One Pocket ?

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larryt

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Oponents ball between the jaws of his pocket, your turn, what is the donwside of fouling by double hitting the cue ball and leaving it between the jaws, instead of following it in to have his ball and one of yours spotted. Thanks Larry T On rereading the One pocket rules I found the oponents ball is not spotted on this type of foul. Could not figure out how to delete the message completely.
 
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larryt said:
Oponents ball between the jaws of his pocket, your turn, what is the donwside of fouling by double hitting the cue ball and leaving it between the jaws, instead of following it in to have his ball and one of yours spotted. Thanks Larry T On rereading the One pocket rules I found the oponents ball is not spotted on this type of foul. Could not figure out how to delete the message completely.
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quite a few tourneys play that as loss of game.
 
larryt said:
Oponents ball between the jaws of his pocket, your turn, what is the donwside of fouling by double hitting the cue ball and leaving it between the jaws, instead of following it in to have his ball and one of yours spotted. Thanks Larry T On rereading the One pocket rules I found the oponents ball is not spotted on this type of foul. Could not figure out how to delete the message completely.
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Maybe I'm not reading the question right. Why would you have to double hit? Often, if my opponent has a ball in the jaws of his own pocket, I will make it for him. This lets me control where the cue ball is for his next shot, rather than leaving him a duck that he can use to get shape on his next shot. Sometimes, giving up one point isn't all that bad, especially when it's a point you know your opponent is going to get sooner or later anyway.

Steve
 
Im confused why its a loss of game in a tourny?

I have seen guys do something similar in one pocket. Lets say the ball is not in the pocket but close and for some reason the opponent cant knock it in and scratch at the same time. I have seen a player purposely jump the object ball and the cue ball off the table. Two balls get spotted and ball in hand behind the kitchen. In a tourny would this be loss of game because you "purposely" fouled?
 
Wouldn't this situation depend whether this is the game ball? I would think that it may be wise to just follow the cb into the pocket or if possible send the cb off the table. My preference would be eventually leap and then to eventually leave 'you' a loong shot or try to wear your patience thin :grin-square:.
 
John Daminato said:
Im confused why its a loss of game in a tourny?

I have seen guys do something similar in one pocket. Lets say the ball is not in the pocket but close and for some reason the opponent cant knock it in and scratch at the same time. I have seen a player purposely jump the object ball and the cue ball off the table. Two balls get spotted and ball in hand behind the kitchen. In a tourny would this be loss of game because you "purposely" fouled?
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B/c its stroked illegally. You hit the CB and then hit it again which is an illegal stroke.

In jumping the balls off the table the stroke is a LEGAL STROKE, the double hit is an ILLEGAL HIT!

It's a pure cheat bullshit shot. Thats how we played the T-Town classic, and Gradys Gulf coast classic just to name a few.

hope that helps,
Grey Ghost
 
so what if your going to do a power draw and hit it too hard, jump the cue ball and object off the table...This just happens to be some how very advantages for you. Are you going to say, thats a illegal shot, not a foul, therefore you lose?

I agree with you...For the most part, an intentional illegal shot is total bullshit and It maybe considered some form of cheating, but there are some thin lines, like the one I just mentioned. It could be intentional it could be accidental. Some shots and traps cause players to take extreme measures and in doing so they make mistakes.
 
John Daminato said:
so what if your going to do a power draw and hit it too hard, jump the cue ball and object off the table...This just happens to be some how very advantages for you. Are you going to say, thats a illegal shot, not a foul, therefore you lose?

I agree with you...For the most part, an intentional illegal shot is total bullshit and It maybe considered some form of cheating, but there are some thin lines, like the one I just mentioned. It could be intentional it could be accidental. Some shots and traps cause players to take extreme measures and in doing so they make mistakes.
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I know what your saying but thats not nearly as obvious as the double tap. Only a 3speed does crap like that in one pocket, and they don't even play one pocket for that matter lol. Plus trying to jump the CB by scooping is a surefire way to not even jump it off the table much less make the OB...way harder to control than the true jump (not to be technical) in regards to trying to get the CB/OB to both jump off, or pocket OB + jump off CB. Not to mention that no one trying to save the game is going to try to draw out the CB with the game ball sitting on the shelf that would just make no sense at all.

Honestly i regard the double tap to this:

I played this NIT a couple months back at the white diamonds tourney some last pocket 8 ball. BCA rules no 3foul. Well i control the hell out of the game and i played a shot and drew my CB off MY ball and pocketed his ball. He has one ball left and shoots at the 8 and sits in dead center of the shelf of the pocket.....basically fouling to push the game to a stale mate so he didn't lose which was forth coming.

I said lets play 3 foul + purposely stale mating 8 ball like that was loss of game. He says no. I told him well then if you think you can only win by CHEATING, then F*k you I'm done, and that was that. Wouldn't piss on the guy if he was on fire now.

People who play the games like that should be beaten with a stick and banned from the game. Sorry for the expletives but situations like that really PISS me off. Its the game of kings not douche bags.

I pity the fools,
Grey Ghost
 
Grey Ghost I think your taking it too serious..."People should be beaten because they exploited a loop hole in the rules" LOL...come on! Didnt you ever hear the term, "Dont hate the player, hate the game" :wink: Who ever lays down the rules has a obligation to make sure he doesn't leave a loop hole like that to be used as a quasi cheat tactic. Another thing, who plays 8-ball last pocket:wink:...Im not saying its not a serious game when played well but its the type of game that breeds DRAMA...Plus it always has some unique rule that doesn't apply to any other game in pool and it has that rule always comes up at crunch time...

In most cases when people pull that shit, that opens the door for more un-ethical game play or CREATIVITY. You have to come to the conclusion that he learned from someone that did it to him to win. He is a product of his environment.

From his perspective maybe you cheated him by making your ball and drawing his ball into a pocket, forcing him to have that as his last pocket.
ME and you know its a great skillful strategy but, like I said his perspective is not the same as yours or mine.

The more I think about it, because he created a stale mate by laying up a ball deep in a pocket ( not always a easy shot to execute) I have to say, he took the chance of not having that ball drop in the pocket, I know you are going to hate me for this but maybe he did the right thing and its not cheating. Its exploitation of the loop hole....But I know from experience it damn well feels like you have been cheated.
 
lmao.... maybe i'm jaded or think outdated but at least i still got my self respect

John Daminato said:
Grey Ghost I think your taking it too serious..."People should be beaten because they exploited a loop hole in the rules" LOL...come on! Didnt you ever hear the term, "Dont hate the player, hate the game" :wink: Who ever lays down the rules has a obligation to make sure he doesn't leave a loop hole like that to be used as a quasi cheat tactic. Another thing, who plays 8-ball last pocket:wink:...Im not saying its not a serious game when played well but its the type of game that breeds DRAMA...Plus it always has some unique rule that doesn't apply to any other game in pool and it has that rule always comes up at crunch time...

In most cases when people pull that shit, that opens the door for more un-ethical game play or CREATIVITY. You have to come to the conclusion that he learned from someone that did it to him to win. He is a product of his environment.

From his perspective maybe you cheated him by making your ball and drawing his ball into a pocket, forcing him to have that as his last pocket.
ME and you know its a great skillful strategy but, like I said his perspective is not the same as yours or mine.

The more I think about it, because he created a stale mate by laying up a ball deep in a pocket ( not always a easy shot to execute) I have to say, he took the chance of not having that ball drop in the pocket, I know you are going to hate me for this but maybe he did the right thing and its not cheating. Its exploitation of the loop hole....But I know from experience it damn well feels like you have been cheated.
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I'll give it to you and the shooter, yes it was a crafty solution....just not a very sportsman like solution. I liken stuff like that to typical college frat fights. Two people of say equal size and skill have a beef with one another so each is planning to bust the other one up...except one of the guys shows up with 10 of his frat brothers (more like sisters lol) and they beat the loner down and then brag about how they kicked his butt. Thats a loop hole too. Would you ever go to a casino that found excuses/loop holes like this to keep from paying you the $500 you just won there?

Guy was just a NIT, hell we played one hole b/f that....was supposed to be on the 9' tight pockets giving him 10-6. He took too long so we had to play on the buckety 8'....and he wants the same weight...I said ITS NOT THE SAME GAME....its graded more to you now since its a smaller/easier table. I told him I'd give him 12-7 my break 12/8 on his....WOULD NOT PLAY ME, i just wanted to do something to not be bored out my skull so I gave him his 10-6 and had to really play tight to win the two games b/f he quit. Just one of those characters that wants to steal or be given money by some fish, and the dude shoots pretty descent too I'd say a weak to mid B player who can get out and he takes his time.

I don't know maybe I'm just jaded...but i always thought the point of matching up was to win a test of physical/mental skill/knowledge...and the money was just to back up your mouth and confidence. You bet b/c you think you can beat the opponent, not bet so you can scam the money off them. To me Nits, scammers, and cheaters of that sort must have a very crappy and unhealthy view and opinion of themselves. I mean come on thats got to eat away at your self confidence to know that you got to move on someone to get there. I guess I'm just not the kind of person that MUST WIN AT ANY AND ALL COSTS.


Sh*t like that will leave a black hole in your soul,
Grey Ghost
 
I always thought the point of playing for money was to "win money":cool:
I try never to make it a ego thing, like if you say "i really want to be this fcking guy and teach him a lesson..Thats ego, thats what got Hustler his thumbs broke...:eek: At the same time, rarely can I play to my full potential if there is not some kinda reward or money on the line, if not, Im just a little to careless...

Both players are going to set themselves up a game they feel they have a decent if not good chance to win. IF you know without almost a doubt that your going to win, well that dancing on the line of hustling or scamming, but you never know because the other guy might be doing the same thing.

There are guys that I play for money that Im almost a sure thing to win.
I don't think Im hustling them, they know me, they know my game, they make a choice. Its educational for them if I play cheap enough, especially in one pocket. One pocket is one of those games that is taught that way.
 
This is the official rule on Onepocket.org:

6.6 Intentional fouls are an accepted part of One Pocket tactics as long as they are played by use of a legal stroke, such as by lightly touching the cue ball with the cue tip; by rolling the cue ball to a new location without regard for legal contact with either an object ball or a cushion; by pocket scratching the cue ball; or by using a legal jump technique to force the cue ball off the table. However, if the acting official rules that a player has used an illegal technique to direct the cue ball or any object balls to a more desirable location, then the incoming player has the option of either playing the balls where they lie, or requesting the official to restore all such moved balls to their location prior to the illegal maneuver. The offending player is charged the standard one ball foul penalty, and in addition may be further penalized at the discretion of the acting official under the general rules of unsportsmanlike conduct
 
Hey well this makes a lot of sense...Illegal stroke: Move the balls back, a one ball foul...But not loss of game...
 
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