North American Event

[cardiac kid]

Hi Folks,

While talking to several players at the Turning Stone this weekend, I got the impression that spots were being held for players at the NAO. I looked at the brackets this morning. Each of the players I spoke with show forfeits at the Pittsburgh event. I sure hope they know they are starting on the "B" side. JAM, are you out there? Please let me know whats going on. I chose not to go.

 

[JAM]

Hi Folks,

While talking to several players at the Turning Stone this weekend, I got the impression that spots were being held for players at the NAO. I looked at the brackets this morning. Each of the players I spoke with show forfeits at the Pittsburgh event. I sure hope they know they are starting on the "B" side. JAM, are you out there? Please let me know whats going on. I chose not to go.

Hi, Cardiac Kid! Ryan McCreesh will show a forfeit at the NAOT. Due to the weather forecast and the fact that he was in the finals at the Joss Tour late Sunday evening, he elected not to travel to Pittsburgh and returned home.

I'm not sure about the other forfeits.

JAM

 

[nfty9er]

??

Hi, Cardiac Kid! Ryan McCreesh will show a forfeit at the NAOT. Due to the weather forecast and the fact that he was in the finals at the Joss Tour late Sunday evening, he elected not to travel to Pittsburgh and returned home.

I'm not sure about the other forfeits.

JAM

Including Keith's?

 

[JAM]

Including Keith's?

Keith didn't enter the UPA-sanctioned NAOT tournament. As it turned out, the logistics were too difficult to work out, a 6-hour drive from Turning Stone Casino to Pittsburgh with bad weather on the horizon.

I am kind of surprised the brackets has Keith's name in them. I did speak to the promoter Jim Dawson several weeks ago about this event, but after discussing the logistical problems of travel, we elected not to go. Some of the Turning Stone competitors who were planning on going to the NAOT tournament made arrangements with Scott Smith, the TD, to have their matches scheduled at a later time. Ryan McCreesh was planning on going to the NAOT, but since he was in the finals of the Turning Stone tournament which didn't end until after 8:00 p.m., Sunday, he couldn't catch a ride in time to get there, and then there was the problem with the snow storm. Mike Davis got knocked out of the Turning Stone event early and left immediately for Pittsburgh.

I am looking forward to reading more about this event. Is the V-Bookie going to post some matches?

JAM

 

[nfty9er]

Keith didn't enter the UPA-sanctioned NAOT tournament. As it turned out, the logistics were too difficult to work out, a 6-hour drive from Turning Stone Casino to Pittsburgh with bad weather on the horizon.

I am kind of surprised the brackets has Keith's name in them. I did speak to the promoter Jim Dawson several weeks ago about this event, but after discussing the logistical problems of travel, we elected not to go. Some of the Turning Stone competitors who were planning on going to the NAOT tournament made arrangements with Scott Smith, the TD, to have their matches scheduled at a later time. Ryan McCreesh was planning on going to the NAOT, but since he was in the finals of the Turning Stone tournament which didn't end until after 8:00 p.m., Sunday, he couldn't catch a ride in time to get there, and then there was the problem with the snow storm. Mike Davis got knocked out of the Turning Stone event early and left immediately for Pittsburgh.

I am looking forward to reading more about this event. Is the V-Bookie going to post some matches?

JAM

I knew that. lol. Thats what I figured, a tough combination two tournaments like that expecially going from one at a casino where sleep is not the order of the day. But I will bet Brian Mahan is happy Keith was kept on the board as it gave him a free win.

 

[JAM]

I knew that. lol. Thats what I figured, a tough combination two tournaments like that expecially going from one at a casino where sleep is not the order of the day. But I will bet Brian Mahan is happy Keith was kept on the board as it gave him a free win.

Keith would have been a tired pup if he had to play at NAOT after the Turning Stone Casino tournament. This environment of non-stop action kept quite a few of the pool players at the craps table, the poker room, and blackjack booths all night long.

I'm kind of surprised to see a forfeit by Jim Marino from Pittsburgh. If this is the same Jim Marino, he owns a pool room there and should be a local. Did they get a lot of snow in Pittsburgh, does anybody know? Mother Nature does have a tendency to be an occupational hazard for the professional pool player, whether you drive or fly in.

Sugar Shane of Pittsburgh was at the Turning Stone tourney and was going to give Ryan McCreesh a ride to the NAOT in Pittsburgh, but when he called home and heard about the blizzard, he had to leave Verona, NY early. Ryan played in the finals at the Joss event, which didn't end until after 8:00 p.m. on Sunday.

Group shot at Turning Stone: Keith, Mark Hatch (Dennis Hatch's uncle), Second Place finisher Ryan "Genie Man" McCreesh, Sugar Shane, and Jeff White.

JAM

 

[Michael Webb]

Hi Jam
As always nice to see you and Keith. Maybe some day the NAOT will think of existing events instead of over booking.

 

[JAM]

Hi Jam
As always nice to see you and Keith. Maybe some day the NAOT will think of existing events instead of over booking.

Hi, Mike! We sure did have some fun sweating a few matches on the rail, especially the Earthquake vs. Frankie Hernandez! (LOL)

I believe there should be a central tournament registery established, maybe to prevent this from happening. It's a shame scheduling conflicts come into play because players sometimes are unable to compete in two great events like the $15,000-added Turning Stone Casino Classic IV and the second leg of the UPA-sanctioned and Hilton-sponsored $20,000-added NAOT in Pittsburgh, due to logistical problems and the like.

It is curious that most of the UPA events are scheduled at the exact same time as other independently promoted tournaments.

Keith never got the chance to bring his cue to you for repair on the Irish linen wrap. The casino and all of its sundry games kept his interests piqued, and after a few nice rolls on the craps table, believe it or not, we managed to come home winner.

Picture of Michael Webb of Webb Custom Cues and Keith consulting about a loose wrap problem on Keith's cue.

JAM

 

[cardiac kid]

Hi Jam
As always nice to see you and Keith. Maybe some day the NAOT will think of existing events instead of over booking.

Hi Mike,

I think the blame for this fiasco lies directly at the feet of the UPA, period. All the conversations that I've had with players and especially JAM, the people at the NAOT tried to bend over backwards. Their director appears to have done everything he could to assist potential entries. It is my understanding, and would someone with better information please correct me, the NAOT was told to place that event on that weekend by the UPA. We both know Mike Z very well. He is not vindictive. He posted his schedule months before the NAOT came into being. No tour can exist for long without the support of field fillers like myself.

 

[tonyc]

Jim Dawson and the Hilton hotels do the schedule for these events as far as i know the upa has not got a great deal of say as to when there held, Its mainly down to the hilton who are trying to fill hotel rooms,
As for Jim dawson, he is new to promoting events and is still trying to figure out how pool player minds work?????????, he did do his best to help the guys that wanted to play both events and has actually got to pay for the players that didnt turn up. So go easy before you all start bashing him over the clash of events.
Tony Crosby

 

[cardiac kid]

Hi TonyC,

I understand you know an old friend of mine and mentor, Pat Howey. He plays out of CM Lee's room in Tampa. Anyway, your comments about Mr. Dawson are correct as far as I know. In conversation with others in the know, including Mr. Zuglan, the UPA requested to have the event start on Sunday. They knew about the Turning Stone and chose to place the NAOT event opposite it. If Mr. Dawson did not have a UPA sanction for the event, he would not be guaranteed the participation of the top 32 players. This is not the first time this situation has arisen in the Northeast.

Tony, the Northeastern US at this time of the year is hit and miss as far as travel by car. Although Santos and Mike Davis made it to Pittsburgh, some others chose not to risk their lives in a "Northeaster". There are a limited number of players up here to support two events of the same caliber on the same weekend. If Mr. Dawson chose this weekend without understanding the ramifications of the Turning Stone event, he won't do it again. If he was forced to accept the timeframe, perhaps he needs to rethink the entire tour and the dates. 61 players in Pittsburgh with Cleveland, Phili, DC and NYC all within a five hour drive is very, very sad. Mr. Zuglan could have filled a 128 player field if money for additional tables was available. The 96 player field was artificially limited with only twelve tables! I won my last match on the "A" side at 12:30 AM. My opponent played until after 5 AM on the "B" side. We started at 9:00 AM both mornings.

One additional comment. The original schedule called for the manditory players meeting to be Saturday night. If I had flown into Pittsburgh and was then told that my match would not be played until Monday morning to accomodate a player playing in another event, I would be livid! Two extra nights in a Hilton Hotel with the costs of additional meals, etc. is not acceptable to me. Others must also have felt that way.

 

[JustPlay]

With the exception of a schedule conflicts, playing at the NAOT is expensive.

The entry fee is reasonable, but the room rates are too much. $150 entry+ $100 per night @3 nights (give or take a day) + food + gas = about $600 mimimun before you even hit a ball. For spectators they can room at any hotel, but the hilton is forcing players to stay at their place.

They need better rates to attact more players and spectators. This is the key factor for low turnout at these events.

 

[JAM]

Jim Dawson and the Hilton hotels do the schedule for these events as far as i know the upa has not got a great deal of say as to when there held, Its mainly down to the hilton who are trying to fill hotel rooms,
As for Jim dawson, he is new to promoting events and is still trying to figure out how pool player minds work?????????, he did do his best to help the guys that wanted to play both events and has actually got to pay for the players that didnt turn up. So go easy before you all start bashing him over the clash of events.
Tony Crosby

Tony, I agree about Jim Dawson, and when the UPA approached him at the last U.S. Open and negotiated a deal for the NAOT to have their first two tournaments sanctioned, he accepted their kind offer. It should have been a win-win for all parties involved.

As far as Jim Dawson having to pay for the players that didn't turn up, Ryan McCreesh's entry fee was paid in advance, and he was looking forward to going. He came in second place at the Turning Stone Casino Classic IV and didn't finish up until after 8:00 p.m. on Sunday. With no ride to Pittsburgh and a snow blizzard in effect, he had to return home with us.

I spoke to Jim Dawson well in advance about Keith competing at the UPA-sanctioned NAOT tourney Pittsburgh. Jim was doing everything possible to accommodate the players who wanted to play in both events and told them to contact Scott Smith, the TD, so that he could have their matches scheduled at a later time. Keith and I elected not to go because of the potential of hazardous driving conditions in that part of the country, a 6-hour drive under normal conditions. Keith did not pay his entry fee in advance, never called Scott Smith to make arrangements because we decided not to go, and I'm actually kind of miffed as why his name is on the tournament chart, especially as a forfeit.

As far as the clash of events, currently MANY of UPA-sanctioned tournaments are being held at the same time as independently promoted events, coincidentally or intentionally.

The World Summit of Pool held in NYC in November was scheduled on the same dates as the 8-Ball event held in the UAE, 2 years in a row.

The Bicycle season finale of the UPA Tour held in Los Angeles has occurred on the same dates as JOB's Music City Open, a major event that has happened on the same dates for 18 years now.

The Capital City Classic tournament in D.C. was posted on the UPA website last year to transpire on the same dates as Mike Zuglan's $25,000-added Joss Tour season finale held in Portland, Maine. The promoter of the Capital City Classic, a good friend of mine, said he had not scheduled any tournament at that time and had no knowledge as to why the UPA posted the conflicting dates.

The first two events of the NAOT, UPA-sanctioned tournaments, were held on the SAME dates as other events. This is why only 43 players showed up in Destin, Florida (IMO). It looks to me as if there are less than 60 players in Pittsburgh if you take into account the forfeits.

Some players are not happy with the current state of affairs relating to the UPA. Jose Parica told me this past weekend that he is not a UPA member anymore. Shawn Putnam has been quoted as saying he will not attend any more UPA events with the alternate-break format. The UPA, the governing body of professional pool, has a ranking system which is flawed when it uses the BCA Open, one of six tournaments on its tour. The ranking sysetm is what qualifies UPA touring pros to compete in high-profile events. If a UPA member is not one of the 32 Americans afforded the opportunity to compete in the BCA Open, then he receives no ranking points, and the 32 players who do receive the UPA ranking points will always be the highest ranked.

There are some political issues that have taken place at the inception of the UPA which ruffled quite a few feathers. Rather than dwell on the past, it's time to move forward. Hopefully, the UPA will continue to get stronger by providing a good product, namely professional players of the highest caliber like you, Tony.

Good luck to you in Pittsburgh!

JAM