My Speed Control Drill

klockdoc said:
It is a button on th right side of my steering wheel. When I get to the requested speed. I push the "ON" button....:D
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While I appreciate you sense of humor, I suspect that most readers have no clue about speed control and are looking for that magic button. They typically only think about where they want the cue ball to stop. They don't know what they control to make that happen, and instead play by feel alone. It's not surprising when these players miss their intended shape.

The speed necessary to move the object ball and the cue ball to where the shooter intends varies based on several factors such as the thickness of the hit, and the spin on the cue ball. Every shot is unique. The player has to accurately estimate the speed necessary, and then execute the shot at the desired speed. That's a tall order considering that the number of speeds that could be used is infinite. Experience alone is not the best approach to learning speed control. Understanding how to control speed, and using drills that develop a large number of speeds over a wide range, will develop a players speed control quickly.
 
I like this drill compared to others

av84fun said:
"Somehow... neither of these shots look like short distances to me."

Thanks for posting the table layout. It made your comments more clear.

I didn't assume that you were referring to shots involving 5-7 diamond CB roll distances since the probability of success is fairly low unless the table is dead level and free of chalk bits.

I agree that rolling up to the 1-8 is pretty easy. Bumping the 9 is much more difficult...again, on "typical" pool hall table conditions due to the super slow roll necessary on the CB.

But you might have missed my point somewhat which was that such shots as you describe come up fairly infrequently...maybe one rack in 10 if not more. On the contrary, the need to control CB roll distance and direction after OB contact comes up on practically every shot...even on the 8 or 9 to avoid scratching.

So, my point was that with fairly limited practice time that most of us have available, far better IMHO to practice shots that will come up at a ratio of 50-1 or more. That means practicing drills that involve sending the CB to a specific spot after OB contact ...which is obviously what getting shape is all aboutand to a lesser extent, practicing sending the CB and OB to specific spots as is often the objective in safety play.

BTW, I am an old Glen Ellyn guy who also lived in CS. Have one at the Golden Bee for me!!

Regards,
Jim
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Well said Jim. That's a good point about the long slow shots coming up 1 in 10 games... and then compound that with a true/dead level/clean table... now we're lookin' at odds of 50-1... of these shots being practical.
I completely agree on that.
There's definitely many other things that a person can work on...

The reason I dislike doing most drills is you take 1-4 strokes, and then reset the entire drill... back to square 1. The thing that I like about this drill the most is that I take 15 or 16 shots... and then I reset. It's like playing a league night of 9 ball, or a league night of 14.1
1 night you get 2 or three games of 9 strokes (at the most)... another night you get to run 50+ balls for the same price.

Same sort of concept with the drills.


I've never been to the golden bee... but if I find myself there, I'll have one with you in mind... without a doubt.
 
av84fun said:
Under playing conditions, the only shot I can think of where cue ball speed...in and of itself...matters is the lag.

All other shots that I can think of (and I may be missing something) involve controling the distance and/or direction of the CB after it has struck an OB.
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Here's another way of looking at the situation : If you cannot control the initial velocity of the cue ball, how can you expect any control of the cueball velocity after impact ? The real-game situation is worth focusing on, for sure, but thinking that the initial conditions have no effect on the final outcome is simply wrong. Don't think that I am ignoring the effects of cueball-spin-at-impact and the 'fullness' of the hit, I am not ... I just know that you must hit the shot at the correct speed to get the desired results. If you do not have control over the initial velocity of the cueball then it will be difficult to get your expected results.

Remember, this is only a drill, which is an exercise to develop a skill, and that skill in this instance is learning how to hit the cueball at a specific speed. Saying that any particular drill is "not like a game" is wrong-thinking and suggests that the speaker does not fully understand the difference between "practice" and "competition". If a particular drill teaches a skill that is not used in a game, well that is a horse of a different coloUr, but this drill (the one DCP poo-poos) does teach a valuable skill, the ability to control the intial speed of the cueball.

I do another similar drill, where I hit lags (2-table-length-speed). The big difference is that I do these with a drag stroke, and the trick is to wear off the bottom at specific points up the table. There is no object ball involved, and yet this drill teaches the skill needed for the feel of various lengths of drag-draw shots. Once you have this drill down, the drag-draw shots with all their position options become quite straightforward.

Dave
 
DaveK said:
I do another similar drill, where I hit lags (2-table-length-speed). The big difference is that I do these with a drag stroke, and the trick is to wear off the bottom at specific points up the table. There is no object ball involved, and yet this drill teaches the skill needed for the feel of various lengths of drag-draw shots. Once you have this drill down, the drag-draw shots with all their position options become quite straightforward.

Dave
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interesting. believe i will work on this some. thanks for sharing Dave.

DCP
 
Dave..."If you cannot control the initial velocity of the cue ball, how can you expect any control of the cueball velocity after impact ? "

I understand your point of view Dave. But my point is that controling the CB (alone) to a two diamond distance, for example, has nothing to do with controling it for 2 diamond distance after impact OB impact. And besides, rolling the CB without OB impact is a foul!

Sure, controling CB distance (alone) is a skill and therefore can be practiced but with highly limited expecptions, controling CB speed (alone) has no practical application in playing pool.

Let me mention a drill I use that will possibly help to illustrate my point.

I place an OB in front of the right side pocket (when facing the head rail) about an inch from the jaw opening and place the CB an inch from the rail at the second diamond off the foot rail.

I shoot the down-the-rail corner pocket shot and attempt to control the CB roll distance in one diamond increments (within a 1/2 ball diameter tolerance...i.e. some part of the CB is on the line extending from the target diamond.

The head rail = 4 diamonds of roll and 5 diamonds would be a one diamond rebound back off the head rail.

After 4 diamonds, I give myself 2 ball widths tolerance...i.e. either the back or front edge of the CB must touch the diamond line...or VERY nearly so.

I can control the CB to within my tolerances through 6 diamonds of roll 85-90% of the time.

Then, I move the OB a ball width to the left and shoot the same drill but of course, there will be more CB roll when cutting the OB vs. hitting it square, so I need to adjust.

I first do the drill consecutively and then vary the roll...such as 1 diamond, then 3, then 5 then two etc.

THAT is the CB distance control I choose to drill on because, as noted above, controling the CB only...which certainly a skill as you point out...is not a skill that has much of an application in actual play.

Finally, a related drill I use is identical to the above except my mission is to contril the OB distance not the CB distance and doing so obviously requires an entirely different CB speed.

This drill is applicable to developing true pocket speed which is often crucial and is also critical for safety play where you need to send the OB to a specific spot.

Lastly, I set up 10-15 degree cut shots and try to control the LATERAL CB distance on draw shots. I am MUCH less accurate on lateral draw distances beyond 2 diamonds as would most people.

Taking this to the game table, if I need to pocket a shot and roll the CB, say 3 diamonds of distance...I KNOW what my 3 diamond distance shot is (easing off on my pace depending on the cut angle.

I guess my point is ...bottom line...there are very few drills I am aware of that don't translate directly to shots in a pool game and rolling the CB (alone...without OB impact) except for the lag...has so few actual applications in playing pool (because doing so is a foul) that I would rather practice drills that DO have practical applications.

Regards,
Jim
 
DaveK said:
If you cannot control the initial velocity of the cue ball, how can you expect any control of the cueball velocity after impact ?
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av84fun said:
Sure, controling CB distance (alone) is a skill and therefore can be practiced but with highly limited expecptions, controling CB speed (alone) has no practical application in playing pool.
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Both skills are necessary to develop accurate speed control.

Speed control is essentially learning to accurately move the cue forward in a range of speeds from 'soft' to 'hard'. The more speeds in the range of speeds that can be repeated with accuracy, the better the speed control will be. Using a cue ball only drill, as DaveK suggests, is very effective is developing the skills needed to accurately move the cue at the desired speeds.

Every shot is different. A player needs to learn to estimate the speed necessary for the shot at hand. The thickness of the hit is a key variable that affects the distance that the object ball(s) and cue ball travel after contact. The drills that av84fun suggests can significantly shorten the time necessary to learn estimate the speed necessary for a given shot.

Developing speed control with the cue ball only drill first will be a huge benefit when learning what speeds are necessary for a given shot.
 
Hi Mark,

Thanks for your insights.

"Speed control is essentially learning to accurately move the cue forward in a range of speeds from 'soft' to 'hard'. "

Right. No argument there. But as I stated, except in the extremely rare instances I mentioned, moving the cue ball any given distance without contacting another ball is not only irrelevant to the game but is a foul.

What MATTERS, is moving the CB a given distance after it contacts an OB and/or moving the OB a given distance after it is struck by the CB.

Without question, the skill necessary to accomplish the above MUST result from accurate CB speed control.

IMHO, we should spend our time drilling on skills that will actually be called upon in the game so I repeat...

1. With RARE exceptions, controlling CB travel without contacting an OB is irrelevant to the game and would be a foul and;
2. Controling CB distance AFTER contacting an OB is the HEART AND SOUL of shape which is the heart and soul of winning.
3. Controling OB distance after being struck by the CB is a REQUIRED skill in saftey play and results from skillful CB pace. BUT....when attempting to send the OB a given distance, the drill should focus on THAT skill and not the skill of sending the CB a given distance without contacting an OB.

EXCEPTION to the rule (my rule) (-:

I can see that learning to control the CB travel (alone) in 1 ball width increments would have significant value over VERY short distances...say 1 diamond. That skill would come up occasionally when VERY close in safeties are being attempted wherein you need to confine both CB and OB travel to VERY small distances.

But controling CB distance, in and of itself, over about 1 diamond has no practical application that translates to the game...whereas controlling CB and/or OB travel AFTER OB contact is utterly fundamental to the game.

All the above is merely IMHO and is presented with great respect.

Regards,
Jim
 
Mark Avlon said:
Developing speed control with the cue ball only drill first will be a huge benefit when learning what speeds are necessary for a given shot.
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It simplifies the learning process to start with basic skills and progress to more advanced skills. As we take each step, we can focus on what's new and have confidence that errors are due to the new skill being learned, not what we have already learned.

If we first learn to move the cue ball at various speeds from 'soft' to 'hard' using the cue ball only, we have eliminated variables that can confuse the results. We can focus on moving our arm at the desired speed and the results are directly tied to that action. When our margin of error decreases, we can then take the next step, learning how the fullness of the hit affects the distances the cue ball and object ball(s) travel. When we learn this, we will have confidence that the initial speed was the desired speed, within our small margin of error, and that the variation in the results is due to other factors.
 
klockdoc said:
It is a button on th right side of my steering wheel. When I get to the requested speed. I push the "ON" button....:D
Click to expand...

And Cruise control is when Oprah told Tom to sit back down on the couch.

Jeff Livingston
 
Again, thanks for your views Mark. I guess we're going to have to agree to disagree on this one since we are just repeating our respective positions.

I'll just leave you with the opinion the CB distance and direction control is THE most fundamental skill in pool with the exception of shot making (since if you don't make the shot, you don't get to shoot again).

Practicing distance/direction control after OB impact obviously is practice on a vital skill that translates directly to CORE skills.

FAR better to spend time on controling the CB...in a manner that actually occurs in the game, than to spend time rolling the CB alone.

In either case, Mark, controlling CB speed is at the heart of the drill. But in my version, the CB is controlled as it would be in a game whereas, in your version, the CB is controlled in a way that would rarely be of value in a game situation.

I submit to you that a given player, in a given amount of time, would become equally proficient at CB speed control in either your scenario or mine.

But at the end of that time, the player practicing your version would have to start all over again to learn how the CB travels after OB impact.

Regards,
Jim
 
Learning to not fight the cue ball for shape will have a far greater return on speed control than drilling.

Use more center ball. It is far easier to judge the speed because you can slow down your stroke and feel what you're doing rather than juicing up some ball and expecting the same results each time.

That is the benefit of center ball over using english. You do not want to force the cue ball around. This is how pin-point position (speed control) can be acheived.
 
av84fun said:
I understand your point of view Dave. But my point is that controling the CB (alone) to a two diamond distance, for example, has nothing to do with controling it for 2 diamond distance after impact OB impact. And besides, rolling the CB without OB impact is a foul!
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Jim, there are no fouls in practice. Practice is a time to learn and improve. Fouls are part of a game between competitors.

And generally speaking, for any given shot the cue ball (and object ball) will travel further if the cue ball is hit harder, which is very far from "nothing to do with controlling" the cue ball. "How hard you hit the cue ball" is why one might consider the exercise.

av84fun said:
I guess my point is ...bottom line...there are very few drills I am aware of that don't translate directly to shots in a pool game and rolling the CB (alone...without OB impact) except for the lag...has so few actual applications in playing pool (because doing so is a foul) that I would rather practice drills that DO have practical applications.
Click to expand...

Drills are designed to help out technique. How does stroking-through-the-neck-of-a-bottle relate to a game of pool ? It doesn't ! (It's a foul to lay a coke bottle on the table :eek: ;) ) Does that mean the lessons from this drill are not beneficial ? I spent years doing Mach-exercises, a set of drills created by Gerard Mach to improve running technique. These drills are designed to reinforce technique while building speed and strength, but they are certainly not 'running'. The benefits from these drills were very apparent. Of course Coach Lyle did not let us slack off on our real-running workouts, he knew that all of the drills and practice endeavors were needed to develop properly.

Dave
 
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