probably be better off getting another cue with a SS joint or quick release. He also suggested changing the joint of my existing cue, but the cost would out-weigh the cue's worth. However, I'd like to try anyway since I'm not using the cue the way it is. Any forward balance would be better. If it's not too much trouble, can you see how deep it is tonight when you get home? Thanks in advance, JED

 

[jed1894]

There's a major difference in the three cues you are talking about. Joss and Schon, for the most part, have stainless steel joints. McDs, on the other hand, usually have a plastic joint, like a Viking or Meucci. That accounts for about an ounce and a bit more weight in the front of the cue. So, naturally the Joss and Schon will be more front heavy. The Joss and Schon also use a brass insert in the shaft, and that adds weight to the front of the cue as well.

If you want a McD to be similar in balance to the Schon or Joss, buy a McD with a stainless steel joint collar, and/or an exotic front section like cocobolo or ebony. That will shift the weight forward. The weight bolt trick will move the balance point a maximum of 1/4", so it's really not worth the effort. Trust me - I've tried this very thing with my McDs. I ended up switching to stainless steel jointed McDs to counteract the back balance.

Thanks Shawn. I'm going to try to move the weight bolt forward and see what happens. I guess another experiment won't hurt. I guess it also depends on how deep the bolt will go.

JED

 

[Shawn Armstrong]

Thanks Shawn. I'm going to try to move the weight bolt forward and see what happens. I guess another experiment won't hurt. I guess it also depends on how deep the bolt will go.

JED

It depends on which cue you have, how old it is, and what style of bolt was used the add the weight. They all don't have the same weight bolt, depending on what the finished weight was, versus the requested weight of the cue for the customer. I've had cues from McD (I'm a dealer for them) that have a hole that accepts the longest bolt. My Sledgehammer from McD will only take a 4" bolt maximum. To get 1 and 1/4" balance change is unheard off, at least to me, with ANY cue weighted in the butt. The only cues I've seen like this are Vikings, because the hole in the handle takes weight up to 7-8" deep from the butt cap. Otherwise, McDs will have a maximum bore of about 6", give or take. If it's less, you'd have to drill it out and tap the remaining section out with a 1/2-13 tap that needs to be at least 8" long.

Good luck!

 

[billyjack]

I like the 1 1/4 difference if it can be done. Shawn doesn't think it's possible based on his experience. I called McDermott and Jamie told me I'd probably be better off getting another cue with a SS joint or quick release. He also suggested changing the joint of my existing cue, but the cost would out-weigh the cue's worth. However, I'd like to try anyway since I'm not using the cue the way it is. Any forward balance would be better. If it's not too much trouble, can you see how deep it is tonight when you get home? Thanks in advance, JED

Jed,
Sorry for the delay in responding. Two 13 hour days at the office put a damper on my AZ time. In response to your request, I dug out my notes and scale and re-checked one of my McDermotts. It's a Morada wood, leather wrap plain-jane cue. Butt weight empty is 13.7 oz. Originally it had a 2 oz. weight bolt in the extreme rear for a total cue weight of 19.7 oz. Balance point was 10 3/8 in. from the joint face. Replacing the bolt with a forward- mounted Joss headless bolt moved the balance point to 10 1/16. The cavity is a total of 6 5/8 in. deep, of which 5 3/4 in. is forward of the buttcap flange where the factory weight bolt locates. Next I removed the bolt completely and started adding weight about 1/2 oz. at a time, playing a couple racks for feel after each move. My final solution was with a 1.4 oz. bolt, forward mounted, for a total cue weight of 19.1 oz. and a balance point of 9 1/2 in. from the joint face, a net change of 7/8 inch forward. The difference in weight is not near as noticeable as the difference in balance. Shawn's comment about a relocated weight bolt only moving the balance point about 1/4 inch is correct, but it's still a noticeable change in feel IMO. If you have the skills to mess around with weight bolts size and location, definitely experiment. Anything that gives you more confidence in your stick is a good thing in my opinion. Hope this helps.
Bill

 

[jed1894]

Jed,
Sorry for the delay in responding. Two 13 hour days at the office put a damper on my AZ time. In response to your request, I dug out my notes and scale and re-checked one of my McDermotts. It's a Morada wood, leather wrap plain-jane cue. Butt weight empty is 13.7 oz. Originally it had a 2 oz. weight bolt in the extreme rear for a total cue weight of 19.7 oz. Balance point was 10 3/8 in. from the joint face. Replacing the bolt with a forward- mounted Joss headless bolt moved the balance point to 10 1/16. The cavity is a total of 6 5/8 in. deep, of which 5 3/4 in. is forward of the buttcap flange where the factory weight bolt locates. Next I removed the bolt completely and started adding weight about 1/2 oz. at a time, playing a couple racks for feel after each move. My final solution was with a 1.4 oz. bolt, forward mounted, for a total cue weight of 19.1 oz. and a balance point of 9 1/2 in. from the joint face, a net change of 7/8 inch forward. The difference in weight is not near as noticeable as the difference in balance. Shawn's comment about a relocated weight bolt only moving the balance point about 1/4 inch is correct, but it's still a noticeable change in feel IMO. If you have the skills to mess around with weight bolts size and location, definitely experiment. Anything that gives you more confidence in your stick is a good thing in my opinion. Hope this helps.
Bill

I sent you a response via PM.

thanks, JED

 

[jed1894]

It depends on which cue you have, how old it is, and what style of bolt was used the add the weight. They all don't have the same weight bolt, depending on what the finished weight was, versus the requested weight of the cue for the customer. I've had cues from McD (I'm a dealer for them) that have a hole that accepts the longest bolt. My Sledgehammer from McD will only take a 4" bolt maximum. To get 1 and 1/4" balance change is unheard off, at least to me, with ANY cue weighted in the butt. The only cues I've seen like this are Vikings, because the hole in the handle takes weight up to 7-8" deep from the butt cap. Otherwise, McDs will have a maximum bore of about 6", give or take. If it's less, you'd have to drill it out and tap the remaining section out with a 1/2-13 tap that needs to be at least 8" long.

Good luck!

Thanks Shawn, since your a dealer for McDermott maybe you can help me get the flange bolt broken free. I've tried everything but heating it up. According to McDermott they do not glue the bolts in, but someone has done something to this bolt. The bolt is stuck! I've tried 3 foot long screw drivers, allen wrenches, someone holding the butt while the other turned. Nothing. It will not move. The only thing left to try (without damaging the cue) is heating it up. You have any other suggestions?

JED

 

[WheatCues]

Are all McDermotts made the same?

I have two and both are a little butt heavy....or at least more than my Joss and Schon. However, they are both wrapless. My McDermotts are about 1 1/2to 2 inches off (balance point) from the Schon and Joss.

Just wondering if all the same? Will the wrap change balance? I want a McDermott that is more forward balanced (at least more then I have now). I'm sure McDermott will make me one, but the cost will probably increase significantly. Any other suggestions or comments on this?

Thanks, JED

In my experienced opinion of McDermott cues I find them to be butt heavy as wqell as extremely thick.. I think they were modeled from the old Balabuska days...

I personally can't make a ball with any of them becasue they are NOT comfortable to me at all.....

From my experience in the commercial industry I find that McDermott has compromised their loyalty to their distributors by offering the genral public the same prices at certain marketing points along the line and that to me shows desperation !

McDermott is what it is... a nice looking cue but lacks in playability.. "but that is purely opinionated"

If you like to hit a ball with a tree trunk then McDermott is the cue for you !!!

But just like Meucci they are suffering in they're overall sales and have to market themselves anyway they can.. even it includes compromising thier principles just to stay afloat....


- Eddie Wheat

 

[ratcues]

McDermott have used several different weight bolt styles over the years and are currently using two. One is 1/2-13 as in your Joss or Viking, the other is a giant 3/4-? To my knowledge, McDermott has never glued in the weight bolt but some do get stuff from polishing compound. Put on your big girl panties and give 'er a twist.

 

[Shawn Armstrong]

McDermott is what it is... a nice looking cue but lacks in playability.. "but that is purely opinionated"

If you like to hit a ball with a tree trunk then McDermott is the cue for you !!!
- Eddie Wheat

Yeah, imagine if Engert was using a Predator or some other cue instead of a crappy McDermott. His high run wouldn't have been 491 - it would have been 1000.

This is the attitude from custom cuemakers that I hate. "Buy mine because production cues suck". McDermott makes a great playing cue, and an excellent value for their price.

 

[ratcues]

Yeah, imagine if Engert was using a Predator or some other cue instead of a crappy McDermott. His high run wouldn't have been 491 - it would have been 1000.

This is the attitude from custom cuemakers that I hate. "Buy mine because production cues suck". McDermott makes a great playing cue, and an excellent value for their price.

I loved the older ones with the stiffer taper.

Very good value, at any age.

 

[Nick B]

Come on Shawn...the man simply stated his opinion and I don't think Eddie was bashing. I too find McD's thick in the back and thus back heavy. I'm sure Engert could run a few balls with my forward weighted cue. I've met quite a few people who love their McDermotts but have had them cored out and cork placed in back to shift weight forward. I don't care for them but they offer good value and great service so deserve support.

Nick

Yeah, imagine if Engert was using a Predator or some other cue instead of a crappy McDermott. His high run wouldn't have been 491 - it would have been 1000.

This is the attitude from custom cuemakers that I hate. "Buy mine because production cues suck". McDermott makes a great playing cue, and an excellent value for their price.