Practice Shaft vs Play Shaft

[Patrick Johnson]

I can get away with a slightly bad stroke on long straight shots with my 12.75 mm shaft but will miss with the 11.5 mm if the stroke is slightly bad.

That has nothing to do with the shaft itself - see this post for details:
https://forums.azbilliards.com/showthread.php?p=6572838#post6572838

Maybe it's the increased visibility you get hitting the cue ball with the thinner shaft.

I find that to be true with my 10mm tip.

I feel I have.a better chance pocketing a long straight shot with the 11.5 mm than the 12.75 mm.

That seems to contradict what you said first above.

Anyway, are you saying that if you hit the cue ball the EXACT spot for a spin shot, the thinner shaft will not give you more spin assuming the same tip curvature as the wider shaft?

Exactly what he's saying.

Yes, that's right. And even with different curvatures the difference is too tiny to matter.

A smaller tip WILL allow you to go further out before a miscue.

But I don't agree with this - for the same reason a thinner shaft will not give more spin. They're essentially the same tip, but with a tiny outer layer removed for the thinner shaft - that means the thinner tip's outer edge is closer to the tip's center, which would suggest the thicker tip should allow you to go further out before a miscue. But neither tip allows that.

pj
chgo

 

[garczar]

I find that to be true with my 10mm tip.


That seems to contradict what you said first above.



Yes, that's right. And even with different curvatures the difference is too tiny to matter.


But I don't agree with this - for the same reason a thinner shaft will not give more spin. They're essentially the same tip, but with a tiny outer layer removed for the thinner shaft - that means the thinner tip's outer edge is closer to the tip's center, which would suggest the thicker tip should allow you to go further out before a miscue. But neither tip allows that.

pj
chgo

Very cool. Good info here.

 

[hang-the-9]

--- dup -----

 

[VVP]

I find that to be true with my 10mm tip.


That seems to contradict what you said first above.



Yes, that's right. And even with different curvatures the difference is too tiny to matter.


But I don't agree with this - for the same reason a thinner shaft will not give more spin. They're essentially the same tip, but with a tiny outer layer removed for the thinner shaft - that means the thinner tip's outer edge is closer to the tip's center, which would suggest the thicker tip should allow you to go further out before a miscue. But neither tip allows that.

pj
chgo

Agree that it seems like a contradiction in my statements about the 12.75 mm shaft seeming to be more forgiving for the same bad stroke and the one where I said that I have a better chance of pocketing a long straight shot with a 11.5 mm shaft. I guess all I can say is one is a bad stroke and the other is a good stroke. With a good stroke and a thin cue you can be more sure visibly where you are hitting the cue ball.

 

[hang-the-9]

If you watch the local matches Efren plays in the Philippines you will see he has 3 full cues. One break cue and 2 playing cues. I will send a link to the video where he changed cue for a specific shot.

I would not base a whole training idea because of what Efren did in one shot you have seen. I have been watching him play for 30 years and can't remember a specific time I have seen him or any other player swap cues for a shot outside of a jump shot. And this is also not the same thing as practice vs play shaft even if someone swapped cues for every shot. It just means they like how a shaft plays for different shots not that they practice with something then swap to something else for a match.

If you want to use both shafts, sure, but that is not the same as your idea of practicing with one shaft then playing with another. I play with several shafts, but can't say I specifically put something aside to practice with, I just play with different shafts. Same way I swap full cues as times, really whatever I feel like playing with or have the most confidence with. The amount of times I have swapped cues in the middle of a tournament though, can't be more than 3-4 times in 30 years, and shafts not much more than that.

 

[VVP]

I have not seen players swap cues or shafts unless they are going to be jumping a ball. If it happened it's very very rare. I've seen may Efren matches and never seen him change cues for shots in the middle of a game. If you can pocket balls better with the thinner shaft then use that to play with.

Here is a video (there are many) which shows that Efren brings 3 cues to a game. If you watch the whole game you will see him change playing cue for a single shot.

I asked him why he uses 2 playing cues and he said one is 11.5 mm for specialty shots and the other is 12.5 mm for regular play. Just kidding I don't want to start a new craze.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xn9Zw5QAYkM&t=919s

 

[PoolBoy1]

LOL. Manufacturers would like us to have a shaft for each day of the week, while giving us the shaft!

 

[sbk510]

I dont have a "practice" anything, but I will say that your attention level is higher when you switch equipment.

Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk

 

[sbk510]

Understood, but I believe the thinner shaft could help increase your accuracy if your stroke needs working on, right?



In trap shooting you practice with a full choke because it has a tighter pattern and shoot in competition with a more open choke which gives you a bigger pattern. Similar logic I think can work in pool.

Tight pockets are the equivalent of a full choke. The gun is the same.

Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk

 

[LocalArtist]

I know a guy that does this in our local pool hall. I think he will forever be an APA 5 but has the skill set of a better player.

You're only setting yourself back by switching shafts.

 

[DelawareDogs]

Can practicing with an 11.5 mm shaft and playing 12.75 mm shaft hurt your play? I understand that the smaller diameter shaft can introduce more spin in your shots and maybe mess up your “muscle memory.” I have both dimensions in Predator shafts but I am fairly new at pool so would appreciate any comments.

That's like training with a .22 pistol, and going to war with a .45..

Or like practicing with a 18 oz cue, and when the big tournament comes along, pick up a 22oz

Sure, it's the same idea..... but it changes everything...... dynamics in pool are very fickle.

The two shafts probably feel different, hit different, slightly different balance point, tips are different even if they're two Kamui mediums. They are still two different Kamui mediums.

 

[DelawareDogs]

If you watch the local matches Efren plays in the Philippines you will see he has 3 full cues. One break cue and 2 playing cues. I will send a link to the video where he changed cue for a specific shot.

I would love to see where Efren has done this. Never heard of it before.

Links?

 

[BreakEm187]

Can practicing with an 11.5 mm shaft and playing 12.75 mm shaft hurt your play? I understand that the smaller diameter shaft can introduce more spin in your shots and maybe mess up your “muscle memory.” I have both dimensions in Predator shafts but I am fairly new at pool so would appreciate any comments.

Honestly I do it all the time, when I first got my Revo after coming from 314-3, I used to practice with it to warm up but I played with my 314-3 because I just shot better.. For about a little over a year, now I practice with my 11.8 Revo then play with my 12.4 because I just shoot better with it. I’m fairly good enough now to shoot with whatever cue and play my decent game however on certain shots (extreme english, masse, jump or curve) I won’t necessarily trust any cue I’m not familiar with so my confidence in shooting those shots will be dramatically decreased. As far as practicing, I like practicing and equipment used, I believe it’s what you feel is best for your game. Will it hurt you? Most certainly not, and the fact that your practicing alone will certainly help you.. I don’t believe you need to practice on the equipment you play on or with, the practice in itself will make you better.. So if it requires more focus for you to shoot with a smaller tip while practicing go for it, and if you’re not confident with the results after practice switch back to what your better with during a competition. There are many different variances in the game of pool, tables, cloth, balls, rails, etc… If you practice with dirty balls and slow cloth does that mean you can’t play on a brand new diamond? Most certainly not, if you can make a cue ball draw on grass you will definitely make it draw on Simonis

 

[dendweller]

Honestly I do it all the time, when I first got my Revo after coming from 314-3, I used to practice with it to warm up but I played with my 314-3 because I just shot better.. For about a little over a year, now I practice with my 11.8 Revo then play with my 12.4 because I just shoot better with it. I’m fairly good enough now to shoot with whatever cue and play my decent game however on certain shots (extreme english, masse, jump or curve) I won’t necessarily trust any cue I’m not familiar with so my confidence in shooting those shots will be dramatically decreased. As far as practicing, I like practicing and equipment used, I believe it’s what you feel is best for your game. Will it hurt you? Most certainly not, and the fact that your practicing alone will certainly help you.. I don’t believe you need to practice on the equipment you play on or with, the practice in itself will make you better.. So if it requires more focus for you to shoot with a smaller tip while practicing go for it, and if you’re not confident with the results after practice switch back to what your better with during a competition. There are many different variances in the game of pool, tables, cloth, balls, rails, etc… If you practice with dirty balls and slow cloth does that mean you can’t play on a brand new diamond? Most certainly not, if you can make a cue ball draw on grass you will definitely make it draw on Simonis

I do it, but if there is a big difference in how much the 2 cues deflect I think you're kidding yourself if you think it's a good thing. I do it out of boredom.