Metal Frame tables

[NYC]

It looks like the Sam table from over in Spain is a complete metal framed billiard table. A Kiwi displaced here in the States raves about a Laili table that comes from the Peri group in China. Peri is the largest manufacturer of billiard equipment in that very large consumer market. The Laili X3 looks to be based on the Rasson OX design and with the metal framing it should be easy to assemble, along with being very sturdy. The Sam table looks industrial and possibly more expensive the a GC VI.

Laili X3 US 8 Ball/9 Ball/10 Ball Pool Table 9ft

3 pieces of extra-thick slates: Avoid the deviation of billiard ball route due to the deformation of slates to a greater extent; Structural-mechanical underframe: Avoid table deformation due to the long-term using, improve table stability and durability; Pocket size: 12cm Modern design: Looks...

maxspnbilliards.co.nz

K.STEEL 2 | Billares SAM

SAM's professional American pool.

sambilliards.com

 

[TrxR]

The Predator tables are a Sam's table with the Predator name stuck on them.

I've heard the Sam's Ksteels could be a pain to put together and get right.

 

[Island Drive]

The only thing Wrong with the earlier gold crowns was the metal would show up on light colored pants and ruin em.
You must wear black/dark pants to play on these tables.
I'm hoping thru time, this metal doesn't do the same as the GC's did.

 

[garczar]

It looks like the Sam table from over in Spain is a complete metal framed billiard table. A Kiwi displaced here in the States raves about a Laili table that comes from the Peri group in China. Peri is the largest manufacturer of billiard equipment in that very large consumer market. The Laili X3 looks to be based on the Rasson OX design and with the metal framing it should be easy to assemble, along with being very sturdy. The Sam table looks industrial and possibly more expensive the a GC VI.

Laili X3 US 8 Ball/9 Ball/10 Ball Pool Table 9ft

3 pieces of extra-thick slates: Avoid the deviation of billiard ball route due to the deformation of slates to a greater extent; Structural-mechanical underframe: Avoid table deformation due to the long-term using, improve table stability and durability; Pocket size: 12cm Modern design: Looks...

maxspnbilliards.co.nz

K.STEEL 2 | Billares SAM

SAM's professional American pool.

sambilliards.com

Laili and Rasson are Chinese, SAM is in Spain. Not rocket science to build steel-frame table. They can play really nice IF set-up properly but getting one right can be a royal pia. Getting all those nuts/bolts properly/evenly snugged is key to getting the frame square/level. SAM's are not as well made as any GC imo.

 

[kitsap]

Another option here: https://clashsteel.com/clash-steel-pro/

 

[MamboFats]

Another option here: https://clashsteel.com/clash-steel-pro/

Clash is very common in Western Europe, particularly Belgium, The Netherlands, Germany, e.o.

 

[NYC]

Getting all those nuts/bolts properly/evenly snugged is key to getting the frame square/level.

A 3/8" drive torque wrench that is well calibrated will make this an easy job. Using the Blue color Loctite gel during assembly will make sure the nuts and bolts don't come apart and stay torqued down to their proper specifications.

Another option here: https://clashsteel.com/clash-steel-pro/

Great looking table and another good option.

 

[Ssonerai]

Steel framing components, including box and rectangular sections, is so cheap, commonly available, and stable that i cannot imagine planning to build any table today using wood framing. I'm even ciphering on how to incorporate it (steel box section) into 1pc replacement side rails for my wife's 1927 BBC "Royal" but it might not be directly possible as an improvement, without messing up the looks. Still thinking, though.

 

[rexus31]

Steel frame tables are great IF:
1. You have a mechanic that pays attention to detail and will go through steps like torquing all bolts to spec using a torque wrench and use thread lock on all fasteners.
2. The table will be setup and never moved.

As we saw with the Predator (SAM) tables during the BCA Event, they were/are not designed to be moved around on a cart and stacked for storage like a Diamond. Diamonds are purpose built for this process.

I prefer a well sorted Gold Crown vs. a steel framed table, but that's just me. They are prevalent overseas but never really caught on on the states.

 

[garczar]

Clash is very common in Western Europe, particularly Belgium, The Netherlands, Germany, e.o.

I searched Clash one time and it seems they are part of Lootjens/GDMSport and are somehow connected to Gabriels. Not made in Gabriels shop but they have some input to their design. Not 100% sure on all the details but i think i'm close. They look to be very well made and have a rep for being a great playing table.

 

[fastone371]

Steel frame tables are great IF:
1. You have a mechanic that pays attention to detail and will go through steps like torquing all bolts to spec using a torque wrench and use thread lock on all fasteners.
2. The table will be setup and never moved.

As we saw with the Predator (SAM) tables during the BCA Event, they were/are not designed to be moved around on a cart and stacked for storage like a Diamond. Diamonds are purpose built for this process.

I prefer a well sorted Gold Crown vs. a steel framed table, but that's just me. They are prevalent overseas but never really caught on on the states.

If bolts are properly torqued its the bolt stretch that keeps the fasteners tight so there is no need for thread locker. Besides, pool tables don't really vibrate like something with an engine or motor does.

 

[TrxR]

Ive also heard keeping everything perfectly square while getting everything tight can be a pain as well.

Steel frame tables are great IF:
1. You have a mechanic that pays attention to detail and will go through steps like torquing all bolts to spec using a torque wrench and use thread lock on all fasteners.
2. The table will be setup and never moved.

As we saw with the Predator (SAM) tables during the BCA Event, they were/are not designed to be moved around on a cart and stacked for storage like a Diamond. Diamonds are purpose built for this process.

I prefer a well sorted Gold Crown vs. a steel framed table, but that's just me. They are prevalent overseas but never really caught on on the states.

 

[fastone371]

Ive also heard keeping everything perfectly square while getting everything tight can be a pain as well.

I would imagine that this would fall under how well the builder builds the table. The nice thing about steel is that it is stable, not affected by temps or humidity. A steel frame table could be dowel pinned so it is simply a matter of correct order of assembly and proper fastener tightening. When I speak of steel frame tables I don't mean the kind of steel that a gas grill might be made of but maybe a 2" x 3" rectangle frame with crossmembers and bracing where required. That would easily support a 1500 pound pool table. I'm not sure how Kim Steele's or Rasson pool tables are built or what materials they are made with.

 

[TrxR]

I would imagine that this would fall under how well the builder builds the table. The nice thing about steel is that it is stable, not affected by temps or humidity. A steel frame table could be dowel pinned so it is simply a matter of correct order of assembly and proper fastener tightening. When I speak of steel frame tables I don't mean the kind of steel that a gas grill might be made of but maybe a 2" x 3" rectangle frame with crossmembers and bracing where required. That would easily support a 1500 pound pool table. I'm not sure how Kim Steele's or Rasson pool tables are built or what materials they are made with.

Rasson tables aren't steel framed if i remember right. They are aluminum. Kim Steel and Predator are steel as they are basically the same table.

 

[Ssonerai]

As we saw with the Predator (SAM) tables during the BCA Event, they were/are not designed to be moved around on a cart and stacked for storage like a Diamond. Diamonds are purpose built for this process.

What Fastone said.

This is not really a function of (adequately spec'd size/section/gage) steel components.
It is a function of the designer, and then how far the builder deviates to save time at the factory.
Probably built by people more comfortable with wood, that said "let's try steel because wood of adequate size and quality costs way too much these days". & "we need to make it fully adjustable in every detail since you can't plane or saw it to adjust".
Or maybe built by steel fab shop where 1/8" is more than close enough; and if you aren't going to weld it, what do you expect in the field?!"

It needs designed by an engineer & proper machinists who have a jones for high quality billiards equipment.

 

[NYC]

It needs designed by an engineer & proper machinists who have a jones for high quality billiards equipment.

That is why it took the Rolex watch company a few years and tries to finally find a quality China supplier for their watch cases. The dials, crowns, hands and bezels are made in the same factory as the cases are. The only Swiss made unit is the actual mechanical watch mechanism. The Chinese watchmakers like Benjamin Chee produce mechanical watch movements that are far more accurate then any Rolex product was, coming in at a 2 second deviation every 24 hours. Rolex had to up their game and came out with their superlative chronometer mechanical movements after Chee opened up his shop. Rasson produces a lot of billiard table slates that they fabricate up with their 21st century CNC milling machines. Selling a lot of the prefabricated slates to other billiard table manufacturers in China and in Europe. High quality items are produced in China everyday, you just have to find them, or get them manufactured up.

 

[NYC]

might be made of but maybe a 2" x 3" rectangle frame with crossmembers and bracing

Picture of the frame of a K2 Steel table. Spot on that 2 x 3" framing would easily handle 1500 lbs of slate. I wonder how much the slate pieces weigh for the table.

 

[TrxR]

What Fastone said.

This is not really a function of (adequately spec'd size/section/gage) steel components.
It is a function of the designer, and then how far the builder deviates to save time at the factory.
Probably built by people more comfortable with wood, that said "let's try steel because wood of adequate size and quality costs way too much these days". & "we need to make it fully adjustable in every detail since you can't plane or saw it to adjust".
Or maybe built by steel fab shop where 1/8" is more than close enough; and if you aren't going to weld it, what do you expect in the field?!"

It needs designed by an engineer & proper machinists who have a jones for high quality billiards equipment.

Sam has been building these tables for years as the Ksteel so they are not new to building steel frame tables.

 

[Ssonerai]

Sam has been building these tables for years as the Ksteel so they are not new to building steel frame tables.

Although i was responding to rexus31 post #9; that's a little beside the point, don't you think?
The question is: was it designed and the manufacturing process approved, to avoid this situation:

1. You have a mechanic that pays attention to detail and will go through steps like torquing all bolts to spec using a torque wrench and use thread lock on all fasteners.
2. The table will be setup and never moved.

As we saw with the Predator (SAM) tables during the BCA Event, they were/are not designed to be moved around on a cart and stacked for storage like a Diamond. Diamonds are purpose built for this process.

Lots of perfectly OK products are designed down to a point (cost, ease of sourcing vendor supplies, etc) & produced for years regardless of not being optimal; which would take only a little more effort and a little less lazy brain.

That said, i don't know much about current steel framed tables, but can see the possibilities when done right, & easily imagine "how i would do it , if i were the one!"

 

[garczar]

I would imagine that this would fall under how well the builder builds the table. The nice thing about steel is that it is stable, not affected by temps or humidity. A steel frame table could be dowel pinned so it is simply a matter of correct order of assembly and proper fastener tightening. When I speak of steel frame tables I don't mean the kind of steel that a gas grill might be made of but maybe a 2" x 3" rectangle frame with crossmembers and bracing where required. That would easily support a 1500 pound pool table. I'm not sure how Kim Steele's or Rasson pool tables are built or what materials they are made with.

The humidity/temp affects the cloth/rubber more than anything else so frame material really doesn't matter. The frame of a quality wood-framed table is just as stable due to its mass. Humidity is not going to make a GC frame move. You guys need to talk to RKC about SAM's, he's worked on them and can tell you from a mechanics pov their issues.