missing easy balls

[z0nt0n3r]

hi everyone, i'm a good B player who can run out tables but my problem is in many sets that i play (especially tournament matches), i usually will miss 1-2 easy balls which most likely will cost you the rack at this level. i think in most sets that i play (races to 9), i will miss about 6-7 balls on average and usually one of these will be an easy ball.

my question is, are these balls missed due to fundamentals or lack of concentration/match pressure?

 

[Patrick Johnson]

...are these balls missed due to fundamentals or lack of concentration/match pressure?

Yes.

pj
chgo

 

[Bob Jewett]

Yes. ...

While this was somewhat tongue in cheek, it was also correct.

We have no way of knowing what @z0nt0n3r 's problem is. Maybe he has a floppy bridge that works OK when there is no pressure. Maybe he plays equally well in practice as in tournaments but doesn't remember his practice misses. We don't know.

Most players who have never had competent instruction have something in their fundamentals that's holding them back. I think that has to be in-person instruction to really be effective. It is really hard for people to see themselves and their flaws.

My advice to the OP: video record yourself in practice. Look at it critically. Record yourself in matches. If possible, get someone to help you look at yourself, such as an instructor.

 

[Zerksies]

Without seeing you hit a ball it's almost impossible to tell as to why you miss

 

[FranCrimi]

My experience with missed easy shots is that they usually occur when the player isn't 100% clear on what they want to do with the cue ball. All it takes is a hair of indecision to distract you enough to lose focus on the shot. If you haven't made up your mind yet, then don't get down on the shot, even if it's a hanger --- or get back up if you're already down. It'll turn into a crap-shoot if you start strategizing when you're already down.

Another reason for a missed easy shot is that the player already made the shot in his head and forgot to go through the proper routine to execute it because he's down on the shot and thinking of the next shot.

 

[boogieman]

My experience with missed easy shots is that they usually occur when the player isn't 100% clear on what they want to do with the cue ball. All it takes is a hair of indecision to distract you enough to lose focus on the shot. If you haven't made up your mind yet, then don't get down on the shot, even if it's a hanger --- or get back up if you're already down. It'll turn into a crap-shoot if you start strategizing when you're already down.

Another reason for a missed easy shot is that the player already made the shot in his head and forgot to go through the proper routine to execute it because he's down on the shot and thinking of the next shot.

I'm not an instructor, just the peanut gallery, but I agree wholeheartedly!

Ever notice that when you miss an easy shot that the CB ends up in a really good position for the next shot? You have to execute the shot you're on before the next one. When I catch myself doing this it really irritates me. After getting my emotions (irritation) under control I like to think "be deliberate" as one of the last steps of my PSR. You have to execute each shot fully and deliberately before the next one.

At times this takes a lot of focus, especially if you're tired from long waits or play during tournaments. It takes endurance. It's easy to just whack balls and not be deliberate. Sometimes you get away with it, but often a miss is because you lost focus on actually shooting the one you're on.

 

[Poolmanis]

Problem is probably same what i have. You identify shot in your mind easy ball and use half ass focus because of that.
It happens more in tournaments because your focus is more intense so we players want relax after hard shots and totally think we always make ball anyway and we then don´t give it attention that EVERY shot need.
I make this too much nowadays and it drives me crazy.
Sometimes we crack under pressure but then you should be able to tell which one was to fault. Be honest to yourself and good luck.

 

[3kushn]

I played my first tournament a few weeks ago after about 3 or 4 year layoff. Decided to do it cause I had the time and wanted to see everyone again. Of course there was the question "how you playing these days"?

My answer was "I don't know. I'm about to find out this weekend. I feel I'm playing pretty well but I'm only playing in my basement by myself. It's really easy to lie to yourself about your game when you rarely compete."

Couple years ago I invited and ex-pro pool player to my house to play some 3cushion. It was all for fun. We talked between nearly every shot about the old days... telling stories about this and that mostly pool stuff. When this man came to the table to shoot, his concentration was over the top. Even when he addressed the most basic shot. There was this switch that got thrown when the stories ended and he stepped to the table to take a shot. It was an eye opener.

As the saying goes, There are no easy shots.

 

[bbb]

Couple years ago I invited and ex-pro pool player to my house to play some 3cushion. It was all for fun. We talked between nearly every shot about the old days... telling stories about this and that mostly pool stuff. When this man came to the table to shoot, his concentration was over the top. Even when he addressed the most basic shot. There was this switch that got thrown when the stories ended and he stepped to the table to take a shot. It was an eye opener.

As the saying goes, There are no easy shots.

i took lessons with demetrius jelatis goes by tinman here on AZB
same thing
he would be discussing a shot talking to me
but when he had to shoot
i could see the change in attitude every time
he went from nice guy/ casual
to
he was all business/eye of the tiger/intense concentration
it was part of his PSR
to turn on the switch and get ready to do business

 

[Zerksies]

Ever notice that when you miss an easy shot that the CB ends up in a really good position for the next shot? You have to execute the shot you're on before the next one. When I catch myself doing this it really irritates me. After getting my emotions (irritation) under control I like to think "be deliberate" as one of the last steps of my PSR. You have to execute each shot fully and deliberately before the next one.

At times this takes a lot of focus, especially if you're tired from long waits or play during tournaments. It takes endurance. It's easy to just whack balls and not be deliberate. Sometimes you get away with it, but often a miss is because you lost focus on actually shooting the one you're on.

If you pocketed the ball the cue ball would not end up in that exact position. It could be close but not that position.

I don't know how many times i see new players go "I got perfect shape, I just missed the ball" if you pocketed the ball you would not have that perfect shape you are thinking.

Honestly this is one of them topics that is good for Doctor Dave.

 

[dquarasr]

If you pocketed the ball the cue ball would not end up in that exact position. It could be close but not that position.

I don't know how many times i see new players go "I got perfect shape, I just missed the ball" if you pocketed the ball you would not have that perfect shape you are thinking.

Honestly this is one of them topics that is good for Doctor Dave.

Exactly. I think this is pretty funny when I hear it.

The only way they can say that is if they rattled a ball. Missed it by 1/2 diamond or more? Yeah, no.

Hell, I’ve made a ball and not gotten shape because I didn’t cheat the pocket correctly. Miss a shot by a lot and land perfectly? Nope, ya wouldn’t have if you made the shot.

 

[boogieman]

If you pocketed the ball the cue ball would not end up in that exact position. It could be close but not that position.

I don't know how many times i see new players go "I got perfect shape, I just missed the ball" if you pocketed the ball you would not have that perfect shape you are thinking.

Honestly this is one of them topics that is good for Doctor Dave.

That's what I'm getting at. You got perfect leave but put more attention onto the leave than actually cinching the object ball. If you had focused on making the ball you might have a bit worse leave, which would be much much better than missing the OB and letting your opponent shoot.

 

[z0nt0n3r]

My experience with missed easy shots is that they usually occur when the player isn't 100% clear on what they want to do with the cue ball. All it takes is a hair of indecision to distract you enough to lose focus on the shot. If you haven't made up your mind yet, then don't get down on the shot, even if it's a hanger --- or get back up if you're already down. It'll turn into a crap-shoot if you start strategizing when you're already down.

Another reason for a missed easy shot is that the player already made the shot in his head and forgot to go through the proper routine to execute it because he's down on the shot and thinking of the next shot.

yes, i agree i think for me the most common reasons for missing easy balls are : focusing more on the position for the next ball rather than the shot itself or not commiting fully on what i want to do with the CB. also another thing to note is if you are very anxious in a match, this will lower your ability to concentrate fully, thus making you prone to missing easy balls/missing position or playing careless safeties, so anxiety and concentration can affect each other.

now the rest of the balls that i will miss in a set (medium-hard difficulty), are missed due to lack of practice/playing time and skill level/experience in my opinion. as far as fundamentals go, i have done everything that i can to perfect them over the last few years and i don't expect any major improvement in this area, except maybe a few minor tweaks. i was an incosistent player for a long time but after years of experimenting, i have found my ideal stance/alignment which now makes me a consistent player. in a race to 9 i will usually miss 3-5 balls on a good day and 7-10 balls on a bad day. i don't think that's bad for someone who isn't a professional and i definitely have room for improvement, so i think the best strategy for me right now is just work on my concentration/anxiety during matches, increase my practice/playing time and not mess around with fundamentals anymore.

 

[z0nt0n3r]

Problem is probably same what i have. You identify shot in your mind easy ball and use half ass focus because of that.
It happens more in tournaments because your focus is more intense so we players want relax after hard shots and totally think we always make ball anyway and we then don´t give it attention that EVERY shot need.
I make this too much nowadays and it drives me crazy.
Sometimes we crack under pressure but then you should be able to tell which one was to fault. Be honest to yourself and good luck.

agree 100%

 

[z0nt0n3r]

While this was somewhat tongue in cheek, it was also correct.

We have no way of knowing what @z0nt0n3r 's problem is. Maybe he has a floppy bridge that works OK when there is no pressure. Maybe he plays equally well in practice as in tournaments but doesn't remember his practice misses. We don't know.

Most players who have never had competent instruction have something in their fundamentals that's holding them back. I think that has to be in-person instruction to really be effective. It is really hard for people to see themselves and their flaws.

My advice to the OP: video record yourself in practice. Look at it critically. Record yourself in matches. If possible, get someone to help you look at yourself, such as an instructor.

yes, i will record myself again both in practice and in tournament play to see if i can spot something as i haven't done this in over a year but i don't think i need any major changes anymore, probably a few minor tweaks in my technique.

 

[tomatoshooter]

I like to think "be deliberate" as one of the last steps of my PSR

When does a pre shot routine end? I know when I think "be deliberate" on the final stroke I miss. I struggle with focusing in maintaining focus.

There was this switch that got thrown when the stories ended and he stepped to the table to take a shot. It was an eye opener.

i took lessons with demetrius jelatis goes by tinman here on AZB
same thing
he would be discussing a shot talking to me
but when he had to shoot
i could see the change in attitude every time
he went from nice guy/ casual
to
he was all business/eye of the tiger/intense concentration
it was part of his PSR
to turn on the switch and get ready to do business

Yeah I need to learn to turn on the concentration. I also think it's important to be able to fail out back when not shooting because maintain the high level of focus is grueling. I played a game with a guy and when it was done, I felt like I had taken the SAT, bar exam, medical boards, and PE exam in 15 minutes. I did win. I couldn't tell you my name for a while afterwards, but I did win.

 

[boogieman]

When does a pre shot routine end? I know when I think "be deliberate" on the final stroke I miss. I struggle with focusing in maintaining focus.

Personally I like to think it as soon as my bridge hand feels the weave of the cloth. You still have to settle into place. Just ease into it basically.

 

[tomatoshooter]

Personally I like to think it as soon as my bridge hand feels the weave of the cloth. You still have to settle into place. Just ease into it basically.

I guess it's terminology, but I thought it was everything before the cue touches the cue ball.

 

[FranCrimi]

I guess it's terminology, but I thought it was everything before the cue touches the cue ball.

Pre shot --- meaning 'before shot,' means everything up to the point where you begin your routine that hits the ball. The actual point the pre shot ends and the final begins, can be slightly different for different players. Some players begin by shifting their vision while in the set position to the object ball. That is not part of the pre shot routine, but part of the final execution routine. For others who don't shift their eyes first --- it begins with the pull back of the final execution stroke.

 

[boogieman]

I guess it's terminology, but I thought it was everything before the cue touches the cue ball.

Well here's my thought on it, bear with me, I'll try not to ramble but can't promise anything.

While up I am planning what I want to happen. Checking which balls go into which pockets, where a carom will take a ball, the natural CB route, tangents, rolling ball angles, how I can modify that if needed with speed or spin, how to protect the CB if it's a low probability (2 way), or just figure a straight up safety. Nerd out as much or as little as is your personal style. I then figure out which ball I'd like to shoot next, with the most leeway to get into a decent zone, on the correct side etc. Basically if playing good I want to decide EVERYTHING while up. This takes focus and patience which at times is my biggest hurdle. My head just ain't naturally made for focusing but pool is good practice.

I watch the OB and CB in peripheral, when it's correct in my eyesight with a balanced body (the dance) I get down on the shot, already having in mind exactly what I want to "put on" the CB. The stance will change slightly depending on where you strike the CB, so it's best to decide that stuff while up.

I start getting into position and as soon as my hand touches/slides/feels the cloth no more planning. Shut up head! It's all about execution at this point. I may take a few practice strokes to get a feel for the speed I wanted, is my grip feeling right/is my ring finger taking the lead, and I'll mostly always feather the cue to tell if I'm driving it in a straight line. If it wavers you're not right. You want a smooth, non wavering shaft on feather strokes so you can drive the tip at least a few inches through the CB, but likely more like 4-6". Waver is mostly in the grip hand. I try to strongly imagine/visualize the OB going directly into the heart of the pocket. If it looks off, it is off. You have to see the shot or you're taking a major chance. If it's off get back up etc... the point is, "see" it happen before you shoot it... imagination. It will look right or it will look wrong. Get so it looks right or as right as you can make it on a bad day.

Then you execute the shot while watching what happens. Even if you know it's 110% dead you still watch. You might not realize it consciously but you are picking up things like how the balls react at that particular table, how the cloth and rails react. It's all info and you should let your body take in any info it can. Don't handicap it, let it see stuff. Walk around the table, look at multiple angles etc. It's all important even though your thinking mind might not want to "waste time" doing so.

When I'm struggling with things like follow through, punching balls, poking balls, spin not taking, I may tell myself "deliberate stroke" or "shoot deliberately" when I pause at the CB before my final stroke. That thought has to vanish before executing, quite eyes, quiet mind. It sounds silly but it's like a "who's on first" bit to yourself, sometimes I gotta talk the dumbass into deliberately stroking when it isn't coming natural. Now once you're in stroke the pep talks usually don't have to happen. Pool is 90% mental and honestly at times it feels like it might be a short trip to the loony bin.

Pre shot --- meaning 'before shot,' means everything up to the point where you begin your routine that hits the ball. The actual point it begins can be slightly different for different players. Some players begin by shifting their vision while in the set position to the object ball. That is not part of the pre shot routine, but part of the final execution routine. For others who don't shift their eyes first --- it begins with the pull back of the final execution stroke.

Amen!

It's possibly a weakness in my game but I can't really tell you precisely where my PSR ends. I'm consistent in it so I figure it's not really important to know the dead precise analytical specifics but I know after I feather and my breath is right I'm in execution mode. If I were to guess my PSR ends at the pause at the CB before the back stroke, but while down the "PSR" stuff is quite minor. More about gliding into execution mode. The final steps of PSR are just very little things, quiet eye etc. Breathwork/exhaling has upped my consistency.

If I'm having a bad pain day I'll breath out and watch the tip at CB pause until it's dead still to shoot the shot. It's so silly, like watching a dousing rod. You can see the bodily tension melt away in the tip/ferrule. It's not something I'd recommend to anyone, but dealing with bad pain days sometimes need a band aid to play decently. Confirm and shoot.